The nullity of the pretended-assembly at Saint Andrews & Dundee

About this Item

Title
The nullity of the pretended-assembly at Saint Andrews & Dundee
Author
Guthrie, James, 1612?-1661.
Publication
[Leith] :: Printed [by E. Tyler],
in the yeer, 1652.
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Subject terms
Wood, James, -- 1608-1664. -- Vindication of the freedom & lawfulnes of the Generall Assembly begun at St. Andrews and continued at Dundee
Church of Scotland. -- General Assembly -- Controversial literature
Cite this Item
"The nullity of the pretended-assembly at Saint Andrews & Dundee." In the digital collection Early English Books Online 2. https://name.umdl.umich.edu/A85789.0001.001. University of Michigan Library Digital Collections. Accessed May 3, 2024.

Pages

REVIEW.

ALbeit this be more then probable, as appears from the con∣stant tenor of the proceedings of Assemblies in the matter of Commissioners, which was intimated by the Writer, yet I am con∣tent to take what the Author gives. He distinguishes betwixt a scandal, which as to the ground of it is controversi juris, & a scan∣dall which is determinati juris, and makes the scandall of opposing the Publick Resolutions to have been only controversi juris, as to any particular determination thereof by the publick judgment of the Kirk, and thence infers, that the opposers of Publick Resoluti∣ons might have been chosen, this notwithstanding, and admitted to sit as Judges in the Assembly, though not in this particular; and I offer these particulars hereanent: First, That by the Authors own grant, they are still excluded from sitting as Judges in that particular, and therefore as to a competent Judge in this particular, which was the main, if not the all of the Assembly, the Assembly was pre-limited. Secondly, That this was not a busi∣nesse which was controversi juris, but as clearly determinati juris as any thing could be; I mean, that the opposing of the Publick Resolutions, was no fault, but a duty clearly determined by the Church of Scotland; I confesse, men may question any thing, even the clearest truths, but there is no case oftener or more clearly de∣termined by this Kirk, then that of the unwarrantablenesse of joyn∣ing in Counsel or Arms with the Malignant Party, for the defence of the Cause and Kingdome, and of the obligation that lyeth upon Ministers, especially to bear testimony against the same; and there∣fore a notable injury was done, and a grosse pre-limitation com∣mitted, by citing them upon that accompt. Thirdly, suppose it had not yet been determinati juris as to the publick judgment of the Church in an Assembly; yet as to the judgment of the Commissi∣on

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and Presbyteries who did hear and obey them, it was determi∣nati juris, and men were excluded from Elections, and cited to the Assembly there-upon, as upon a thing that was deter∣minati juris: Therfore as there was thereby a pre-limitation in regard of these, who though they were chosen, yet could not sit in that particular, because of the Citation; so also in regard of o∣thers, who were therby excluded from being chosen. 4. If this scan∣dal was not (Determinati Juris) by the Publick Judgment of the Church, the Author would let us know why the Commission in their Warnings at Perth, March 20 by applying many former Acts and Remonstrances of Gen. Assemblies against it, do define it to be so: And what Warrant the Commission had by their trust from the Gen. Assembly, not only to declare the opposers of their Resolutions to be guilty of practices leading to encourage the hearts, and stren∣then the hands of Enemies, in prosecuting their wicked purposes to make faint the hearts, and feeble the hands of Gods People, and to seduce their minds with devisive and separating Counsels and Prin∣ciples, and thereupon, not only to require Presbyteries to censure them, but also to stir up the Civil Magistrate against them. Sure∣ly, if the Commission did all this without any Publick Judgment of the Kirk (that is of former General Assemblies defining these things to be scandal) they did as to these things act without a Commissi∣on, and without Authority, and were beyond their bounds, and led with no spirit of tenderness. The Author did a little while agoe seem to say, That the Commission had no power to cite or to cen∣sure the opposers of any Resolutions made by themselves; and yet here he tels, that these things, as to the Publick Judgement of the Kirk, were controversi juris: And if so, they were as yet but Re∣solutions of their own, and they had no power to cite or censure any, or to give Order to cite or censure any for opposing thereof. That the Publick Resolutions were controversi, and not determi∣nati juris by the publick judgement of the Kirk: That the Com∣mission had no power for citing or censuring any Opposing Resolu∣tions made by themselves; That they gave Order to Presbyteries to censure and cite the opposers of Publick Resolutions, are things that I cannot reconcile. I wil not say but the Authors ingyne may find a shift, but if he extricate these things to the clear capacity of plain and ordinary understandings, is more then at present my weak

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eyes do see. As for that he tells us concerning the rejecting the motion of putting off of some from the List to be Commissioners, who had been referred and cited to the Assembly in the year 1648. I can say little to it, as not knowing it nor the circumstances ther∣of. I beleeve it be an instance of a particular person in a Pres∣bytery giving his judgment anent the listing of another, but when it is all granted it yeelds a great part of the cause, to wit, That these persons could not sit in the Assembly as Judges in that particular; And if I be not mistaken in my conjecture about the persons, I think I may say, if that judicious and pious man who rejected that mo∣tion had been in any fear that these persons would be chosen, be∣like he would have holden his peace, and sufferred the motion to passe uncontrolled. But the Author (if this please not the wri∣ter) desires him to answer what he will for clearing of the Order of the Commission 48. and it will serve aswell the Order of the Commission 51. as to any illegality relating to the Constitution of the Assembly; because, saith he, upon the form both clearly were alike, excepting what will make for the advantage of the latter; and as for the matter in both it was alike, as to the General Assemblies Judgment at the time of the Protestation, and also in reipsa, as he takes upon him to make good. It seems that it doth not please the Author himself very wel, and I think it wil please the Writer much worse, because of the things which I have mentioned, and other things as weighty which may occur to him, as to that of the 48. I have already given clear answers for the writer, or rather vin∣dicated his own, that there was a vast difference both in the form as also in the matter; and that both, as the Assemblies judgement at the time of the Protestation (unless they were not to admit the judgment of former Assemblies in these particulars) as also in re∣ipsa, and he shall but lose his labor, and not be able to make good what he undertakes.

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