An ansvver of a true Christian to the proude challenge of a counterset Catholike. By VVilliam Fulke Doctor in diuinitie
- Title
- An ansvver of a true Christian to the proude challenge of a counterset Catholike. By VVilliam Fulke Doctor in diuinitie
- Author
- Fulke, William, 1538-1589.
- Publication
- Imprinted at London :: By Thomas Vautrollier dwelling in the Blacke Friers,
- 1577.
- Rights/Permissions
-
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- Subject terms
- Rishton, Edward, 1550-1586.
- Allen, William, 1532-1594.
- Catholic Church -- Controversial literature -- Early works to 1800.
- Link to this Item
-
https://name.umdl.umich.edu/A01336.0001.001
- Cite this Item
-
"An ansvver of a true Christian to the proude challenge of a counterset Catholike. By VVilliam Fulke Doctor in diuinitie." In the digital collection Early English Books Online 2. https://name.umdl.umich.edu/A01336.0001.001. University of Michigan Library Digital Collections. Accessed June 18, 2024.
Contents
- title page
- To the Christian Reader.
- The faultes of this impression are thus to be amended: The first figure signifieth the page, the second the line.
-
AN ANSVVER OF A TRVE CHRISTIAN TO A COVNTER∣FAIT CATHOLIKE.
- The proposition of the Aduersarie.
-
AN ANSVVERE TO THE PROPOSITION.
-
The first article conteyneth 3. demandes.
-
1
First I aske of the protestant what Church that was, which conuerted all these cuntries that be now Christian, to the faith of Christ? -
2
And let him shew vnto me, that euer his Church conuerted any people, or lande in the earth, from Idolatrie, or Gen∣tility, or Iudaisme, to the true Religion of Christ, or that this his fayth was taught to any Nation in steede of true Christianity. -
3
Or any Church, but the common Catholike Church to haue don that, and I recant.
-
1
-
The second article conteyneth 4. demandes.
-
1
I aske of him what Church it was, which hath induced the Christian people through the whole worlde, to geue most humble credit in all points, to the holy bookes of the Byble? -
2
VVhat Church hath had the discerning & seuering of them from other writinges of all sortes? -
3
VVhat Church hath had the custodie of them, and most safe∣ly hath preserued them, for the necessary vse of God his people, and from the corruption of aduersaries, as well of Iewes, as heretikes of all sortes? -
4
And let the Protestant declare to me, that their Congrega∣tion hath had from time to time, or euer had right herein, or any other Church, sauing the Catholike Church, and I recant.
-
1
-
The third article conteyneth 5. demandes.
-
1
Shew me why our common knowen Church, did not as well corrupt the text of the Testament, as the true religion conteyned in the same? -
2
Shew me why, she kept not so safely, and faithfully, the true sense of God his word, as she preserued the word it selfe? -
3
Shew me why, we should beleue the Papistes, as you terme them, for the word it self, and rather you Protestants thā them, for the meaning of the word. -
4
Shew me why, you beleued our Church, telling you this to be God his booke, & will not credit her, auouching this to be the true and vndoubted sense of the same booke? -
5
Last of all, Shew me why, you beleued the olde known church, affirming this to be the word of God, and will not beleue her, affirming Luther to be an heretike, shew me good rea∣son or Scripture for these thinges, and I recant.
-
1
-
The fourth article conteyneth 3. demandes.
-
1
I demand, what Church hath mightely gonne through, borne downe, and fully vanquished, all heresies in times past, aswell against the blessed Trinitie, as other Articles of our religion? -
2
And what Church it was, that hath alwayes stande still, and stedfast, whilest all other Congregations, as well of Ar∣rians, as Anabaptistes, Aerians, Nouatians, Vigilan∣tians, Iouinians, and the rest haue decaied. -
3
And if it can be proued that either the Protestants Church or any other Church but ours, hath mightely ouerthrowne these foresayd sectes, and other of all sortes, I recant.
-
1
-
The fiueth article conteyneth 3. demandes.
-
1
Againe, what Church is that, which hath exercised by Christes appointement, Discipline, vpon offendors in all degrees? -
2
And for that purpose, hath continually executed lawes and Canons Ecclesiasticall, with Excommunication, Degrada∣tion, suspension, and such like. -
3
Proue me this geere to procede from Protestants, or from any other Church than the Catholike, and I recant.
-
1
-
The sixth article conteyneth 3. demandes.
-
1
Againe from what Church, did all the solemne ceremonies, and obseruations, all festiuall dayes, all fastes, all distin∣ctions, and varieties of seruice, by diuersities of seasons, and times of the yeare, (proceede.) -
2
From whence did all thinges, yet indifferently for most part, obserued, and allowed, on both sides, from whence did they proceede? -
2
And if it can be proued, that the Protestants Congregation, or any other Church, but ours, hath instituted and ordered all these, or any of these, for the comelinesse and honour of God his house, I recant.
-
1
-
The 7. article conteineth 3. demaundes.
-
1
Further I aske them, what Church that is, which hath brought forth out of her wombe, so many noble personages, of Mar∣tyrs, Confessors, Doctors, Virgines, and holy Sainctes, of all sortes, all which both they and we doe outwardly professe, by the continuance of the Callendare, which yet is vsed euery where, to be Sainctes in heauen. -
2
And if it can be proued by any man of the Protestancy, that these were either, of the Protestants Congregation, or beleefe when they were aliue. -
3
Or canonized and allowed for Sainctes by the Protestantes Church, when they were deade, or by any other Church, then I recant.
-
1
-
The 8. article conteyneth 3. demandes.
-
1
And because Christ as S. Paulesayeth, hath established in his Church some Apostles, some Prechers, some Teachers, and Doctors euen vntill his comming againe, I aske the Protestant, what Church that is, which is able to shew & proue, the continuance and vse of the saide functions euer sence Christes time by plaine accompt of orderly Succession. -
2
And is able to name you by the histories of all ages, the notable personnes of all the forsaide states, in their go∣uernment and ministerie. -
3
And if he can proue vnto me, that their Church hath neuer lacked the same appointed officers, or that any Church or Congregatiō but ours hath kept that charge, thē I recant.
-
1
-
The nynth article may be deuided into nyne demaundes.
-
1
And for the necessary vse and execution of the foresayd of∣fices, they must further be asked, what Sacramentes the Protestants ministred for the space of a thousand yeares togither, in which they confesse their congregations to haue bene neare or else wholy hidden. -
2
VVhat correction they kept and discipline for offenders. -
3
To whome they did preach their Fayth. -
4
How did they reproue heresies? -
5
VVhere did their principall Pastors sit in Iudgement? -
6
VVhere did they gather as in Councells to try the trueth of doubtfull matters? -
7
How might Christian men, iustly offended with some of their brethern, haue sought out your officers or Congregation, to make complainct of him? -
8
Or how if it had liked any man to haue ben baptized of them, or to haue receiued the communion of them, or to haue bene married of them, or to haue ioyned them selues in Fayth and Religion to them, how might I say that secret, contemptible, and vnknowne company, be founde in this case? -
9
If therefore you can shew me, that any man euer sought Iu∣stice or knowledge of trueth, sacrament, or faith, or any helpe of Saluation at the Protestants secret and close con∣gregation, or any other where, but of Gods knowen Catho∣like Church, I recant.
-
1
- The 10. article conteyneth in effect but 2. demandes.
-
The 11. article is so confuse that it is harde to bring it into any certeine num∣bre of demandes.
-
1
Againe I requier of the Protestants to declare by good hi∣stories, or by reasonable likelihoode when the true church, as they compt theirs, decayed? -
2
VVhat yeare the Religion of the Papistes came in and pre∣uayled? -
3
VVhether all their true Church was so soundly sleeping, that none could preach against it as it first entred. -
4
VVHether all nations sodenly and in one yeare were moued to the doctrine of the Papistes, no one man of all their true Church neither preaching, teaching, writing, nor attemp∣ting any thing against it, or making mention of it. -
5
VVhether sodenly all bookes of seruice were altered? -
6
VVhether in a moment, the Masse was saide in steede of other Apostolike Communion? -
7
VVhether men beganne sodenly to praye for the soules de∣parted? -
8
Sodenly required the helpe of Sainctes in heauen? -
9
Sodenly the tongue of common prayers altered? -
10
Tell me what yeare of our Lorde, vnder what Emperour, vn∣der what Pope, by whome these thinges were wrought, vpon what occasion, this marueillous mutation was made? -
11
VVho preached against it, what historie maketh mention of it, who of all your Pastors preached against it, was God his Church so voide of the spirit of Trueth, and strength, that euen then when it most florished, it had none that durst open against such corruption of religion, as it entred in, and when it might soone haue bene repressed? -
12
If it coulde not, shew me then what yeare of the Lorde this mutation was made, and who of all the true preachers did with stand this doctrine? -
13
Or note the name of him that euer first preached any article of our doctrine: and if we note you not by their names, euery one of your Capitaines, and the seuerall errors that they tought and the time, and the yeare when they arose against the former receyued trueth and the Councells in which they were orderly condemned if I, saye this can be done of your side towarde vs, or if we doe it not for im∣proofe of your Church and religion, I recant. -
14
And for that purpose because the gouernment of the By∣shop of Rome is most misliked of them, and yet most noto∣riously knowne by euery historie, let them name the Pope that first brake of the course of his forefathers beleefe, & regiment in any article of fayth or necessary Christian v∣sage, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 12. article hath 3. demandes.
-
1
Item I aske what kinde and order of seruice, or common prayer, what waye of ministring of the sacraments your Church had: before Papistry (as you call it) did pre∣uaile in the worlde? -
2
Shew one booke of Communion or what els you list that was in English, or lacked prayer for the departed, or inuocation of Sainctes in heauen, or that wanted oblation, or sacrifice, or that charged a number to receyue, or els that the preest coulde not consecrate nor say Masse, himselfe, or shew any note in a Communion booke, that the people shoulde take the sacrament for plaine breade, or that they should geue no honor to it, shew this booke or any leafe or line of this booke. -
3
Or any Church or Congregation that euer had any Authen∣ticall seruice but ours, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 13. article hath 2. demaundes.
-
1
Furthermore I requier to know what shoulde be the cause that the Protestants themselues, doe receiue all Byshops, Priestes, Deacons, and other officers spirituall of all sortes of our Catholike church, and doe admit them as men law∣fully and sufficiently ordered, both to preach, minister sa∣craments, and to exercise spirituall iurisdiction no lesse, but rather more, than if they were of their owne ordering, where we of the Catholike church, doe not acknowledge any man of their calling to be any whit more fitte for any spirituall function than other lay men. -
2
Therefore vpon this presumption that they doe not onely admit our ministring of sacraments, but also the lawfull ordering of the ministers for the same, if they can shew me why our church hauing by their owne consent and ap∣prouing lawfull priestes and bishops should not be the true church, I recant.
-
1
-
The 14. article hath 5. demandes.
-
1
Also I demande what furniture or commodity in seruing God the Christianity of any age, or any part of Christen∣dome had euer by your Congregations? -
2
VVhat Churches did you builde for your assemblies and seruice? -
3
VVhat Bishoprickes for the gouernment of the Church did you finde? -
4
VVhat Vniuersities, Schooles, or Colledges, did you euer erect? -
5
Name one Church, not builded in all fashions, as well for the making of the chancells, the forme of the aultars, the vse of the chalices, the signification of the vestiments, as also for the speciall intent of the builders thereof. Name one of them in the whole Church of Christ, either erected for your Faith, Church, & seruice, or not prepared, in all sorts for catholike practises: Proue vnto me that any of all those thinges were euer prouided for any other seruice and Religion then ours, or that they be monuments of a∣ny other Fayth and Church then the common Catholike, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 15. article conteyneth in effect 3. demandes.
-
1
Againe name any one company of men in the Christen world that in all articles of Faith, be in one meaning and belefe. -
2
Or in thinges where they doubt, be contented to submit their seuerall meaninge to the iudgement of their Superiours. -
3
And to that communion and companie wherof they be, name any companie of men agreeing and thus humbly affected in Christes Religion, sauing the blessed fellowship and members of the Catholike communion, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 16. article conteyneth one demande, and one chalenge.
- Furthermore name any one man that is confessed on both sides by the iudgement of the world, to be holy and learned, & a member of the true Church, in what age soeuer you list sence Christes time, and proue him to haue bene in all ar∣ticles of Faith of the Protestants meaninge.
- Yea if I bring not the aduersaries them selues to acknowledge in the ende him to be wholy against their doctrine in di∣uers of articles of great importance, and therefore that he coulde not be of their church, I recant.
-
The 17. Article conteyneth 5. demandes.
-
1
I aske of them whether the Lutherans, Zuinglians, Illirians, Caluenistes, Confessionistes, Swenkefeldians, Anabaptistes and such like, be all of one Church? -
2
And if either they can proue vnto me, that these, being of such diuersitie in faith and religion make one Church. -
3
Or that each of their sects may giue saluation to their folow∣ers, being so disagreable, one with an other in high points of our Religion. -
4
Or that I should beleue all these rather then the Catholike Church, or one of these more then another, all making such a bold chalenge of the truth and Gospell. -
5
Let the Protestants of all these kindes put their heades toge∣ther, and shew me a reason of these thinges, and with all, let them among them selues agree, to what sorte of these sectes they woulde haue me, and I will recant.
-
1
- The 18. article hath but one demande.
- The 19. article hath but one demande.
-
The 20. article hath 3. demandes.
-
1
Likewise, if any man can proue vnto me, that either those be not true Christians, which by the consent of nations, and by olde prescription of so manye yeares as be sith their conuersion, be and euer hath bene called Catholikes. -
2
Or that those can be any true members, or children of the Catholike church, which do mislike and mistrust so farre-forth these holy names, as wel of Church, as Catholike that they haue turned thē into Congregations, and Gospellers, and Protestants, and such like. -
3
If therefore any thing can proue our true Church better than the honorable name of Catholike, or more condemne them to be out of Christes church thā that not only the Christiā worlde geueth it not to them, but they in a name, do refuse the same them selues, then do I recant.
-
1
- The 21. article conteyneth but one demande.
-
The 22. article, although it be very confuse, yet it conteyneth in effect 3. demandes.
-
1
I aske also whether any man for the space of that 1000.yeres of blindenes could be saued, out of that secrete and small Church, which they say was the true Church, if they aun∣swer me, there might be some saued, with our Sacraments, and in the Communion or fellowship of the Papistes out of the Protestants Church, then there was a way to heauen, out of Gods Church: if they say that none could be saued by our Sacraments out of their close Church, then all men yong and old perished for those yeares without any hope of mercy, because they could not vnite them selues, and be incorporate to that company and Congregation, whereof they neuer neither hearde, nor coulde by any meanes sur∣mise. Therefore let any man aliue proue vnto me that ei∣ther any man could out of the true Church be saued. -
2
Or that any other company could be knowne for the true and onely Church but our common Catholike societie. -
3
Or that all men were damned for a thousand yeares togither because they coulde not finde, nor surmise of any other Church, then that which practiseth all holy functions, which Christ left for our saluation in the world, and I re∣cant.
-
1
-
The 23. article conteyneth 2. demandes.
-
1
Againe shew me any Church, or imagin if you can by good reason, a church of Christ in which there is no gathering together for preaching, no spirite of prophesying, no rodde of correction, no order of ministring nor any spirituall functiō that can be named, proue me that there should be a true Church for a thousand yeares together, and lacked all these thinges. -
2
And withall, that there was an other vntrue Church which for those many dayes onely practised to the saluation of many, all these offices: and geue me a good reason why this Church, that alwayes hath had these thinges should be a false Church, and the other that wanted them, to be a true Church, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 24. article conteyneth 10. demandes.
-
1
Moreouer let any man shew how that Church can be the pil∣ler of truth, which durst not for a thousand yeares clayme either preaching of Gods word or ministring of Sacramēts or shew her selfe against falshood or superstition. -
2
Let any man shew that all giftes of the spirite, and functions of the holy Ghost haue bene taken from her, a thousand yeares togither, and onely practised to the peoples vse by an aduouterous Church. -
3
Let it be declared, how the gates of hell haue not preuailed, or Christes promise and warrant for her, not bene voyd & frustrate, if a bastard Church exercising idolatry, as they say, hath spoyled the true Church of all holy actions, and the whole gouernment, and the whole name of Christiani∣tie, almost euer since Christes tyme. -
4
Let me see therefore howe the onely dearling and spouse of Christ shoulde be neglected of him so long. -
5
Let the aduersarie shew that the Church shoulde euer by superstition and falshood commit adultery or be deuorced from him. -
6
Or that Christ should euer want his spouse in earth. -
7
Or that he shoulde be a heade either without a bodie. -
8
Or such an vnknowne and small bodie. -
9
Or that Christes only kingdom should become so cōtemptible. -
10
Or that his spouse in earth shoulde euer lacke the singular prerogatines of Gods spirite, shewe me these thinges, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 25. article hath 2. demandes.
-
1
Shew me that the Church, which ought to be a Christian mans staye, in all troubles and tempestes of doctrine might become so hidde or so close that no man coulde finde her. -
2
Or so harteles that she coulde succour no man nor instruct any man in his doubt of conscience or distresse of Faith, proue me that there maye be such a decay of Gods spirite, trueth, and Church, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 26. article conteyneth in effect but 3. demandes.
-
1
Shew me againe whether any man of yeares may be saued, except he beleue the Catholike Church? -
2
And that is it which hath in the face of all the worlde pra∣ctised preaching: the conuersion of nations to the obe∣dience of the Gospell: that hath alwaies had the mini∣string of sacraments, the hearing of matters in controuer∣sie, power Iudiciarie in Ecclesiasticall causes, the orderly succession of Byshops, vniformitie in solemne ceremonies, vnity in faith, that hath in her selfe all holy functions of the spirite, as working of miracles, remission of sinnes, the true sence and interpretation of Gods word that is bewti∣fied by the diuersitie of states, commended by Christ in the Gospell, as with Virgines, with Martyrs, with Confessors, and the rest. -
3
Proue vnto me that this is not the true Church, or that we be not bound to obey this Church and no other in all contro∣uersies, and doubtes raysed either by the difficultie of the Scripture, or by the vayne contention & pride of heresie, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 27. article conteyneth 5. demandes.
-
1
Moreouer let any man proue vnto me, that the true & onely Church of God, may at any time be voyd of God his spi∣rite. -
2
Or falsely interprete any sentence of holy Scripture. -
3
Or induce any error among the people. -
4
Or approue any vnprofitable or hurtefull vsage among Christians. -
5
Or that she suffereth any man, damnably abusing her religi∣on, without open reprehension thereof, proue any of these thinges, and I recant.
-
1
-
The 28. article conteyneth 3. demandes.
-
1
If vnitie in Faith, austeritie of life, sharpe discipline, great penance, much fasting, large almes, godly deuotion, obedi∣ence to higher powers, grauitie and constancie in all cases, be not the signes of the true Church. -
2
Or be not more in our Church then in their Congregation, I recant. -
3
But if discorde in religion, licentiousnes in lyuing, contempt of Discipline, reiecting of penance, lothesomnesse of fa∣sting, lacke of zeale and deuotion, disobedience to Magi∣strates, sacriledge, apostacie, breach of vowes, vnlaw∣full lustes, wantonnesse in all life and maners, if these thinges, I say, agree not better to the Protestants, than the Catholikes, or if these be not the plaine signes and fructes of a false church, and doctrine, I recant.
-
1
-
The 29. article conteyneth 8. demandes.
-
1
Let any Protestant in the worlde, proue vnto me, that their church coulde rightly be called Catholike, which was so particular, that no man aliue coulde name a place where any such church was. -
2
Or that it might be called holy, which neuer had Baptisme, or other sacramentes, to sanctifie any of her followers withall. -
3
Or that it should be one, which as soone as it grew vp in the world, was diuided into so many sundry sectes. -
4
Or that it might be called Apostolike, which could neuer coūt by orderly sucession from any Apostle, or Apostolike man. -
5
Or the secret, base, contemptible, defaced, and disordered Congregation, was euer of that maiestie, that it might re∣quire the obedience of all Nations. -
6
Or that it was euer able to gather generall Councels. -
7
Or exercise Discipline. -
8
Or that these names, proper by scripture and Doctors of the true Church, coulde be euer chalenged, by any right to their saide Congregation. -
1
Corpus Christi. -
2
Sponsa Christi. -
3
Vinci dilecta Christo. -
4
Columba speciosa. -
5
Domus Dei. -
6
Columna veritatis. -
7
Ciuitas Dei. -
8
Ciuitas supra montem posita. -
9
Hortus conclusus. -
10
Fons signatus, -
11
Sponsa Agni. -
12
Mulier amicta Sole. -
13
Habitatio fratrum in vnum. -
14
Mons Dei mons pinguis. -
15
Sacra anchora. -
16
Vinea Domini. -
17
Terra viuentium. -
18
Regina in vestitu deaurato circundata varietatibus. -
19
Ecclesia magna. -
21
Archa Noe. -
22
Tabernaculum altissimi. -
23
Ager & area Dei. -
24
Mater fidelium. -
25
Nutrix Christianorum. -
26
Ecclesia orthodoxa. -
27
Vna, Sancta, Catholica. -
29
Vxor de latere Christi sicut Eua de latere Adam. -
30
Domus Pacis. -
31
Domus Refugij. -
32
Domus Veritatis. -
33
Societas Sanctorum.
-
1
-
1
-
The first article conteyneth 3. demandes.