The papers which passed at Nevv-Castle betwixt His sacred Majestie and Mr Alex: Henderson concerning the change of church-government. Anno Dom. 1646.

For M^r. Alex: Henderson.

His MAJESTIES first Paper.

Mr. Henderson,

I Know very well what a great dis∣advantage it is for Me, to maintaine an Argument of Divinity with so able and learned a Man as your self, it being your, not My profession; which re∣ally was the cause that made Me desire to heare some learned man argue My Opinion with you, of whose abilities I might be con∣fident, that I should not be led into an Er∣rour, for want of having all which could be said, layed open unto Me: For indeed, My humour is such, that I am still partiall for that side, which I imagine suffers for the weaknesse of those that maintaine it; alwaies thinking that equall Champions would cast the bal∣lance on the other part; Yet since that you (thinking that it will save time) desire to goe another way, I shall not contest with you in it, but treating you as My Physitian, give you

leave to take your owne way of cure; onely I thought fit to warne you, lest if you, (not I) should be mistaken in this, you would be faine (in a manner) to begin anew.

Then know that from my Infancy I was blest with the King my Fathers love, which, I thanke God, was an unvaluable happinesse to me, all his daies, and among all his cares for my education, his chief was, to settle me right in Religion; in the true Knowledge of which, he made himself so eminent to all the World, that, I am sure, none can call in que∣stion the brightnesse of his Fame in that parti∣cular, without shewing their own ignorant base malice: He it was, who laid in Me the Grounds of Christianity, which to this day I have been constant in; so that whether the worthinesse of My Instructor be considered, or the not few yeares that I have been setled in My Prin∣ciples; it ought to be no strange thing, if it be found no easie worke, to make me alter them: and the rather, that hitherto, I have (accor∣ding to Saint Paul's rule, Rom. 14. 22.) been happy in Not condemning my selfe, in that thing which I allow: Thus having shewed you how, it remaines, to tell you what, I believe, in relation to these present miserable distra∣ctions.

No one thing made Me more reverence the Reformation of My Mother, the Church of

England, than that it was done (according to the Apostles defence, Act. 24. 18.) neither with multitude, nor with tumult, but legally and or∣derly; and by those, whom I conceive to have onely the reforming power; which with many other inducements, made Me alwayes confi∣dent that the worke was very perfect, as to Essentials; of which number Church-Govern∣ment being undoubtedly one, I put no que∣stion, but that would have been likewise alte∣red, if there had been cause; which opinion of mine, was soone turned into more than a confidence, when I perceived that in this par∣ticular (as I must say of all the rest) we re∣tained nothing but according as it was de∣duced from the Apostles to be the constant universall custome of the Primitive Church; and that it was of such consequence, as by the alteration of it, we should deprive our selves of a lawfull Priesthood, and then, how the Sa∣craments can be duly Administred, is easie to judge: These are the principall Reasons, which make me believe that Bishops are necessary for a Church, and, I think, sufficient for Me (if I had no more) not to give My consent for their expulsion out of England; but I have another obligation, that to my particular, is a no lesse tie of Conscience, which is, My Coronation Oath: Now if (as S. Paul saith, Rom. 14. 23.) He that doubteth is damned if he eat, what can I

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expect, if I should, not onely give way know∣ingly to My Peoples sinning, but likewise be perjured My selfe?

Now consider, ought I not to keep my selfe from presumptuous sinnes? and you know who sayes, What doth it profit a man, though he should gaine the whole World, and lose his owne Soule? Wherefore my constant maintenance of Epis∣copacy in England, (where there was never any other Government since Christianity was in this Kingdome) Methinks, should be rather commended than wondered at; My Consci∣ence directing Me to maintaine the Lawes of the Land; which being onely my endeavours at this time, I desire to know of you, what warrant there is in the Word of God, for Subjects to endeavour to force their Kings Conscience? or to make him alter Lawes against his will? If this be not my present case, I shall be glad to be mistaken; or, if my Judgment in Religion hath been misled all this time, I shall be wil∣ling to be better directed: till when, you must excuse Me, to be constant to the Grounds which the King my Father taught me.

Newcastle, May 29. 1646.

C. R.

For His Majestie, Mr. Alexander Henderson's first Paper.

SIR,

1. IT is Your Majesties royall goodness, and not my merit, that hath made your Majesty to conceive any opinion of my abilities; which (were they worthy of the smallest testimony from your Majesty) ought in all duty to be improved for your Majesties satisfaction. And this I in∣tended in my coming here at this time, by a free, yet modest expression of the true motives and in∣ducements which drew my mind to the dislike of Episcopall Government, wherein I was bred in my younger years at the University. Like as I did apprehend that it was not your Majesties purpose to have the Question disputed by Divines on both sides; which I would never (to the wronging of the cause) have undertaken alone; and which sel∣dome or never hath proved an effectuall way, for finding of truth, or moving the minds of Men to relinquish their former Tenents, Dum res transit à judicio in affectum; witness the Polemicks be∣tween the Papists and us, and among our selves, about the matter now in hand, these many yeares past.

2. Sir, when I consider your Majesties education under the hands of such a Father, the length of time wherein Your Majesty hath been setled in

your principles of Church-Government; the Ar∣guments which have continually in private and publique, especially of late at Oxford, filled your Majesties eares for the Divine Right thereof; your Coronation Oath; and divers State-reasons which your Majesty doth not mention: I doe not wonder, nor think it any strange thing, that your Majesty hath not at first given place to a con∣trary impression. I remember that the famous Joannes Picus Mirandula proveth by irrefra∣gable Reasons (which no rationall man will con∣tradict) That no man hath so much power o∣ver his own understanding, as to make himself believe what he will, or to think that to be true which his reason telleth him is false; much lesse is it possible for any man to have his rea∣son commanded by the will, or at the pleasure of another.

2. It is a true saying of the School-men, Volun∣tas imperat intellectui quoad exercitium, non quoad specificationem, Mine owne will, or the will of another may command me to thinke upon a matter; but no will or command can constraine me to determine otherwise then my reason tea∣cheth me. Yet Sir, I hope your Majesty will acknowledge, (for your Paper professeth no lesse) that according to the saying of Ambrose, Non est pudor ad meliora transire, It is neither sinne nor shame to change to the better: Symmachus in one of his Epistles (I thinke to the Emperour

Theodosius and Valentinian) alleageth all those motives, from education, from prescription of time, from worldly prosperity, and the flourish∣ing condition of the Roman Empire, and from the Lawes of the Land, to perswade them to con∣stancy in the ancient Pagan profession of the Ro∣mans, against the imbracing of the Christian Faith. The like reasons were used by the Jewes for Moses against Christ; and may be used both for Popery and for the Papacy it selfe, against the reformation of Religion & Church-Govern∣ment; and therefore can have no more strength against the Change now, than they had in former times.

3. But your Majesty may perhaps say, That this is petitio principii, and nothing else but the begging of the Question; and I confesse it were so, if there can be no Reasons brought for a Re∣formation or Change; Your Majesty reverences the Reformation of the Church of England, as being done legally and orderly, and by those who had the Reforming Power: and I doe not deny, but it were to be wisht, that Religion where there is need, were alwaies Reformed in that manner, and by such power, and that it were not commit∣ted to the Prelats, who have greatest need to be reformed themselves, not left to the multitude, whom God stirreth up when Princes are negli∣gent: Thus did Jacob reforme his owne Fami∣ly, Moses destroyed the golden Calfe, the good

Kings of Judah reformed the Church in their time: but that such Reformation hath been per∣fect, I cannot admit. Asa tooke away Idolatry, but his Reformation was not perfect; for Jeho∣saphat removed the high Places, yet was not his Reformation perfect, for it was Hezekiah that brake the brasen Serpent, and Josiah destroyed the Idol-Temples, who therefore beareth this E∣logie, That like unto him there was no King before him. It is too well knowne that the Re∣formation of K. Henry 8. was most imperfect in the Essentials of Doctrine, Worship, and Govern∣ment; And although it proceeded by some de∣grees afterward, yet the Government was never reformed, the head was changed, Dominus non Dominium; and the whole limbs of the Anti∣christian Hierarchy retained, upon what snares and temptations of Avarice and Ambition, the great Enchanters of the Clergy, I need not ex∣presse. It was a hard saying of Romanorum Malleus Grosted of Lincolne, That Reforma∣tion was not to be expected, nisi in ore gladii cru∣entandi: yet this I may say, that the Laodicean lukewarmnesse of Reformation here, hath been matter of continued complaints to many of the Godly in this Kingdom; occasion of more schisme and separation then ever was heard of in any o∣ther Church; and of unspeakable griefe and sor∣row to other Churches, which God did blesse with greater purity of Reformation. The glory of this

great worke we hope is reserved for your Ma∣jesty, that to your comfort and everlasting fame the praise of godly Josiah may be made yours; which yet will be no dispraise to your royall Fa∣ther, or Edward 6. or any other religious Prin∣ces before you; none of them having so faire an opportunity as is now by the supreme providence put into your Royall hands. My soule trembleth to think and to foresee, what may be the event, if this opportunity be neglected. I will neither use the words of Mordecay, Esth. 4. 14. nor what Savanarola told another Charles, because I hope better things from your Majesty.

4. To the Argument brought by your Ma∣jesty (which I believe none of your Doctors, had they been all about you, could more briefly and yet so fully and strongly have expressed) [That nothing was retained in this Church but ac∣cording as it was deduced from the Apostles to the constant universall practise of the Pri∣mitive Church; and that it was of such con∣sequence, as by the alteration of it, We should deprive our selves of the lawfulnesse of Priest∣hood (I thinke your Majesty meanes a lawfull Ministry) and then how the Sacraments can be administred, is easie to judge.] I humbly offer these considerations: First, what was not in the times of the Apostles, cannot be deduced from them: We say in Scotland, It cannot be brought But, that is not the Ben; but (not to insist now in

a Litourgy, and things of that kind) there was no such Hierarchy, no such difference betwixt a Bishop and a Presbyter, in the times of the A∣postles, and therefore it cannot thence be dedu∣ced; for I conceive it to be as cleare as if it were written with a Sun-beame, that Presbyter and Bishop are to the Apostles one and the same thing, no majority, no inequality or difference of office, power, or degree betwixt the one and the other, but a meer identity in all. 2. That the Apostles intending to set downe the Offices and Officers of the Church, and speaking so often of them, and of their gifts and duties, and that, not upon occasion, but of set purpose; doe neither ex∣presse nor imply any such Pastor or Bishop as hath power over other Pastors, although it be true, that they have distinctly and particularly exprest the office, gifts, and duties of the meanest Offi∣cers, such as Deacons. 3. That in the Ministery of the New Testament there is a comely, beauti∣full, and divine order and subordination; one kind of Ministers both ordinary and extraor∣dinary being placed in degree and dignity one be∣fore another, as the Apostles first, the Evange∣lists, Pastors, Doctors, &c. in their owne ranks: bnt we cannot find in Offices of the same kind, that one hath majority of power, or priority of degree before another; no Apostle above other Apostles (unlesse in morall respects) no Evange∣list above other Evangelists; of Deacon above

other Deacons; why then a Pastor above other Pastors? In all other sorts of Ministers ordinary and extraordinary a parity in their owne kind, only in the office of Pastor an inequality. 4. That the whole power and all the parts of the Mini∣stry, which are commonly called, The power of Order and Jurisdiction, are by the Apostles de∣clared to be common to the Presbyter and Bishop: And that, Mat. 15. 16, 17. the gradation in mat∣ter of Discipline or Church censures, is from one, to two, or more; and if he shall neglect them, tell it to the Church; he saith not, tell it to the Bishop: there is no place left to a retrogradation from more to one, were he never so eminent. If these considerations doe not satisfie, your Majesty may have more, or the same further cleared.

5. Secondly, I doe humbly desire Your Majesty to take notice of the fallacy of that Argument, from the practice of the Primitive Church, and the universall Consent of the Fathers. It is the Argument of the Papists for such traditions as no Orthodox Divine will admit. The Law and Testimony must be the Rule. We can have no certaine knowledge of the practice universall of the Church for many years; Eusebius the prime Historian confesseth so much: the learned Jose∣phus Scaliger testifieth, That from the end of the Acts of the Apostles untill a good time after, no certainty can be had from Ecclesiasticall Authors about Church matters. It is true, Diotrephes

sought the preheminence in the Apostles times, and the mystery of iniquity did then begin to work; and no doubt in after-times some puffed up with Ambition, and others overtaken with weak∣nesse, endevoured alteration of Church Govern∣ment, but that all the learned and godly of those times consented to such a change as is talked of afterwards, will never be proved.

6. Thirdly, I will never think that Your Ma∣jesty will deny the lawfulnesse of a Ministery, and the due administration of the Sacraments in the Reformed Churches, which have no Diocesan Bi∣shops, sith it is not only manifest by Scripture, but a great many of the strongest Champions for Episcopacy, doe confesse, that Presbyters may or∣daine other Presbyters; and that Baptisme ad∣ministred by a private Person, wanting a publick Calling, or by a Midwife, and by a Presbyter, al∣though not ordained by a Bishop, are not one and the same thing.

7. Concerning the other Argument taken from Your Majesties Coronation Oath; I confesse, that both in the taking and keeping of an Oath (so sa∣cred a thing is it, and so high a point of Religion) much tendernesse is required: and farre be it from us, who desire to observe our owne Solemne Oath, to presse Your Majesty with the violation of Yours. Yet Sir, I will crave your leave, in all humblenesse and sincerity to lay before Your Ma∣jesties eyes this one thing, (which perhaps might

require a larger discourse) that although no hu∣mane authority can dispense with an Oath, Quia Religio juramenti pertinet ad forum Divi∣num; yet in some cases it cannot be denied but the obligation of an Oath ceaseth: As when we swear homage and obedience to our Lord and Su∣periour, who afterwards ceaseth to be our Lord and Superiour; for then the formall cause of the Oath is taken away, and therefore the obligation▪ Sublata causa tollitur effectus; sublato relato, tollitur Correlatum. Or when any Oath hath a speciall reference to the benefit of those to whom I make the promise, if we have their desire or consent, the obligation ceaseth; because all such Oaths from the nature of the thing, doe include a condition. When the Parliaments of both King∣domes, have covenanted for the abolishing or altering of a Law, Your Majesties Oath doth not binde You, or Your Conscience to the observing of it; otherwise no Lawes could be altered by the Legislative Power. This I conceive hath been the ground of removing Episcopall Government in Scotland, and of removing the Bishops out of the Parliament of England. And I assure my selfe, that Your Majesty did not intend at the ta∣king of Your Oath, that although both Houses of Parliament should find an alteration necessary, although (which God Almighty avert) you should lose your selfe, and your Posterity, and Crowne, that you would never consent to the abolishing of

such a Law. If Your Majesty still object, that the matter of the Oath is necessary & immutable; that doth not belong to this, but to the former Ar∣gument.

8. I have but one word more concerning Your Piety to Your Royall Father, and teacher of happy Memory, with which Your Majesty does conclude. Your Majesty knows that King James never ad∣mitted Episcopacy upon Divine Right; That His Majesty did sweare and subscribe to the Do∣ctrine, Worship, and Discipline of the Church of Scotland; that in the Preface of the latter Edi∣tion of Basilicon Doron, His Majesty gives an honourable testimony to those that loved better the simplicity of the Gospel, than the pomp and Ceremonies of the Church of England, and that he conceived the Prelats to savour of the Popish Hierarchy, and that (could his Ghost now speake to your Majesty) He would not advise your Ma∣jesty to run such hazards for those Men who will chuse rather to pull downe your Throne with their own ruine, than that they perish alone. The Lord give your Majesty a wise and discerning Spirit to chuse that in time which is right.

June 3. 1646.