A treatise of the nature of a minister in all its offices to which is annexed an answer to Doctor Forbes concerning the necessity of bishops to ordain, which is an answer to a question, proposed in these late unhappy times, to the author, What is a minister?
About this Item
Title
A treatise of the nature of a minister in all its offices to which is annexed an answer to Doctor Forbes concerning the necessity of bishops to ordain, which is an answer to a question, proposed in these late unhappy times, to the author, What is a minister?
Author
Lucy, William, 1594-1677.
Publication
London :: Printed by Thomas Ratcliffe for the author, and are to be sold by Edward Man ...,
1670.
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Subject terms
Hooker, Thomas, 1586-1647. -- Survey of the summe of church-discipline.
Forbes, John, 1593-1648. -- Irenicum.
Church of England -- Clergy.
Clergy -- Office.
Cite this Item
"A treatise of the nature of a minister in all its offices to which is annexed an answer to Doctor Forbes concerning the necessity of bishops to ordain, which is an answer to a question, proposed in these late unhappy times, to the author, What is a minister?." In the digital collection Early English Books Online. https://name.umdl.umich.edu/A49441.0001.001. University of Michigan Library Digital Collections. Accessed May 3, 2024.
Pages
descriptionPage 266
SECT. III. Another Objection drawn from the Councel of
Carthage, answered.
ANother Ojection may be, that the Councel of Carthage
before cited; mentions the laying on the Book by two
Bishops upon the head and shoulders of the Bishop to be Conse∣crated,
and therefore that is necessary; I answer that I much
reverence that Councel in which was St. Augustine, and divers
other B••shops famous for learning and piety in their Generations;
but yet as I have said before, this was never practiced any re∣markable
time, as sundry Doctors in the Church of Rome ob∣serve,
and again it is impossible to be essential because not Aposto∣lical
and that because the Holy Bible, and that highest part of
it the New Testament was not writ when Bishops and Priests were
Ordained, it is therefore worth our marking, that there is a
difference in the decrees of Councels concerning Doctrine and
Discipline, or Ceremonies of the Church in a point of Doctrine,
they shew in what sence they understand such and such a Con∣clusion,
but in the other they set down what is to be practiced
to preserve Orders and decency in those Churches where they
have to do; and indeed there can be no more required of obedi∣ence
than in quiet and setled times, in which times only Coun∣cels
can be Congregated, and in other times as things necessary
by Divine right must always be kept close unto, so what is only
humane may be spared. it is not possible for humane power to
add any thing of absolute necessity to Divine justice which can∣not
be altered; now of this Nature in this Ceremony of the Gos∣pel
as is most apparent. For first the Pontifical varyes extreamly
much in this very point from the Councel of Carthage, not on∣ly
in adding to it that the Book must be open which is not expres∣ed
in Carthage but by Changing those few Circumstances which
are particularized there, as first where it is said in Carthage that
two Bishops shall lay on the Gospel, the Ponti••ical saith, that
descriptionPage 267
it must be done by the Consecrator and the assisting Bishop. An∣tonius
is peremptory out of Hostiensis that it must be done by
three in the third part of his sums Tit. 14. Cap. 16. Sect. 9. to∣wards
the end of that Section, secondly where the Councel saith
that the Book shall be put upon the head and the neck of the
Consecrated Bishop. The Ponti••ical saith super scapulam & cervi∣cem
upon the shoulders and the neck, thirdly whereas the Councel
saith (uno fundente benedictionem) one pouring out the blessing;
they make them altogether to give it in these words, Receive
the Holy Ghost, Antonius where before is peremptory that three
must do it; thus you see how in the Doctrine of the Church of
Rome the Compiler of that Book is prefer'd before that ever to
to be honoured Councel consisting of above two hundred Bi∣shops;
amongst which were many most eminent men and indeed
the Popes legates likewise, although they could only keep up his
pretensions to it, not prevail for his universal superiority, besides
this I observe in the Ceremoniale Romanum put out by Pope Leo
the tenth and licensed by him in the second Sect. litera Charta
(as the Printer calls it) or as we, fol. 11. the Ordinator and
the rest put the Book only upon the neck of the Elect Pope when
he is made Bishop; so that here in these Records of the Church of
Rome, besides these other practices of Chaplaines or ••eacons be∣fore
mentioned we find a great liberty taken in varying from the
Councel of Carthage; and amongst themselves the Councel ap∣pointing
the Book to be put upon the head and neck,
the Pontifical upon the shoulders and the neck, the Ce∣remonial
names only the neck which evidently makes it appear
that this Clause hath been looked upon only as an humane or∣dinance,
subject to Change and alteration, but the other of
imposition of Hands, as Divine which no humane power could
abrogate or alter: Give me leave since I am in the canvasing of
the Canon to make one observation for the further illustration
of a Conclusion before treated of, that is the Phrase (uno fun∣dente
benedictionem,) the blessing is given by one, when the
Pontifical makes it to be given at the same time by many, and
so divers Doctors in the Church of Rome, which certainly may
be very confused one begining sooner and so ending, but to
avoid that, the Ceremonial before cited saith, that the Conse∣crator
with the rest of the Bishops saith, Accipe Spiritum San∣ctum,
descriptionPage 268
receive the Holy Ghost, but he adds the Consecrator
alte, the rest submisse, he with a loud voice, the rest with a
soft; and now consider that one is called the Consecrator as
surely he must be, and the rest do but come into his assistance to
lay on their Hands in token of the assurance of it, and therefore
they speak lowly and humbly, he that is the Consecrator doth
Consecrate, the rest come in as assistants and to this purpose
they speak lowly and submissly, and to this purpose Vasques af∣ter
a long discourse about this Question concludes Disp. 240.
Number 65. that it is enough that one speaks the words and
lays on his Hands likewise, where we may observe by him that
the Consecrators words are, that they call the form of Consecra∣tion,
we may say conveigh the Consecrating virtue, this be∣ing
received in all Christian Churches but the other unconstant
amongst themselves. Another Argument may be objected a∣gainst
us of the Church of England who use a giving of the Bible
to the Bishop who is to be Ordained in our Consecration.
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