The answer to William Penn Quaker, his book, entituled, The new witnesses proved old hereticks Wherein he is proved to be an ignotant [sic] spater-brain'd Quaker, who knows no more what the true God is, nor his secret decrees, then one of his coach-horses doth, nor so much; for the oxe knoweth his owner, and the ass his masters scrip, but Penn doth not know his maker, as is manifest by the Scriptures, which may inform the reader, if he mind the interpretation of Scripture in the discourse following. I. That God was in the forme, image and likeness of mans bodily shape, as well as his soul from eternity. ... VIII. What is meant by the armour of God, the wilderness, and the wilde beasts I fought with in the wilderness. / By Lodowick Muggleton.

CHAP. XVI. (Book 16)

Answer, That Iohn Reeve did not leave the world in torment of spirit, as hath bin said unto you and unto ••thers; but he left the world in as much Peace of minde, and confidence in the Com••is∣sion of God that spake unto him, as could be exprest by man, as some can witness at this day that are alive: but some that saw his departure, that closed up ••is ••yes, and heard his l••st words, are dead since: but I l ok upon it but a vain thing for us to v n∣dicate our selves from slanders, lies and evil repor••s, for there is no stopping the mouths of Serpents: lik••wise, you say ir is to be feared, that miserable Muggleton will have a w rse death then breaking his neck. I kno•• it would be the joy of the Quakers hearts if such a thing sh••u••d befal me: but God hath preserved me from all casualt es f••om my birth to t••is day: I never had no broken bone, sprain, bursenness, diseases of b dy, nor no defect in nature to this day: and I do not question but the good Provi∣denc•• of God will preserve me from all Accidents of Nature to my lives end: but from pers••cu••ion and abuses from wicked men I ca••not promise my s••lf t•• be s••cure, for mine enemies are more th•••• I can number f•••• multitu••e, but the Law d••th preserve me from them, therefore I do ye•• live in ••he ••a••d of the living, and am made able to withstand the malice and hatr•• of all mine ene∣mies: Besides, what would it advantage you Quak••rs and o∣thers that are under my sentence, if such misfortune should hap∣pen unto me, it might be some comfort to o•••• r•• that cometh af∣ter you, but it will advantage you nothing at a l: for what I have said concerning you, and several others of your mighry men, i•• shall stand like a rock that cannot be moved, and like the Law•• of the Medes and Persians that cannot be alte••ed, de••iver your s••lves

if you can, And as for your desiring to pass the just sentence of Impostor and Counterfeit upon us and our Commission: To this I say, it is not proper to call a man Impostor, except a man had made a professi••n of truth before, which Reeve nor Muggleton ne∣ver did, because we never did know the truth until about twenty yea••s ago, except you do count the Puritane Religion was the truth indeed: I was a zealous ••uritane before, and I did fall f••om that Profession to an honest just life between man and man, and if that was an Impost••r, then thousands and many of you Q••akers you••selves are Imposto••s: for I have known many ••f you did fall from be ng purita•••• to be R••nters, and from Ran∣te••s to Quak rs, so th••t you Q••••kers are double Impostors ••y t••is ••u••e: But this I say, you Quakers cannot properly be Im∣postors, because y••u never were i•• truth, nor are not in truth now. But ••f I should fall f••om this faith I have declared ab v•• 20 years, then sh••u••d I be an Impostor indeed: likewise, whoever ha••h be∣lieved our d••c••••in•• of truth which we have declared, and hath made a profession 〈…〉〈…〉wn it, and to love and justifie it, and shall aft rwa••ds fall 〈◊〉〈◊〉, and question the truth of it, and rebel a∣gainst it, s••ch a•• Impos••ors ind ed, for no man can properly be said to b•• an I••po••tor, but he that falleth from a true Prophet, true A••ostle, or true Minister of Christ; but there is never a man in ••he w••rl•• at t••is day that can become Impostors, but such as h••ve mad•• a profession of Reeve and Muggletons Commission, and f••••l ••••om it, as af••••esaid, such indeed are Impostors, and none else, s•• that the R••ader may s••e the gro••s ignorance of learned Penn t•••• Q•• ke•••• that doth not know wh•• is an Impostor and who is n••••.

Aga••n, I understand t•• t Penn ••ath b••en brought up to L••arn∣ing at the Unive••s••ty o•• ear••h, to reade old Hi••••••••i•••• and old Au∣t••o••s Iudg••ments c••••c••r••i••g ••er••sies, an•• to fin••e out t•••• thoughts, purp••s•••• an•• int••nts of mans hea ts, w••en they are ••∣p••n••d ••y t••e ••••to s: b•••• tha•• th s••ul w•••• th•••• •••••• before, ••s P••nn 〈◊〉〈◊〉 I n••g••••••••, so that no th ughts, p••••p••s••s ••or intents of

the mans heart could be found when the body was Anatomized, so that Penn concludes that the soul cannot die but is immortal, else the thoughts, purposes and intents of a mans heart might be found when his body i•• cut up; this is Penn the Quakers faith, and he is not ashamed of it: but who would have th••ught that learned Penn should have discovered such ignorance and blind∣ness of minde, for he hath exprest great ignorance in quoting so many Popish Authors opinions and judgements upon heresie, which knew not the truth themselves; but do you Quakers in∣deed believe that Augustine, Eusebius, Socrates the Philosopher, and many others you have named. were endued with an infal∣lible Spirit, or had any Commission from God to be Iudge what was heresie and what was truth in their time: if so, why then do you Q••akers revolt from those old Authors practice and opi∣nion as to your doctrine.

For they never did own the light in man to be the very God, as you Quakers do; and do you think that Augustine and the rest would not have condemned the Quakers principle for heresie if it had been in their time? they would have judged it to be the greatest heresie of all others: for a man to believe there is no o∣ther Go•• but the light within man, and that neither the Father nor the Son hath never a body of their own, Augustine and all those old Authors would have judged this to be Antichristian he∣resie indeed. I thought you would have bin ashamed to bring old Authors that lived in the dark time of the world to prove your doctrine. Did I ever bring any Author to prove what I say against you, but the Scriptures and my own revelation for what I have d clared: but Penn ha••h shewed his gross ignorance, to bring old Authors to prove what he saith; for Fox the Qua∣ker hath said, that they could have known the minde of Christ, and that they were in Ch••ist before the world was, if no Letter of Scripture had been written; so that Penns knowledge is far be∣low Fox his father, notwithstanding his gteat Learning, there∣fore I perceive Penn is very ignorant, and hath had no experi∣ence

n••r r••velation of the light of Christ within him, but what he hath read out of th••s•• old Authors books, which doth cause him to talk ••nd write af••er this rate; and for my part I never s••w any of thos books 〈◊〉〈◊〉 sp••aks of, neither did I ever reade a∣ny of those points ••hey cond••mn f••r heresie

We never read no books but the Bible and the revelation of the seed of faith arising in m, h••th led me by the hand to know the meaning of the Scriptur••s, and hath given me such appear∣ance, that no question could be asked in spiritual things, but they have bin easie to me; therefore I sha••l say this unto you Penn, who hath bin brought up at the Vniversity on earth several years, and there you have read several b••oks, as you have exprest, wher∣by you do judge these th••ngs to be heresie, because those books did judge them heresie; and are you sure th se men you approve of would not have judged Christ himself when on earth, to have bin a Blasphemer and Deceiver, as t••ose did that heard him speak; and would not those old Authors have persecuted the A∣postles, as those did in their time for Liars and Deceivers, had they lived in the Apostles time; yea, I am sure they would: for this is a certain rule, that he that will persecute a man for error in Religion, will as soo•• persecute the truth as errour, and call the truth heresie, for truth doth cause men to be more mad to persecute it as heresie, why, because the reason of man cannot grapple with it, nor comprehend it, which causeth him to be an∣gry and persecute it as heresie: neither did G••d ever give non∣commissionated men power to judg•• of her••sie in spiritual things, yet Penn hath no other proof for those six Heads to be old here∣sies, but the Antiquity of old Authors books, which Penn hath read at the Vniversity, as may be read in his book.