The journal of Monsr. de Saint Amour doctor of Sorbonne,: containing a full account of all the transactions both in France and at Rome, concerning the five famous propositions controverted between the Jansenists and the Molinists, from the beginning of that affair till the Popes decision. / Faithfully rendred out of French. ; A like display of the Romish state, court, interests, policies, &c. and the mighty influences of the Jesuites in that church, and many other Christian states, being not hitherto extant.

CHAP. XIX.

The discourse of Card. Ghiggi with a∣nother Cardinal in the Consistory, May 5. touching the new Bull. The reasons which mov'd us to go and tell the Pope that we should be ready to appear before him when and in what manner his Holinesse plea∣sed.

TUesday, May 6. I heard that a certain Car∣dinal being advertised on Sunday last that the Bull was prepar'd, instantly resolv'd to make his complaints & Remonstrances against it to the Pope on Monday morning May 5. in the Consisto∣ry which was to be held that day: but fearing that what he should represent to the Pope would not be well receiv'd by his Holinesse, he conceiv'd it would be best to speak first to Cardi∣nal Ghiggi who was likely to hear with more at∣tention what he should say, to receive it better, and with more facility render the Pope suscepti∣ble of it. He intended also to discover by Cardi∣nal Ghiggi's answers how the Popes mind stood, and whether or no it would be fit to speake to his Holinesse afterwards. But Cardinal Ghiggi re∣ply'd so sharpely to all that the other Cardinal said (though his elder and a most venerable per∣son both for his endowments and his age,) and seem'd so violently prepossess'd and strongly bent to the purpose of Condemning, that he conceiv'd the Pope was affected in the same manner, and therefore resolv'd to say nothing to him for fear he should do it in vain, but to practise that coun∣sell of the Scripture, Non effundas Sermonem ubi non est auditus. And he saw that thenceforward all was desperate, and no more to be done in the matter but to have recourse to prayers and pa∣tience.

I was inform'd exactly enough of the particu∣lars of the discourse of these two Cardinals, and shall insert some principal fragments of it which I pen'd down at that time.

Upon the friendly and familiar complaint made to Cardinal Ghiggi about the new compil'd Bull, Cardinal Ghiggi answer'd the other roughly and as being surpriz'd that the mine was discover'd, seeming also in some sort to deny that it was true. He askt him Chive l' ha detto? who told you this? The other answer'd calmely, I do not think I am oblig'd to tell you whence I had this intelligence; but I am advertis'd of it by a good hand. Your Eminence must not believe, but in such an affair as this, wherein all the world is interessed, eve∣ry one endeavors to look about him and discover what is acted; I conjecture that in the first draught of the Bull there were some words in commenda∣tion of S. Augustin, because besides what I other∣wise heard, the discourse of these two Cardinals came to this point, that Cardinal Ghiggi acknow∣ledging that the Bull was made, yet undertook to justifie the reasonablenesse of it, telling the o∣ther that no dangerous consequence could be feared from it, in regard of the praises attributed therein to that H. Doctor, by which (he said) his Doctrine was secur'd. The other Cardinal re∣ply'd, that those praises were of little advantage to S. Augustin if his doctrine was really condemn'd; adding that the Propositions in question were his very doctrin, and, till their condemnation, main∣tain'd as so many articles of Faith. Cardinal Ghiggi answer'd, that they were equivocal; and contain'd evill sense: The other reply'd that they also contain'd Capital truths of the Catholick faith in the good senses wherein they might be understood. For proof whereof he began to ex∣plain them with admirable facility and clearnesse; but Cardinal Ghiggi excused himself from hear∣ing him, saying that he had not studied them. Whereupon the other said, Alas! how then can you consent to their condemnation; if you have not studied them? Cardinal Ghiggi answered, I should have studied them, had I been (da volare,) oblig'd to give my opinion, and Vote concern∣ing them. The other demanded, if you have not given your opinion, how will it be true which the Pope shall say in his Bull, that he con∣demnes them by advice of the Cardinals, de Con∣silio fratrum nostrorum? Cardinal Ghiggi an∣swer'd, that it would be true by a Council of pru∣dence; per un Consiglio prudentiale, or otherwise, by a Political advice of what was expedient to ordain, regard being had to all the circumstances of the affair. The other excepted again, How can one give a prudential Counsel touching an affair which he hath not studied, and sees not to the bottom? If this Bull be published, 'twill be a Bull of the Consultors, not of the Cardinals; and of Con∣sultors pickt and cull'd by wayes which all the world knowes and the French Doctors are not ig∣norant of; they keep a register of them; and if an unfitting Judgement come forth we shall soon see the H. See charg'd with confusion by printed Books in all parts. Besides if any obscurity be in the Bull, every one will draw it to his own side, and this will cause horrible combustions and contest. But for all this, in summa (said my Re∣lator) this Cardinal got nothing at all in his con∣ference with Cardinal Ghiggi, but very sharp an∣swers from him; Non fu guadagnato niente, ma sempre acertissima risposta.

Returning home from the Visit wherein I learnt these passages, we deliberated concerning our go∣ing altogether that morning to the Pope, to deli∣ver him the Letter of Febr. 24. and declare to him, that we had been, and should be alwayes rea∣dy to appear before him whenever he should ap∣point us. Besides, the general respect due to the Head of the Church from all the Faithful, we consider'd what particular reasons we had for it in the present conjuncture; and that the Pope was absolutely determin'd not to hear us at all in a contradictory Conference, having so declar'd to our new Collegues; that he conceiv'd he had us'd all moral diligences necessary for clearing the Truth; that he was perswaded that after those diligences, the H. Ghost's assistance of him was

infallible; and that he was resolv'd to pronounce a Judgement.

We consider'd the persons who inform'd him, & from whom he took counsel, most of them preju∣dic'd against S. Augustin's doctrine & against us: offended with the difficulties we had made to ap∣pear before them, unlesse on the conditions we demanded, and accounting they did us a favour to hear us in the manner which they offer'd, (see∣ing that most of the World was become disaf∣fected to us through the contrivances of the Je∣suites throughout all Europe, especially in France) not likely to neglect so favourable an occasion of promoting the dominion which they affect over the conscience and liberty of the Faithful.

We consider'd that the Bull, which was already compil'd against the Propositions, could not but give great advantages to our Adversaries, and be in their hands like a sword in those of a mad man, when once it came forth; that having assuredly not been made but by the ministry of M. Albizzi, and the assistance of the Jesuites, they might ea∣sily have slipt into it words of very great conse∣quence, beside the Pope's intention, from whence the Jesuites might pretend the cause gain'd for their Molina, and whose sequels his Holinesse, not being sufficiently instructed in these matters, could not foresee no more being necessary: for his sa∣tisfaction, saving that it appear'd in general that his intentions were follow'd; wherefore we ac∣counted it highly important to stop its publica∣tion.

We consider'd that in one of the Writings pre∣par'd for us, we had our selves done what we be∣seecht the Pope might be done before all things, namely, distinguisht the Propositions into the se∣veral senses whereof they were capable, and clear∣ly explicated them both in the one and the other without equivocation or obscurity; Which Wri∣ting was necessary to be read and publickly de∣clar'd to the Pope before the Bull came forth; to the end that if it absolutely condemn'd the Pro∣positions, we might have this authentick proof further that we had not maintain'd them absolute∣ly, but only in the Catholick senses whereof they were susceptible.

We consider'd that we could not have the ad∣vantage of making such declaration and protesta∣tion before the Pope, nor hindering the publish∣ing of the Bull, if we still insisted upon being heard in the formes which we had dnmanded; because 'twas evidently dangerous that the Pope would persist to deny the same to us, and without regard to what we had represented to him, cause the Bull to be publisht forthwith. Which would be of no other advantage to us, then that we might com∣plain of being condemn'd after an unheard of manner in defending the best cause of the World. But neverthelesse such condemnation would cause great disorder and scandal in the Church.

We consider'd that the Pope might have good intentions; That our Writings were very home; that if he gave us time to explicate the same to him, and add thereunto viva voce what we pleas'd as he promis'd us, the truths which we had to re∣present to him might make some impression upon his mind, stop his purpose against us wherto our Ad∣versaries had drawn him, convince him of the ne∣cessity of a Conference, and consequently move him to appoint one of his own accord without our further demanding it.

We consider'd that should we be deceiv'd in our hopes, this new fashion'd Audience which he would give us, not being according to Ecclesiastical lawes and customes, and we not accepting it but in regard of the present conjuncture and circum∣stances above mention'd, there would be no great difference between having been heard in this man∣ner, and not being heard at all.

Lastly, We consider'd that we accepted not this Audience, but only to have the meanes of repre∣senting to the Pope that it was not such as we de∣manded; that the accustom'd forms of the Church were not observ'd in it; that Ecclesiastical liberty was infring'd by it, and that we resolv'd not to begin to treat our affair after a manner oppo∣site to their forms and liberty, but because we now saw no other way to preserve them, that we would slip no occasion, either in this Congregation or the following of making instances for the same; that whatever informations we gave of things, we should still conclude, that the Pope might see there∣by the necessity of having Adversares to object a∣gainst whatever falshood or mistake might be in what we should represent against both their pro∣ceedings and doctrine, and in behalf of our own.

All these considerations confirm'd us in the re∣solution of going altogether that day to the Pope, to testifie to him that we were ready to appear be∣fore his Holinesse, when he pleas'd and how he pleas'd, and in the mean time to deliver him the Letter of February 24. as a testimony of our de∣sires, and those of our Bishops; and moreover to get ready a Memorial to present to him when we should appear before his Holinesse, wherein to desire that both our first, and the new Writings which we should present to him, might be com∣municated to our Adversaries.

Having briefly reduc'd our common resolutions into Writing before we went out of our Lodging, we repair'd to the Pope's Presence-Chamber to desire Audience; but it being already somewhat late, we could not obtain it.