The first and second part of Gangræna, or, A catalogue and discovery of many of the errors, heresies, blasphemies and pernicious practices of the sectaries of this time, vented and acted in England in these four last years also a particular narration of divers stories, remarkable passages, letters : an extract of many letters, all concerning the present sects : together with some observations upon and corollaries from all the fore-named premisses / by Thomas Edwards ...

A Disputation held at the Spitle about the Immortality of the soul by some Anabap∣tists, as Lam, Battee, and others on the day of publike Thanksgiving for Dartmouths being given up into the hands of the Parliament.

MY Lord Major hearing of a great concourse of people that were to meet upon such a businesse, having a respect to the peace and good govern∣ment of this City, sent two of the Marshals men to Lam to the Spitle, where they were met to dispute, but had not yet begun, who told Lam that may Lord Major had sent them to him to forbid him or them to dispute as upon this day; Lam answered the Officers he would go up and acquaint the brethren, which he did, standing in a place like a desk above the people at one end of the room, and Battee at the other: The first thing that Lam spake of, was, that my Lord Major had sent to forbid their meeting, or rather to desire them not to dispute as upon this day; Battee stood up and said that Mr. Major was a limb of Anti∣christ, and that he was a persecutor of the brethren, and that he did question what power or authority he had to forbid them; he was sure the Parliament gave him no such power, but gave them liberty to use their consciences, and for his part he durst undertake to make it good to Master Major (calling my Lord Major in a most base and scornfull manner Master Major.) One Overton that was to be the Moderatour on Battees side, stood up and said, Brother Lam, had Paul done well if he had desisted from preaching in the name of Jesus if he had been commanded by the High-Priests to forbear, had he done well or not? Lam answered no; whereupon Overton replied in a most scornfull proud man∣ner,

nor ought we to obey Master Major; and thus did these men argue the power of my Lord Major for an houres space; but at the last they came to state the question, and fall to their dispute; the question was, That God made man, and every part of man of the dust of the earth; and therefore man, and every part of man must returne to the dust again, which Battee could not prove, nor could Lam well tell how to answer, but both of them ran off from Scripture to Scripture, never clearing any one thing to the people; and when they had rambled a long time, that they could neither of them tell what to say, then one or other stood up, and said, Brother Lam, or Brother Battee, leave this point to the consideration of the Brethren, and take up some other; after these two had spent foure or five houres in this confusion, they sat down and rested, and then stands up one Mellish a Cobler, and Lawson a Schoolmaster, both Anabaptists, and to work they went as their Brethren before: Lawson calls to Mellish, and saith to him, Brother Mellish, speak either Categorically or Hypothetically; Mellish answered Lawson, that he spake now to him in an unknown tongue, and prayed him to explain himself; Lawson told Mellish that he was nor fit to dis∣pute if he knew not the meaning of these words; Mellish replied that if hee should stand up and tell the people that the Moon was made of green Cheese, he did not question but some would be of his mind.

This Relation was given me under the hand of a godly honest Citizen, who was an eare and eye witnesse of all the said passages, who also named to me other persons that were present, and he delivered me this Relation in writing before two sufficient witnesses, and declared himself ready to make proof of this before Authority when ever he should be called.

This following Relation was sent to a godly and able Minister of this City, (one who hath a Pastorall charge in London) and this Minister delivered me the Originall writing, which to a tittle There set down.

Reverend, and much respected,

I Desire you pardon my boldnesse in imparting to you that which hath lately befaln me: I was in the company of some Antinomians that were very im∣portunate with me to forsake your teaching, and come among them and harken to their Preachers, and they prevailed with me so farre, that I gave them my promise to hear their Preachers; but the night following, I had such a terrible dream which made me break my promise with them; for I dreamed that the Divell would have pulled me out of the bed, and carried me away with him; then I cried out in my sleep so loud, that I waked them that were in the Cham∣ber, Lord Jesus help me, Lord Jesus help me; then me thought the power of God came on my right hand, and rescued me from Satan: This I take for a warning

from God to avoid their society; and for which I desire that thanks be ren∣dred to God in this Congregation which I use to frequent.

There is one M••ster Mills a Common Councell man, the City Brickler, who hath related it to many, as a thing most certain, that an old acquaintance and friend of his, an old Papist knowing well all Papists, said to Master Mills, that now there were but two Sects or sides in England, the Presbyterians and the Independents; unto which Master Mills objected, how can that be? seeing there are many Papists; this Papist replied, that to his knowledge all the Pa∣pists in ☞ England were Independents; and this Papist further added, that this Liberty of Conscience and Toleration for all men to enjoy their Religion, was a blessed thing, and the happiest thing that ever was found out, or words to that purpose.

There is a Sectary living neer the Spitle, a great follower of Master Randall, who did offer to sell his Bible, and being asked why he would sell it, and what he would do for a Bible, answered, he could make as good a Book himself. Some Sectaries do commonly affirme they are not to beleeve the Scriptures further then their own Reason doth perswade them of the truth of them, and that the Scriptures are no more the Word of God then the words any man speaks are; because he could not speak those words but by a power from God.

It hath been told me from good hands, that there are a company of persons about London, who meet weekly to reason and object against the Scriptures; their meetings were about the Spitle, and since in Hounsditch, and now they shift places for feare they should be discovered, and surprised; it were good that Authority would look into it, to finde them out; I shall be ready to name the men from whom I have had such information.

I have been informed lately by divers honest men, that in Northampton-shire some of the Souldiers who are Sectaries, and are of that part of the Army which came out of the West, and belong to that Army in the West, have come into the Parish Churches, and put by the godly Ministers who should preach, and by force against the will of the Ministers and people, have set up Cap∣taines, and others of the Souldiers to preach in their Pulpits, and to vent their Fancles and Errours.

The true Copie of a Letter written to me from a worthy and godly Minister in Suffolk, in the name, and by the consent and agreement of other Ministers of the County at a meeting of theirs, and sent up by the hands of a godly Minister in those parts, who delivered it to me.

Worthy Sir,

YOur Brethren in these parts desire to praise God for you, and for that courage he hath given you to encounter, and publikely to oppose the

Sectaries of these dayes. God make you as Augustine, Malleum Haereticorum. Sir, this Bearer, a Minister, an honest neighbour of mine will make a true Rela∣tion to you of some of the late pranks of some Sectaries on both sides of u••. One is of Oates the Anabaptist (whom your Gangraena takes notice of) that after one of his private Exercises amongst the weaker vessels, one Wades wise of Stisted in Essex, seemed to be so affected with him, that she said she would never hear Minister again: and it may be God intends to make her as good as her word; for upon ☞ this she was taken mad, and remaines in a sad distracted condition; and her husband sent to Master Blackaby, and Master Faircloth (our godly neighbours) to pray for her. This, one Redgwell an honest man making re∣port of, was asked if he were not at Oates his Exercise; he answered no; then it was demanded, was not your wife there? He answered, if he should deny that, he should sin against God, and tell a lie, for she (he said) was there, but was never well since. This Bearer can likewise tell you somewhat of Master Archer of Halsted. Also of one Lancester of Bury a Pedler, and of his opening the whole Book of Ezra at a private meeting, insteed of opening his pack, and of the pray∣er that followed his Exercise, &c. Of Master Erbury also, &c. It would be lost labour for me to make a further Relation by writing of these things, seeing you shall receive the truth more fully by word of mouth, and by a faithfull Relator: I have no more to say at this time, but that I heartily pray for you, that God preserve, direct and guid you, and make you more and more ser∣viceable to him and his Church, in your generation, and to let you know that I am

Your faithfull freind and Brother

From Clare in Suffolk March 30▪ 1646.

Upon conference with the Minister who brought up this Letter, he related these following passages to me, and I writ them presently as he spake them.

Master Erbury (one of those Sectaries spoken of at large in Gangraena, pag. 109. and 110.) coming lately to Bury in Suffolk, and there exercising in private, he delivered divers erroneous things, and at last went so high, as to deny that Jesus Christ ☞ was God, and that he was as much God as ever Jesus Christ was, or should be.

One Lancester in a private meeting at Bury, condemned all the Ministers of England for the Sanba••••ats and Tobiahs of this time, that hindered the building of the Temple, resembling himself, and the Sectaries to those who would build the Temple, but it was withstood by the Ministers, who hindred it: At that meeting there was a plain godly man, a solid old Christian of Master Faircloths congregation who opposed him, and God was so mightily with him, that it

turned to the shame and reproach of this Lancester, and those who adhered to him.

Master Archer of H••lsteed, an Independent, a man who hath preached much against our Ministers and Tyths; at the same time, or thereabouts, when hee preached so against Tyths, used meanes to procure to himself a great Living in Essex, of two hundred pounds per annum, and came to some Gentlemen of the Country for their hands to further the getting of that Living.