Romanism discussed, or, An answer to the nine first articles of H.T. his Manual of controversies. Whereby is manifested, that H.T. hath not (as he pretends) clearly demonstrated the truth of the Roman religion by him falsly called Catholick, by texts of holy scripture, councils of all ages, Fathers of the first five hundred years, common sense, and experience, nor fully answered the principal objections of protestants, whom he unjustly terms sectaries. By John Tombes, B.D. And commended to the world by Mr. Richard Baxter.

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Title
Romanism discussed, or, An answer to the nine first articles of H.T. his Manual of controversies. Whereby is manifested, that H.T. hath not (as he pretends) clearly demonstrated the truth of the Roman religion by him falsly called Catholick, by texts of holy scripture, councils of all ages, Fathers of the first five hundred years, common sense, and experience, nor fully answered the principal objections of protestants, whom he unjustly terms sectaries. By John Tombes, B.D. And commended to the world by Mr. Richard Baxter.
Author
Tombes, John, 1603?-1676.
Publication
London :: printed by Henry Hills, and are to be sold by Jane Underhill, and Henry Mourtlock in Paul's Church-yard,
1660.
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Subject terms
Turberville, Henry, d. 1678. -- Manuel of controversies.
Link to this Item
http://name.umdl.umich.edu/A94737.0001.001
Cite this Item
"Romanism discussed, or, An answer to the nine first articles of H.T. his Manual of controversies. Whereby is manifested, that H.T. hath not (as he pretends) clearly demonstrated the truth of the Roman religion by him falsly called Catholick, by texts of holy scripture, councils of all ages, Fathers of the first five hundred years, common sense, and experience, nor fully answered the principal objections of protestants, whom he unjustly terms sectaries. By John Tombes, B.D. And commended to the world by Mr. Richard Baxter." In the digital collection Early English Books Online. https://name.umdl.umich.edu/A94737.0001.001. University of Michigan Library Digital Collections. Accessed May 25, 2025.

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Page 139

SECT. V.

The devotion of Romanists shews not the holiness of the Roman Church, it be∣ing for the most part will-worship and pharisaical hypocrisie.

H. T. goes on thus, Her Churches are open and Divine Service said not onely on all Sundays and Holy-days, but every day in the week, and that the greatest part in the forenoon. There is five times more preaching and catechizing, and ten times more fasting and praying in the Catholick Church than in the Protestant; her Sacraments are more, and more frequented, and in stead of an innumerable multitude of religious men and women that are in the Catho∣lick Church, who have freely forsaken all things to follow Christ, and totally relinquished the riches, pleasures, and preferments of this life to serve him in the remainder of their days in vows and practises of holy poverty, obedience, and chastity, Protestants have an innumerable company of Sects and Sect-ma∣sters that daily spring out of their stock, such as are continually broaching new Heresies, and always at defiance one with another.

Answ THe Popish devotion is so far from proving the holiness of the Roman Church falsly and most impudently termed the Catholick Church, that it rather proves them a Synagogue of Satan than a Church of Christ. Their Churches as they term them, stand open, but that which is to be seen or heard in them is more like the Temples of Pagan gods than Christian Assem∣blies. In the primitive times Christians had no Images in their places of meeting, but Popish Temples are full of Images and Pictures, and the service to them like the Pagans to their Idols, bowing down to them, burning Incense before them, offering gifts to them, lifting up and adoring a piece of Bread, with a great deal of outward pomp of Lights, Garments, garnishing of the house, attendance of Officers, suiting better to womanish and childish persons than holy spiritual Christians. Their Mass, which is that they glory in, is no∣thing like the Institution of Christ, nor used to that end for which he appoint∣ed his last Supper to be continued, but a meer shew with many ridiculous ge∣stures, motions, actions, with Lamps burning in the day, Copes and Gar∣ments in imitation of the Jews, which make it unlike the primitive simplicity of Christians, which was without them many hundreds of years. Their many Holy days were justly heretofore complained of as a great grievance to people, and it is a great happiness to be freed from them all, as begetting idle∣ness, luxury, and penury, the Lord's Day excepted, which is no where among them observed as a Day set apart for God, and spent in Prayer, Hearing, Reading the Word of God to the edification of the people, and such other Duties of Religion as God hath prescribed, but after some time spent in hearing Mass, and Even-song, the rest of the day is spent in feasting, sporting, and in many places in such worldly affairs, as shew little minding of God or any heavenly affections. Their Churches are open in the week days upon an ignorant and superstitious conceit, as if God would hear them there by reason of the conse∣cration of the place, or the Relicks of some Saint, or some other fond imagi∣nation which their Priests, or ancestours instill into them, and therefore they

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say there their Ave-Maries and Pater-nosters by tale, without understanding or attention to what they say or do, or to God, but observing onely their gestures after their manner, stay out their time without learning any thing which may improve them in Christian knowledge, but in their houses in the mean time cal∣ling upon God with understanding and feeling of their wants, the reading of holy Scriptures is neglected, and many other Duties which should be done are omitted, and which is worst of all much wantonness and other evils occasioned (if credible persons say true) and cloked by the often repair of persons to their Churches. That there is more Preaching and Catechizing among Papists than among Protestants is strange news to me, nor do I think any London Merchant or other person who hath travelled into Italy or Spain will believe it. What now is done I cannot speak of mine own knowledge, as having not travelled in∣to those Countreys; but what I finde in Authours whom I have great cause to believe, makes me, who have known London, Oxford, Bristol, Worcester, and other parts of England, and their Preaching and Catechizing, conceive, that H. T. tells here a manifest untruth. However it is easie to discern by reading the Sermons and Catechisms of both, which are printed, that their preaching and catechizing, how often soever it be in respect of Gospel doctrine, spiritual truths and holy directions comes as short of the English Protestant Preachers Sermons and Catechizing as Lead or Dross doth of Gold. When Drury preached at Black-Frier his Sermons were of Popish Penance, and such like superstitious points of Popery. The History of the Quarrels between Pope Paul the fifth and the Common-wealth of Venice by Frier Paul tells us, that it was found in the Rules of the Jesuits when they were expelled out of Venice, that this was out of their Instructions to be very paring in preaching of the free grace of God, and the relation of their Doctines in the Book of the Mystery of Jesuitism published by a Jansenist, shews what kinde of Doctrine the Jesuites now the popular Preachers instill into the people of France. Their fasting and praying, if it be such as their Casuists describe, is a nullity or a mockery, that which they call fasting being onely a change of food, sometimes such as a Glutton would choose to please his appetite, and differring a Meal for some hours, which is no fasting, and their praying no ascending of the minde to God, or making known their requests to him, but saying words many of them that contain no Petitions, like Parrots without understanding, and in a great part calling upon deceased Saints and Angels. The multitude of their Sacraments shews the grosness of their ignorance and greatness of their Superstition, Ma∣trimony being no Sacrament of the new Law given to Christians for the san∣ctifying of them, but an Institution of God before the Fal of Adam, com∣mon to all mankinde for the lawfull propagating thereof, Unction being no or∣dinary Rite for sanctification, but a sign of a special gift of healing, Penance is no special Sacrament, but the common Duty of all men, Auricular Con∣fession is an unjust Imposition, Priests authoritative judicial Absolution is a meer Delusion, Confirmation is either a fond imitation of the Apostles act in giving the holy Ghost, or else is in its genuine use an Appendix to Baptism. Orders is a Rite proper to the Clergy, as it is termed. The Eucharist and Ba∣ptism are indeed holy Ordinances of Christ, not to give grace by the work done, but by the one to testifie our profession, the other our remembrance of his Death: neither name nor thing of Sacrament, as Papists define it is from

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Scripture, nor is any thing almost right in Papists doctrine or use of these rites, but their use of them is almost quite changed into another thing then what Christ instituted, and therefore the more they are frequented, the lesse is there of true Religion and the more of vain superstition. There's far better administration of the Lords Supper among the Protestants, who use it after Christs institution to remember his death: not as Papists for a propitiatory sacrifice for quick and dead with addition of many histrionical mimical inven∣tions of men, and mangling it by the half in keeping the cup from the laity, and making a private Masse of a communion. Baptism is better administred without addition of oil, cream, and spittle, and Ephphatha, and such toyes as Papists use. Ordination is better used by Protestants who ordain Preachers of the Gospel, not sacrificing Priests. And yet in these and in other matters some things may be better'd, which through the great aberration from the pri∣mitive institution remain yet to be amended. As for the multitude of religious men and women as he calls them, not only the relations of Protestants, but al∣so of Popish writers give us cause to think there's little of religion or morality in them except gluttony, idlenesse, whoredom, and other lewdness be religion. The common proverb makes a Frier a lyer. If they freely forsake any thing it is not to follow Christ, but Bennet, Francis, Dominick, Bruno, Ignatius and such like hypocrites, by following whom there is more reason to judge they for∣sake Christ, then by adhering to their rules to adhere to Christ, there being none more malicious and bitter and cruel enemies to the sincere preaching and profession of the Gospel then Friers, Monks, Nunnes, and especially the dam∣ned crew of Jesuits, who have been within one hundred years and somewhat more authors of more bloody warrs, massacres, cruel persecutions, treasons, murthers and other hellish villanies then ever such a number of men besides were guilty of since the world stood. Is any man of such a sottish spirit as to believe that these men have relinquished the riches, pleasures and preferments of this life to serve Christ the remainder of their lives, who knows what goodly structures they live in, what full tables they have, what great revenues they are inriched with? will any man that views the very ruins of Abbys, Nunneries, Priories and other houses, which they termed religious here in England, that reads the catalogue of their revenues at the end of Speeds Chronicle judge these re∣linquished the riches of this life? Are the Monastery of St. Laurence in Castile, the Colledge of La Flech in France, with innumerable more in those countries, and in Germany, Italy, &c. Cottages for poor Almesmen? what an arrant gullery and cheat is this of this frontlesse scribler to perswade English people, that their votaries have relinquished all riches when they possesse revenues in some countries equal to Kings and Princes, fair Palaces, full tables, good cloathing, great attendance, large command of tenants with furniture and pro∣vision of all sorts of things commodious for this life in their convents? And to say they serve Christ when all the world knows the Monks serve none but their own bellies, and the Jesuits are true to none but the Catholick Bishop and Catholick King, who may perhaps in time finde them as pernicious to themselves as they are to other Princes and States, what a monstrous fiction is it? their vows and practises are not of true but counterfeit poverty, and if it were voluntary poverty indeed which they make shew of, it would be the more sinful, God no where directing men to cast away their estates, but to use them 〈2 pages missing〉〈2 pages missing〉

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John 10 41. Yea Christ himself at some time was restrained from doing mi∣racles, Matth. 13▪ 58. and the Disciples were defective therein, Luk. 9. 40, 41. 6. That there are some wonders which are lying wonders. 7 That these are so like true miracles, that they are very apt to deceive a great part of men. 8. That the Lord permits these to be for trial of men. 9. That he keeps his elect from being seduced by them. 10. That they are bound to heed whereto these miracles tend, and not to follow them that make shew of them if they tend to Idolatry, and to draw us away from Gods expresse commands and truths re∣vealed in the Scripture. Out of all which I infer, that without examination of the doctrine by the Scripture we are not meerly upon the pretence of miracles to judge men to be true teachers and true Churches, (except they should be so many, great, frequent, open, as Christ and his Apostles were, for I count that speech of Bellarm. lib. 4. de notis Eccles. c. 14. impious that before the appro∣bation of the Church it is not certain with the certainty of faith whether any mi∣racle be true, which if true till the Church approved them there had been no certainty of faith that Christs or his Apostles miracles were true) and therefore miracles are not a sufficient note of a true Church.

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