A survey of the Survey of that summe of church-discipline penned by Mr. Thomas Hooker ... wherein the way of the churches of N. England is now re-examined ... / by Samuel Rutherfurd ...

LIB. II. CHAP. I.

Whether or not a company of Believers destitute as yet of Officers, and combined together by this new Covenant, be truely called, and be in truth and indeed a Church?

MR. Hooker moves the question, whether such a * 1.1 company be a Church indeed? by which he insi∣nuates, that it is a certain kind of a visible Church, but not the only visible Church insti∣tuted by Christ in the New Testament. There∣fore Mr. H. stands obliged either to form the question in other terms, or to shew which is the only instituted visible Church in the New Testament: for the Discipline-book of N. E. saith, that Church which Christ in his Gospel hath instituted, to which he hath committed the Keyes—the Officers, Censures—is coetus fidelium, a combination of the godly—called a particular visible Church. And Mr. H. comes to

our hand, and (so with a trumpet giving an uncertain sound) he tells he speaks of the Congregational Church, as it goes be∣fore Officers; which is a Man in the Moon, and proved by no Scripture at all.

Mr. H. The trumpet here gives an incertain sound. M. R. expressions are so full of variety.

Ans. It is a groundless charge, except you bring expressions of Mr. R. ambiguities, which is not legible to the Reader: I blow the trumpet alwayes against such a visible Church as Mr. H. for∣geth by arguments from the word, which are not answered.

Mr. H. A Church ministerial is taken two wayes. 1. Generally, * 1.2 as implying any delegate power in the exercise of any Church-acts, under Christ. So a company of visible Saints hath power of admissi∣on of members, and election of officers; and in case they prove here∣tical, to reject the officer, and make him no officer. All these are granted by Mr. R. Ministerial power is taken strictly, as it includes an office power, so it is not ministerial.

Ans. Mr. H. dictates, but neither teaches nor brings one word of Scripture to prove a distinction that hath neither head nor feet.

2. The members of the distinction are coincident; for to or∣dain officers, and excommunicate them is governing strictly and most properly; as is in the second member. And yet in the first * 1.3 member, to excommunicate makes a ministerial Church largely so called. The distinction is a begging of the question, and de∣stroyes it self; for it is to ask whether visible Saints, wanting such as are the only Governours and Rulers, who are called in the word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, 1 Cor. 12. 28. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, 1 Tim. 5. 17. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, Heb. 13. 17. Rulers, be a ruling and a governing Church, for a Society that doth ordain Elders, and which cen∣sures them, if heretical, with excommunication, must be a Ru∣ling, and so a Ministerial Church, if there be any Ruling and Ecclesiastick Church on Earth. If any say that a Society that appoints Stewards and Officers over the house, and excommu∣nicateth them, is not a politick governing Society; they may deny that the man which maketh use of reason is a reasonable

creature. And to frame a distinction, and say a man is a rea∣sonable * 1.4 creature in that sense, is poor Logick. We can give in∣stances where the Presbytery ordains, and layes on hands, 1 Cor. 4. 14. and where Titus and other Elders are to ordain Elders in every City, Tit. 1. 5. and Timothy, and in him others are char∣ged to lay on hands, and ordain no man suddenly, while he be proved to be a fit Officer, 1 Tim. 5. 22. 1 Tim. 3. 10. and where Timothy and others with him are commanded, 2 Tim. 2. 2. to commit the ministry to faithful men, who are able to teach others. Would Mr. H. shew so much for the power of Rule in a com∣pany of Believers, void of Officers, or give us a shadow of rea∣son in the word from precepts, practices, promises, for this new Church, that ordains and excommunicates without Officers, they should have something to say to this, who upon good groun•• say, they coyn a new Church of their own, unknown to word.

Mr. H. indeed elswhere saith, Such places shall prove Ti•…•… thy and Titus to be Prelats.

I answer, 1. Mr. H. and our Brethrens way shall be straited with this groundless Argument, as well as we.

2. We say, these Epistles in point of governing, as trying * 1.5 of Pastors, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2, 3. of Deacons, ver. 10. of Elders, 1 Tim. 1. 17. ordaining or laying on of hands, ver. 22. receiving of accusation by witnesses, 19, 20. the ordaining of Elders thus and thus qualified, Tit. 1. 5, 6, 7, 8. 2 Tim. 2. 2. preaching the Gospel in season and out of season 2 Tim 4. 1, 2. with gentleness, 1 Tim. 5. 15. ruling in the house of God, 1 Tim. 3. 16. charging of men to preach sound doctrine. 1 Tim. 1. 3. di∣viding the word aright, 2 Tim. 2. 14, 15. These Epistles (I say) are written to Timothy and to Titus, not as little Monarchs, with preeminence above other Elders, but to them as repre∣senting all faithful Officers in the Colledge of that Presbytery, 1 Tim. 4. 14. who are to keep that command unviolable, to the second appearing of Christ, 1 Tim 6. 13. and they are not writ∣ten to Elders as having dominion over the faith of the peo∣ple.

2. If these Epistles were written to Timothy and Titus not as representing Officers, but as the Church representing the

people, yet wanting Officers, and so in a Church-capacity, then it should be Pauls minde that the people in that case destitute of Elders, should preach the word in season and out of season; as Timothy, 2 Tim. 4. 1, 2. and that the people, in that capacity, should, as the approved workmen of God, divide the word of truth rightly, 2 Tim. 2. 15. as well as they ordain Elders, and make and unmake Officers, by the places, 1 Tim. 5. 22, 2 Tim. 2. 2. Tit. 1. 5. yea, and the Apostle should not have ordained Titus to appoint Elders in every city, for he should have appointed the Cities and Churches of onely believers to ordain their own Elders.

Yea 3. the Church void of Elders, by our Brethrens way, are the onely society and visible Church on earth, who make and unmake, call and excommunicate Officers, and Officers have no hand in it, but accidentally: for, Elders are made, and if he∣retical, rejected (saith Mr. H.) by the people, having no Elders at all. Ergo, these Epistles must be written to the believers of E∣phesus and Crete that yet want Officers, that they may be in∣structed how to behave them••elves in the house of God, how to lay on hands, how to receive accusations, and how to prove and try officers. Yea, Paul should not have written Rules to Timothy and Titus the publick Officers, who by their office ought to have no hand in calling or rejecting of Officers by this way.

Lastly, saith Mr. H. All these are granted by Mr. R.

Whereas in many pages I dispute against this new visible Church, and grant no such thing, but suppose all the Officers should turn heretical in this, in that case the people in tutelâ inculpata salutis, when they turn Wolves, may withdraw. But * 1.6 I say not they can authoritatively excommunicate, and make and unmake Officers; and the Officers, when the people turn Familists, may withdraw and remove the Tabernacle.

Mr. H. God hath set officers in the Church, 1 Cor. 12. 28. Therefore the Church is before officers. * 1.7

The setting of the candle in the candlestick presupposeth the candlestick; the Church is the candlestick, Revel. 1. 20. the offi∣cers are the candles. Mr. R. answered, It was not good Lo∣gick.

Ans. I yet maintain this to be naughty Logick, and a naughty

Grammatication: and if this be the best Argument for this * 1.8 new conceit, it cannot stand.

God (saith Moses, Gen. 2. 7.) formed man of the dust, and God breathed in his (that is) in the nostrils of the man, the breath of life.

Ergo, He is a living man before the soul be breathed in him. Its naughty Logick like this.

Mr. H. God made man of earth, i. e. the body of man of the earth, and he breathed into the nostrils of that body so made by that mean, the breath of life: to affirm the body was made before the soul was infused; and that the body, which is the subject, to receive the soul, must be in nature before the soul, is very good Logick.

Ans. The Logick is yet naughty: for Moses saith, God brea∣thed in man a living soul, therefore Adam is a living man before his soul be infused. By this Logick

Mr. H. will but change my consequence, parallel and large as good as his. And have it thus:

God breathed in mans body as the matter, a living soul as the form.

Ergo, the body is in nature before the soul.

I shall not deny that consequence: but 1. The antecedent is not the Grammatical phrase, and the figurative speech of Moses, as my antecedent is. God breathed a living soul in the nostrils of man: Ergo, he was man before God breathed in him a living soul. So I desire Mr. H. to answer the like quirk of Grammar, Zech. 12. 1.

God createth the spirit in the midst of man.

Ergo, he was a man before God created a spirit in the midst of him.

So Isa. 42. 5.

God gives breath and spirit to the people, and to those that walk on the earth.

By this Argument,

Therefore the people are a living people, moving and walking upon

the earth, before God gave them breath and spirit. What more absurd?

So Mr. H. God hath set officers in the Church:

Therefore the Church is before the officers.

So God hath set the members, pastor and people, eye, ear, hands and feet, &c. every one of them in the body, as pleaseth him, 1 Cor. 12. 18. this is as much as, God hath placed single be∣lievers also (for believers are not members visible without Gods setting) not yet clothed with adjuncts (as they call them) of officers in the Church, ver. 18. or in the body visible.

Therefore by the consequence and grammatication every way alike,

The body or Church visible of combined believers, shall be before the body or Church visible of combined believers. But the Con∣clusion is absurd. What then hath Mr. H. gained by this Argu∣ment? Of necessity then, when the Apostle saith, God hath placed in the Church Apostles, Prophets;

The word Church, must be the visible Catholick organick Church, which is made organick by such organs as Apostles, Prophets, so seated.

Like this, God hath created a soul in man, and yet he is a man by the soul that is created in him, and is not a man before it be created in him.

Mr. H. Beside there's advantage to the cause, that not onely the * 1.9 subject in which these officers are, is totum essentiale, but by ver∣tue of her choise which is causal of the officers, they are there, saith Mr. H. and therefore in reason must be before them.

Ans. Its a great disadvantage, and an untruth, to call the * 1.10 Elders and Rulers of a politick ruling visible Church, which is an organical body, the adjuncts thereof: for the members and organs of an organical body, are the integral parts, and so in a physical consideration, the essential parts of the whole integral are not adjuncts by any Logick I know: and if you take away the integral parts wholly, you destroy the integral whole; but if you remove the adjuncts or accidents, you destroy not the sub∣ject.

2. What Logick is this, to make the Fathers, Apostles and Pastors who beget, and the Ministers by whom we believe, and

visibly believe, Rom. 10. 14, 15. Eph. 4. 11, 12. 1 Cor. 3. 5. the separable adjuncts of begotten children? This is strange Lo∣gick, Whiteness begot Snow! And this is as strange, that this Church of believers is the cause, and the officers the effect; that is, the adjunct is the cause, and the children, the Church of believers, or the subject is the effect, and the effect begets the cause, and is before the cause, and the fruit hath being before the tree, and the children before the father: for if we speak of a constant Rule, as now we must do, when Apostles are remo∣ved, if the Church of believers be a visible Church, having the Keyes and using them, even to admit officers, and to excommu∣nicate them, they

1. Dispense censures and govern, who have no call to carry on censures and government, by preaching the Word, or ex∣horting and praying, for there are no officers as yet, &c. If these be visible believers, who are their fathers who begat them? for there are no officers yet to beget them.

3. Who begot them by the preaching of the Word? and if they were heathens, and are now converted, who either did con∣vert them or baptize them? for there are no officers as yet: Did every one baptize another? or did unbaptized members baptize their own Ministers who are yet unbaptized? and this ar∣gument must be strongly retorted: The officers cannot be the effect of this Church, for they are the onely causes of the very materials of this Church; for officers must convert, gather a flock to God, and baptize them, if it be true, that faith comes (in the Lords ordinary and instituted way) by hearing of sent Pastors, Rom. 10. 14.

Mr. H. The Church (saith Mr. R.) is the candlestick, not * 1.11 simply without candles and lamps; the Church Ministerial is the candlesticks, and the Ministers the shining torches and candles. Its cross to all mens apprehensions, saith Mr. H. that the candlestick should be no longer a candlestick than the candle is in it: They are bought and sold for candlesticks. Is not a subject a subject, though the adjunct be not there? What kinde of Logick is this?

Ans. Its indeed unknown Logick, that officers the fathers should be adjuncts, and the Church of believers begotten by

them, as is said, the children should be the subject.

2. Mr. H. will have a figurative speech against all Logick and Grammar, to be a proper speech, and the candlestick, Rev. 1. 20. to be like the candlesticks of brass or other metal, or wood, which are bought or sold. So when its said, Christ walketh in the midst of the golden candlesticks, the sense must be, Christ walkesh in the midst of Churohes destitute of Angels and Officers: Whereas he hath promised his presence to the officers, Matth. 28. 20. especially, L•••• I am with you—and by this Christ must promise his presence to blinde candlesticks, and to Churches wanting of∣ficers and Angels. Then the meaning of this, Rev. 2. 5. I will remove the candlestick, must be, O Ephesus, I will remove be∣lievers, and that homogeneal body of Saints, as destitute of Angels. Never man dreamed of any such sense as this since the world was. But the true sense is, I will remove a shining Ministery, and the Ordinances, and the eight of the p•…•…ed Gospel, and the Word of the Kingdom; as Zech. 9. 8. Three shepherds also I cut off in one moneth—Then said I, I will not feed you. Amos 8. 12. They shall seek the word of the Lord, and shall not finde it. Mat. 21. 43. The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, Acts 13. 46, 47. Let Mr. H. shew how the Church without the Minister is called the golden candlestick? And where the Church of believers, with∣out the stars and torches, is called The light of the world? Godly and found Interpreters, Pareus, Pignetus, Marlorat, Piscater, Di••••ati, English Divines, The Church are candlesticks, * 1.12 because they bear (saith Pareus) the torch of heavenly Doctrine. So Pignetus, Marlorat, Piscator.

Mr. H. A Corporation of Aldermen, before they choose a Ma∣jor, is a free Corporation: Ergo, the Church of believers is a vi∣sible * 1.13 Church before it have officers. A man cannot be a husband before he have a wife, yet he may be a man wooing woman before he can make her his wise.

Ans. 1. The comparison is most unlike. For,

1. A Corporation of Aldermen is a Corporation of free * 1.14 Citizens and Magistrates, such as Aldermen are, though they yet want a Magistrate supreme, or a Major. The Church void of all officers 〈◊〉〈◊〉 not a body capable of governing in a formal way.

2. Say they want Aldermen, they had by nature an intrin∣sacal power to choose to themselves private men to be their Ru∣lers, whereas before they were no Rulers: But the making and laying on of hands upon men, to make them Elders, agrees not to believers, because visible believers, by the Law of Nature, but by a positive Law of God is given to a certain number of Presbyters or Elders, 1 Tim 4. 14. as is above proved.

3. Say that fourty Pagans, not baptized, were made by the travels of some private Christian, man or woman, visible Saints, fourty unbaptized could not make unbaptized Pag•…•… their Ru∣lers and Pastors, as they could make some of their members their Civil Magistrates.

4. That Corporation doe•• he get and create their Rulers, and their Rulers, who are posteriour to them, did not beget them, and make them free Citizen••. But officers ••••cording to the fix∣ed Rule of the Gospel, now when Apostles cease to be, are the onely fathers who baget visible professor.

Mr. H. If the Church ••••net a Church without officers, then * 1.15 as often as the officers die, the Church di•…•… also.

2. When the Church for gross heresias rejecteth the officers, the Church must destroy her self, while she laboureth her own preser∣vation. Doth a Corporation, when they put out a wicked Magi∣strate out of his place, therefore destroy their own Liberties, and nullifie their Corporation? Such Arguments may seem ••n••ugh to cast a cause, and yet Mr. R. by them can turn all aside.

Ans. Its unfit that a man should so reflect upon his Bre∣thren, * 1.16 when there is so little strength.

1. The Pastors being the husband, and the Church the wife, sure, if the wife destroy the husband to save her self, she destroys her own wife ship, while she labours the preservation of her self as a woman: and if the Church destroy all the heretical officers, is there any absundity to say, She destroyeth her own Ministerial feeding, her own sacramental communion, by which she is one

body with all the Saints on earth, as the Brethren grant; and its sure from 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. & 12. 13. as touching any spi∣ritual well-being and feeding by these wretched feeders: but they have no authority to do it. I see no inconvenience, why a Corporation may not out, and lay aside all their Aldermen and Major, if they turn Lions and Leopards, and so destroy the present individual Government, while they labour their own safety, and the safety of their priviledges. But the case is not alike, except Mr. H. prove, That the Church of believers hath the same positive power of Government intrinsecal without their officers, and onely fathers who begat them to Christ, to use the Keyes, and formally to excommunicate them, as a free City hath over their Magistrates.

2. If the officers die, sure the organical Church dies, and the organical, and the ministerial and politick essence of that visible Church, as it is totum integrale, dies.

2. I retort the Argument. When the Church of the Jews, Acts 13. & 18. turns heretical, and blasphemes, and refuses to be the married wife (I speak in our Brethrens language) if the Church of officers reject them, and turn to others, it shall not follow.

1. That the officers destroy their own husbandly power, while they labour their own preservation: which is the great absurdity that Mr. H. puts upon Mr. R. as enough to cast the cause.

2. Shall it follow, That the officers without the people, or governing without, yea contrary to their consent, is a true visible Church? in no sort.

Mr. H. When the tents are removed, they are not the shepherds tents: to remove the candlestick is to remove the Ministery, and * 1.17 remove all the Officers, the Church is not a body visible eating one bread, 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. So Mr. R. But Mr. H. answers, Yet they are called tents fit to receive shepherds, and are the same they were before the shepherds were chosen, and remain the same: To remove the candlestick is to remove the Ministery, because Mini∣stery and Ministers have their dependence on the Church; destroy the man the whole, you destroy the parts; but it holds not contrariwise: its true in a Ministerial Church, i. e. an organicum totum, when you take away any part, you lame the integrity of it; but you de∣destroy

not the essence of it, as it is totum essentiale.

Ans. It is enough to me, if ye remove all Officers and Shep∣herds, it is no ruling Church, though the fitness of choice (which is no act of government) do still remain; yet the fitness to or∣dain and to excommunicate remains not, for they never had it; Luke distinguishes the one from the other, Acts 6. 3, 5. the mul∣titude 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, chused not the Apostles; but the twelve Apo∣stles, * 1.18 not the multitude, ordained them by praying and laying on of hands, v 6. as the Elders do, and they only, in the New Testament, 1 Tim. 4. 14. 1 Tim. 5. 22.

2. It is good that Mr. H. grants that to remove the Candle∣stick, is to remove the minist•…•…y; I hope he means the shining, burning, and guiding Ministers and Watchmen, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. Mat. 5. 14. Ioh. 5. 35. But in the other page 91, 32. It is cross to all mens apprehensions (saith he) that the Candlestick should include Candles and Lamps.

3. Nor is it true in Mr. H. his way, that to remove the candle∣stick, is to remove the Ministry; for there remaineth a preach∣ing and a praying Church (which is at the ordaining of Offi∣cers, and sending them, Act. 1••15. & 6. 24. Act. 13. 1, 2, 3. Act. 6. 6.) which doth only make and unmake officers, saith Mr. H.

4. Destroy the whole (saith he) and you destroy the parts; but it holds not, contrariwise: why not contrariwise? if you destroy all the parts (otherwise the Logick is naught) take away eyes, and ears, and hands, and feet, and all the integral parts, or all the essential parts, and you destroy the whole, in any sense; too much of this Logick Mr. H. gives us.

5. Take away (saith he) in an Organick or Ministerial body a member, you lame the integrity. Now the ministry and offi∣cers are removed by the people, because they are heretical, as Mr. H. teacheth page 90. I pray you, remains there a ministe∣rial or organick body? no, saith M. H. there remains a homo∣geneous body.

4. Take away any part, you lame the integrity; take then away the ministry, you lame the body. O Logick! the ministry is a separable adjunct to Mr. H. page 92. Here it is an integral part; is an integral part an adjunct? is the eye an adjunct of

the organical body? is the integrity hurt, because a separable adjunct is removed?

5. Nor is this true, take away any part in an organical body, and you lame the integrity; it is only true of an organical part, not of any part; take away ten members, believers only, the Church remaineth an entire, and unlamed integral body: let ten free members of a City be removed by death, yet the City remains an unmaimed entire body of Citizens, ruled by Major and Aldermen.

6. Remove the ministry, the essence and organical body re∣maineth not.

Mr. H. That which is added, is more beside the cause; It is gran∣ted * 1.19 where Officers are not, there is no communion of the Sacraments, is there therefore no Church-communion?

Ans. If this communion be removed, there is no communion of the Church, which being many members, is one body, 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. & 12. 12, 13. And what reason but a Church, and the only instituted visible Church in the new Testament, as the book of Discipline of N. E. makes it, should be a complete Church * 1.20 in being and operation, and partake of all Church-communion, though it want the officers, which are to Mr. H. but poor harm∣less separable adjuncts? page 92. and this is somewhat for the cause.

M. H. We have done now with the first Quere, and made it clear, That this Church is before all Officers, and may be without them.

Ans. So Mr. H. hath done, and made it as clear as midnight darkness, with whole two Arguments, the one whereof is a poor Grammatication, and scarce that, and the other a begging of the question; that there is a ruling Church before, and with∣out officers, which may make and unmake officers.

CHAP. II.

Of the Nature and Being of a Presbyterial Church.

Mr. H. The qualification of the Church as totum essentiale, * 1.21 in the order and pr••cedency of it, in regard of her true Of∣ficers we have dispatched. Now we speak of it in comparison with a Presbyterian Church.

Ans. Let not then the Reader exprest any visible Church or∣ganical to be spoken of; Organs are but separable adjuncts, the only Church spoken of, and acknowledged by Mr. H. and our brethren, is an homogeneal Church of onely believers, which Mr. H. now calls the Church, before he called it a Church, and this Church, page 94. but we ask the question whether the word Church, Mat. 18. 17. Tell the Church, 1 Cor. 1. 2. Unto the Church of God which is at Corinth. And 2 Cor. 1. 1. 1 Thes. 1. 1. 2 Tim. 2. 15. be this congregational Church without the separa∣ble adjuncts of officers: and the truth is, the place Matth. 18. The principal copy of the Independent Church, can mean no Church according to our brethrens way: for no reason can say * 1.22 that the Keys of the Kingdom of Heaven, Matth. 16 19. and the power of binding and loosing. Matth. 18. 17, 18. are given to the separable adjuncts of the Church: but such are the officers, saith Mr. H. page 92. and to such as are no essential parts of the in∣stituted Church, and of the only visible Church of the New Testament. But M. H. makes it clear, as he sayes, that the Con∣gregational Church is before the Officers, and may be, and is without them, therefore officers can be no essential parts of the Church of the New Testament. And so this Church void of Officers, must be to our brethren, the first and principal sub∣ject of all Government, Rule, Keyes, Officers, and what not?

Mr. H. being to evert Presbyterial Government, he begins * 1.23 at the Pillars.

The Presbyterian Church consists of three Pillars.

1. There must be several congregations, made entire of such members to make up an integral body of Rulers and Ruled.

Ans. There is a crack in this Pillar, it is not essential to a Presbyterian Church that all the congregation be entire, and for∣med * 1.24 Churches, having their own Officers distinct from the offices of others, we cannot determine that Matthias had a determinate flock, to which onely he was a fixed Pastor, and Peter another, and Iohn a third; we rather judge the whole twelve fed in com∣mon, sometimes in one congregation, in this house, dayly, and sometimes in another; but all the huge thousands could not feed in one house, otherwise many congregations framed and fixed, or not framed and fixed, are all under one Presbytery, as the Learned and Reverend Assembly at Westminster teacheth. If the Pillars be dreams, the house that M. H. storms is also a dream.

To the second Pillar we shall speak hereafter, if the Lord will.

3. These Churches send Rulers, by way of delegation, to whom they submit.

Ans. This also is a faulty Pillar.

1. They so send as they may be present to hear, dispute, dis∣sent, to what is amiss, nor are the Pastors delegates.

2. They submit to them not simply.

But first, reserving judgement of discretion.

Secondly, and with liberty to appeal.

3. The whole Elders of six congregations in a City may all meet in one common Presbytery, without any delegation; and that is a Presbyterial Church, as is the meeting of a Congrega∣tional Eldership.

Mr. H. To their power of Iurisdiction the Churches must sub∣mit—but it ariseth from a power of order or office to preach.

Ans. Well said, then cannot they exercise the highest acts of jurisdiction, to excommunicate all the Elders, as Mr. H. saith, page 92. they do, for the people hath no power of order or of∣ficial power to preach the Gospel, and administer the Seals, page 92. and yet Mr. H. saith, they may communicate all their officers.

Mr. H. There is a Iurisdiction official that issues onely from the office, this the officers have.

Answ. This Lenitive is a Corrosive. Here is the matter, the people have jurisdiction, and do excommunicate, but not by an official jurisdiction, but by another power: So a Midwife bapti∣zeth in the Roman Church, but not by a power of Order, as a Priest, but its valid. An Usurper judgeth, but not by a power derived from the Royall Power of the Soveraigne Ru∣ler.

2. By what Scripture can any power of the Keyes given by Christ onely to the Church of believers, be given to separable adjuncts of the Church?

Mr. H. None is a steward, unless appointed over the Family by Christ, 1 Cor. 12. 27, 28. Hence Papists and Prelats erre, officers and offices are coronation-mercies, and proceed from Christs ascension, Eph. 4. 11, 12.

2. They are means of worship instituted by him.

3. He onely can blesse them.

Answ. 1. None are stewards to put in and put out stewards and excommunicate them, but such as are appointed of God: But believers without officers are no stewards at all.

2. Censuring and excommunicating is an authoritative way of edifying, 2 Cor. 10. 8. 1 Cor. 5. 4, 5. 1 Thess. 3. 14. shew in * 1.25 all the Word, where believers and private Christians are to edi∣fie and build up in the faith their Pastors, and that in an autho∣ritative way. The people so must

2. Be coronation-mercies, and gifts given of Christ, ascen∣ding to heaven for the perfecting of the Pastors, and the work of the Ministery, to gather in Apostles, Evangelists, Pastors to Christ. Whereas the Text saith the contrary, That Pastors were given to gather in the people, and the people, or unofficed Brethren, were not given to gather in Apo∣stles.

3. If Excommunication be a Worship administred by the Brethren upon Pastors; then must a promise be made to un∣officed Brethren, who excommunicate, Behold, I send you, as Matth. 10. 16. This we reade not.

Mr. H. He that is called and appointed an officer according to God and the Rules of the Gospel, as he needs no other power but that of his office, to authorize him to execute it; So there is no power by rule or right that can hinder him in the due execu∣tion thereof.

Ans. This is a ground against both Episcopacy and Presbyte∣ry. Presbyters may preach in other congregations than their own, if they be officers over it, as Bishops may in many con∣gregations. * 1.26

2. The Pastor, if called of God, may do his office, without horrowing a power from the Pastor of pastors to do it; but he must preach hic & nunc in an orderly way, upon a day, and time of the day appointed by the Church.

3. He hath an office to preach and administer the seales any where, yet must he have the call by desire, consent, or some other way, before he can do it in another congrega∣tion.

4. Nor can he rule or administer censures as his alone, extra collegium, without the authoritative concurrence of the Elders, and tacit consent of the people, though he be an appointed officer of Christ. So this ground is weak. Other weak grounds we shall consider after.

CHAP. III.

The Arguments of Mr. H. against the Presbyterian Churches are removed as weak.

MR. H. Arg. 1. If the Churches combined have no more * 1.27 power than they had before they were combined, they can ex∣ercise no more Iurisdiction than before; and therefore have no Presbyterian power, are no Presbyterian Churches.

But they have no more power after their combination, than be∣fore: Ergo.

The Assumption, where the doubt onely lies, is made out thus: They who have no more office and officers than they had be∣fore, they have no more jurisdiction; as in the first ground, power of jurisdiction flows from power of office. But they have no more officers, for each send their own; therefore they have no more power.

Ans. Mr. H. says, The doubt is onely in the assumption, and * 1.28 takes the proposition for undeniable: The major is false; for by this argument, two single congregations each a hundred in number, lying so near as they may most conveniently meet, can∣not lawfully unite in one Church, for the better attaining the end of Christ, which is edification: for say they be the same number of offices and officers, then they can exercise no more power of jurisdiction, after the combination over two hundred, than each of them did over one hundred. But the Conclusion is absurd. Yea, this Argument destroys the Synod, Acts 15. for suppose the number of offices and officers to be equal in the Synod, after the Synodical combination, and in the Church of either Antioch onely, or Ierusalem onely, before the combina∣tion, which is a facile and ordinary supposition; then they can exercise no more Synodical power (it matters not what be the

kinde, whether of power of jurisdiction, or not) after the combination of these Churches than before; and so the judge∣ment of a Synod should be no more than the judgement of a Congregation. But the consequence is absurd. Let Mr. H. see to it, and deal with Mr. Cotton to answer him.

2. To the Proposition. If the Churches combined have no more power extensively, feeding a larger number after the com∣bination than before, then they can exercise no more jurisdiction, no more, by way of extension; it is false: for their united power is extended to a larger number now, then the divided power was before to each single flock. If the Churches combined have more power intensively, of the same species and nature after the combination than before, then they can exercise no more jurisdiction intensively than before. Its true, it is the same power of Christ, the same valid Excommunication, the same binding and loosing as to the specifick nature of binding and loosing, that is exercised by five Churches in a City, and exercised by ten Churches about. We multiply not species, to make all con∣gregations to differ in nature and specie, as Mr. H. doth a∣gainst Logick; whereas they have the same essentials, Christ the Head, the same Ordinances, Seals, the same Faith; but then it shall never follow, Therefore they have no Presbyterian power over many Churches, and therefore they are not distinct Presbyterian Churches in local distinction; magis & minus non variant speci∣ous. Nor are Presbyterian, and Provincial and National Chur∣ches different in nature, but onely in extent of Jurisdi∣ction.

3. Its a wide mistake, That a Presbyterian Church hath its formal essence from a voluntary actual combination in such * 1.29 bounds, or such a circuit more or less: that is not a Pillar of Presbyterian Churches; for their near association, by dwelling where they may edifie or scandalize one another, gives them right to be an associated Church, not simply habitation, but the habitation of such and such professors in covenant with God, baptized, and giving themselves up in profession to Christ as disciples, before there be a formal consent, they are obliged to associate: yea, nor doth that voluntary combination make a Presbyterial Church.

Mr. H. Arg. 2. If the Presbyterian Ministers have Iuris∣diction, * 1.30 then, over all the Churches of the combination, or onely ••ver some; not over some onely, for that is against the definition of a Presbyterian Church: Therefore they must have Iurisdiction over all the Churches, ten or sixteen. If they have Iurisdiction over all these, then they are Officers, Pastors, Teachers, Ruling-Elders in office to them all; for there must be an office, and so of∣ficer before Iurisdiction; and there is no Iurisdiction exercised but by an officer. To say they are Pastors of them all, is to make a road and ready way for Pluralities, Non-Residencies.

Ans. Mr. H. gives us, as also the Dissenting Brethren in * 1.31 the Assembly at Westminster did, in stead of Scrip••ure, a num∣ber of supposed incongruities, which with equal weight fall upon their own way, as upon ours. For suppose that the twelve Apostles, Act. 2. & 4. & 6. for divers years were Pa∣stors to the many thousands that made up divers, eight or ten congregations, who daily convened from house to house, Act. 4. 46. & 5. 42. in Ierusalem; and that all the twelve feed all the ten congregations in common, Matthias not being a fixed Pastor to this congregation more than to this; nor Peter a fixed Pastor to this flock rather than to this, which is a thing most or∣dinary in great Cities, where there be 12 Flocks, and 24 Pastors, and variety of gifts by interchange, proves more edifying. All the Pastors have jurisdiction, yea and Pastoral charge over eve∣ry one of the twelve. Then 2. must they be Pastors and Teachers to every one of the twelve, and because all the 24 cannot every one of them be residents and dwellers in all and every congregation of the ten or twelve Churches in Ierusa∣lem, (that is physically impossible) here shall be Pluralities and Non-residents, and that which our Brethren call Diocesan Pre∣lates here.

2. That the Presbyterial preachers be pastors and teachers, habitu, and actu primo, and in common to all the Churches of the combination, in acts of common concernment, though they be not actu secundo, actual labourers, proper and fixed pastors, residents and dwellers in every congregation (for that was physically impossible to the Elders of Ierusalem) to all and every congregation, is not absurd, but necessary; and the

charge of Pluralities, and Prelatical Non-residents, follows by no Logick, except you call the twelve Apostles, who preached fixedly at Ierusalem some years, Non-residents, because that they could not every one of them dwell in every family of so many thousands at once: In which sense, multitudes of Independent Ministers shall be Non-residents; and suppose there shall be a common Treasury to pay the labourers their wages, and that collected out of the goods of all the thousands so combined, the Independent Ministers upon the same account must be Plu∣ralists, and receive wages from many, to whom they neither are nor can be fixed, and proper and peculiarly feeding Pa∣stors.

3. Wisdome may forbid the Brethren to use this Argument, There is no jurisdiction exercised, but by an officer: for the whole people, men and women, the onely Church instituted in the New Testament, or their unofficed Male Church, the Fra∣ternity exercise the highest Jurisdiction, and excommunicate all their officers, and yet they are not officers by their own principles.

Mr. H. Mr. R. denies the Assumption, That they bear the relation of proper Pastors to every one of these Congregations.

Mr. H. Proper Pastors they must be to all. If the relation of Eldership to a Classical Church be founded upon the same office that a Pastor hath to his particular congregation, then the Elders bear that same relation of Watchmen to a Classical Church, which a Pastor doth to a particular flock: for where there is the same office of a Pastor, there is the same relation of Watchman and Pa∣stor, the one issuing from the other. But the first is said by Mr. R. Lib 2. 335. also they put forth authoritative acts, which issue onely from proper Pastors, they are proper Pastors to those upon whom they can exercise such acts, else they had no warrant to put them forth.

Answ. I yet in this sense deny the assumption, that they are proper Pastors, that is, actual imployers of their labours of fee∣ding, both by fixed teaching and governing, to all the flocks of the classical Church; for that is unpossible, except they could be in many Congregations at once so feeding. But I deny not, but constantly teach, that the Presbyterian Pastors are properly,

that is, formally, essentially, habitu, actu primo, Pastors in relati∣on * 1.32 to all the flocks, not of the classical Church only, but of all the visible Churches on earth. As a Physician by covenant actu∣ally imployed to attend all the sick of such a City, suppose Nor∣wich, is their proper Physician, yet so as he is essentially a Phy∣sician to all in England, who shall by providence employ him. An exquisite Gardener by paction, is a proper Gardener to such a man who conduces or hires him a certain time, to labour such a plot of ground, yet so as essentially and actu primo, he is a Gardener to all the Country round about who shall employ him. So is one a proper School-master to teach Grammar and Rhetorick to the children of such a City, yet so as he is a School-master to all the children of the country who shall employ him. Christ sends his Pastor Archippus intentionally to feed all his flocks in all fields, and he is essentially a Pastor to them all; but for the more convenient attaining of Christs end, he fixes him by the choice of the people to the Church of Coloss, not as a Husband to a Wife.

2. Mr. H. With his little finger aims not to twitch the pro∣bation of this.

1. Where there is the same office of Pastor, there is the same re∣lation of Watchman and Pastor. It is false, a Physician, a Pastor providentially fixed to cure and feed this City by special cove∣nant, hath a more near relation to cure and feed this City; ha∣ving a twofold relation, both by the calling in general of a Phy∣sician and Pastor, and by a special solemn oath, and hand-writ to this City; and both the Physician is the same publick Physi∣cian, and the Pastor the same publick Watchman officio, by of∣fice essentially, habitu, actu primo, to all the sick bodies and sick souls in the country. A mother is the same mother to ten chil∣dren, but hath a special relation to the eldest as her heir.

2. As born with more pain and labour then all the other nine.

3. As more dearly loving him then all the other nine. Here is the same place, the same officer, but sundry particular rela∣tions.

3. Mr. H. leaves that unproved, the Presbyterian Pastors cannot put forth authoritative acts Pastoral, but hoc ipso, they must

be proper, i. e. their fixed Pastors, and made theirs by the particu∣lar * 1.33 choice of the people to feed and govern these, toward who•• they put forth these pastoral acts; because indeed it is adultery to them who are no husbands, to put forth pastoral acts of go∣verning, upon those to whom they are not fixed Pastors; ye•• they tender the Supper to forraign members; and so this is a rot∣ten pillar of this way.

2. Forsaken by Mr. Cotton, and the way of the Churches of N. E. and by Mr. H. himself.

3. It destroys Synods and all communion of Churches; for Mr. Cotton yeildeth, as truth of the Gospel taught by a Minister of the Gospel, bindeth to faith and obedience, not only because it is Gospel, but because also it is taught by a Minister, for his calling sake, seeing Christ hath said, whoso receiveth you, receiveth me; they bind not only materially, but formally, for the Synods sake. I see not how this can be answered, though indeed the Discipline of N. E. and Mr. H. say the contrary both of this and their own grounds; for Elders in Synods put forth authoritative and pa∣storal acts, to these Churches of which these Elders are not proper and fixed Pastors; but Pastors they are to these Churches, as to all the Churches of the combination, else they cannot war∣rantably put forth acts pastoral, for their feeding and govern∣ing to edification, except it be said, a Synod is no ordinance of Christ; which all the Brethren and Mr. H. himself deny. All acknowledge a Synod to be an ordinance of Christ. But the truth is, they but mock the Reader in so saying, for they give no more to it, but an act of charity, to counsel, as one brother coun∣sels another: Intuitu charitatis, saith the Discipline of New England. And so Mr. H.

For, what 1. availes it more to say a Synod is an Ordinance of God, because they can give a charitative counsel, then to say one single Believer is an Ordinance of God, or a Woman who can counsel a man? The Synod then is no positive Ordinance of divine institution; for upon the same ground, if a Synod be an Ordinance of God, because they may counsel the Churches, we may appoint a new Ordinance of a Synod. For, first, one refuting. Another for rebuking. A third for confirming. And a fourth for comforting.

2. It is but a mocking of the world, to say the association of Churches is an ordinance of God, for they can give counsel to the Churches of the bounds (what may be replied, had I time, is soon washed away.)

But first, so can twenty other Churches without the bounds * 1.34 of these Churches; so can many eminent Christians in another Congregation, not in office, give a counsel by way of charity to a Synod convened synodically, shal they for that be a Synod of a Synod? and shall they be an Ordinance of Christ distinct from a Congregational Church for that?

Yea, Abigail a woman, a captive maid, gave, the one a divine counsel to David, and the other to Naaman the Syrian. Shall women therefore be made new ordinances of God? and if nei∣ther the one counsel nor the other have any weight from the givers of the counsel, but only from the word; it is in vain to name the one an ordinance of God, more then the other: as for reverence to the persons, a Synod of Elders, more then one single mans counsel, adds not the eighth part of a feather as touching authoritative weight to the Counsel, if the Synods counsel amount to nothing more in point of a divine ordinance; then Mr. H. saith, any Counsel may lay a burthen upon any * 1.35 mans conscience; so any Christian that shall publish and preach that 1 Cor. 6. 18. flee fornication—may lay a burthen upon eve∣ry soul, not from the authority of him that speaks, but because it is Scripture that is spoken; and this is all the authority of Sy∣nods. Would the Lord appoint Men, Elders, and Brethren, and Churches to come many hundred miles to heal rent and spoyled Churches, and the result of all is a meer counsel which a woman at home may give? for the Scripture by the law of Nature warrants women to give this as well as men, 2 Sam. 20. 16, 17—21, 22. 1 Sam. 25. 25, 26, 27.—32, 33, 34. 2 King. 5. 3, 4, 13. And God reveals to women, servants, poor ones, as much of this as to others of higher place.

Nor shall it help the matter, to say, it is safer to seek counsel from men then from women, from many then from one; for in the multitude of counsellers there is safety.

Ans. It is true.

But 1. This is no ground to seek to a Synod of Fathers and

Elders of the bounds of these, who are no Pastors nor Elders to us, and can put forth upon us no Synodical, no Pastoral acts; upon this ground, we should select Counsellors out of one or many Churches, that have no relation to us; and so this is no∣thing for such a Synod, but only for many gracious Counsel∣lors, private or publick, nothing at all for a Synod of El∣ders.

2. When all is done, their Counsel is but a Counsel, that hath as much weight, as it hath conformity with the rule of the Word, and so hath the counsel of a Woman, or a servant. And it is considerable that the book of Discipline of New England hath no Chapter nor Discourse of Synods, which shews they little value them.

Mr. H. These authoritative actt which are put forth in other * 1.36 Churches issue from him, either as a Pastor, or as no Pastor; If as no Pastor, then acts of Iurisdiction may flow from him that is no Ruler. Mr. R. will gain-say this, if they proceed from him as Pa∣stor, then either as Pastor of his own Church, which cannot be; or of another Church, and then one man may have two Pastoral offi∣ces. And all these Churches must be either his flock, or not: his flock they must be, if he be Shepherd to them, for that the nature of relatives requires, the combined Churches are many distinct flocks, and he cannot be a Pastor of many flocks.

Ans. This is the former argument with a new dress, quod fui•• demonstrandum. But did Mr. H. believe his Topick probabilities would be received for demonstrations?

1. To that, These acts proceed from him either as Postor, or as no Pastor. Let him be a Pastor to a Congregation compassed * 1.37 about with nine single Congregations in Ierusalem, in conveni∣ent nearness, he feeds his own particular flock, as a fixed Pastor actually imploying his constant labours upon them, and by the same pastoral office, as Pastor habitu, actu primo, to all Churches, and more nearly to these nine, he exercises acts of government for edifying all the ten in points of concernment, which neces∣sarily must concern them all; and it no more doth follow by a shadow of consequence, that he exerciseth two pastoral offices over many Churches, then the same Pastor exerciseth three Pastoral offices, or four over his own particular flock, as if it

were four flocks, because he preacheth pastorally to some, and administers the Lords Supper to others, as to strangers.

2, Others as Infants, he baptizes as unconfirmed mem∣bers. Or,

3. Others he excommunicates.

4. Others he converts as finding them no visible Saints; by one and the same office he feeds and governs all.

2. The same argument is retorted, Archippus administers the Lords Supper (as Mr. H. his book of Discipline, and Mr. Cot∣ton * 1.38 teach, and the word warrants him to do) to fourty godly visible Saints out of fourty Sister-Congregations, either as a Pastor, or no Pastor, to these fourty; either as to his own flock, or not his own flock, not as no Pastor. Mr. H. Mr. Cotton (ex∣cept they follow Socinians) and all shall gainsay that; if as a pa∣stor, then by Mr. Hookers argument, he must have Pastoral offi∣ces over fourty Churches. So the same argument destroys the Synods, though some way soundly established by Mr. Cotton; * 1.39 yea, Mr. H. grants it is lawful to tender the seal of the Lords Supper to those of other Congregations, yea, he is warranted by the word so to do, 1 Cor. 10. 16, 17. 1 Cor. 12. 13. Eph. 2. 12, 13. Eph. 4. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 11, 12, 13. It is against the Congrega∣tional way; and it is not equal to bring, quod fuit demonstran∣dum, such strong demonstrations (as he calls them) against Mr. R. and the Presbyterian Church, which destroyes his own con∣gregational way.

3. If he act as a Pastor and Shepherd to them, his flock they must be, for that the nature of Relatives require. This is a mistake of the nature of Relatives; for the adequate and complete corre∣late to which every ordinary pastor is referred as a Shepherd to the flock, as a husband to the wife, actu primo, is all the Churches on earth, as a physician is referr'd to all the sick on earth, not ad∣equatly to this one sick person, but actu secundo, in the actual ex∣ercises of the ministerial calling, very pastor indeed now is refer'd to one flock, as a fixed providential feeder, and to these round about, the same way in acts of government that concern associ∣ate Churches: but it follows not, as is said, that he is a proper fixed pastor to these Churches round about; for these words, feed the flock, which is 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, amongst you, 1 Pet 5. 1. & Act.

20. 28. Take heed to all the flock over which the Holy Ghost hath made you Overseers, Have no such sense as feed the one single Congregation only, as a husband to your wife, that is in Ephesus, and beware of the spiritual adultery, of taking pastoral care of the other Churches of Christ that are, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, amongst you. Mr. Cotton saith, the Church in the Canticles (and say I, the pa∣stors also) take care not only for her own members, but for her little Sister, which she thought had no breasts, Cant. 8. 8. And I hence infer, that a pastor is to take a pastoral care of the Churches associate, Acts 8. 14. 2 Cor. 11. 16. for they were a∣mong them as well as the single congregation. And when Paul saith, take heed to the whole flock, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, he meaneth not only a single congregation, but divers congregations and many sheep in the flocks of divers congregations, as 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 sig∣nifieth not a few, but exceeding many in Scripture, Phil. 2. 21. 1 Tim. 2. 6. Heb. 2. 9. 1 Tim. 2. 4. Ioh. 11. 48. Ioh. 12. 32. Rev. 5. 13.

Mr. H. The Presbytery are Elders to the classical Church, saith Mr. R.) in some respect, not simply 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, not in things proper to * 1.40 each congregation, but in things common to all the united Churches, to wit, in things which rather concern the consociation of the thirty Churches (about) then the thirty Churches combined in particular. By our Saviours rule, Matth. 18. (saith Mr. H.) the offender is privately,

First, to be rebuked.

Secondly, then before two.

Thirdly, before the Church nearest the Congregation. The classi∣cal principles admit not this.

2. Suppose the man in his private fault continue obstinate, this obstinacy is re•• propria, proper to the Congregation, why may not the Congregation without the Presbytery then oast him out? for this pertinacy was made known only to the Congregation or Church.

Object. But the neighbouring Churches must avoid his compa∣ny upon knowledge given.

Answ. So must the Churches of another Presbytery or Classis, or of another Province, and therefore there is no more need the one should have a hand in the censure, then the other.

Ans. 1. The congregation in private scandals by our prin∣ciples * 1.41 (which Mr. H. it seems, knows not) doth admonish, and the offended person is to admonish, according to the order of Christ, Matth. 18.

2. Mr. H. taketh for granted, that the place Matth. 18. is a Rule for removing onely private scandals: 2. And that by the word (Church) Matth. 18. is meant onely his own Inde∣pendent congregation.

3. That Christ, Matth. 18 shews of no removing of scan∣dals between two visible Saints dwelling in one Christian fami∣ly, who by the principles of Mr. H. may by their own free choise be members of divers congregations: (a strange dream!)

4. He supposes it must be onely one single man that tres∣passeth against a brother, but if ten, or many sister-Churches transgress against sister-Churches. Learned Whitaker, Calvin, Beza, Pareus, all Protestant Divines, all Fathers, all learned Doctors, Papists, Lutherans, Doctors, Councels, all the Martyrs who by the Text Matth. 18. appeal to a General Councel, did but abuse the Text, in applying it to Synods: whereas Tell the Church, is now found to be onely the single congregation; whereas the contrary is sure. There is a figure

1. In thy brother, for he means many brethren, within or without the congregation.

2. By trespassing, by a Sydecdoche, he means all scandals; else we were not to complain of publicke scandals to the Church.

3. By the Church, he means all Churches respectively, as those of Antioch, in case of scandalous doctrine, Tell a Synod, Acts 15. 2. The obstinacy is not proper to that congregation, if publick, the offence of it stumbles the neighbouring Chur∣ches. But

4. It will not follow, that All of another Province should have * 1.42 hand in the censure, as well as the Presbytery, because those of another Province may hear of it, for that is non causa pro cau∣sa: for they are not in danger to be leavened, so as those that are nearer; and the wisdome of Christ hath accommodated Discipline to our bodily craziness. For as when there be twelve

thousand members at Ierusalem, he will not have them all to meet at one house, since they have twelve Apostles to teach them, but in sundry congregations, Acts 2. 46. & 5 42. not can they partake of the seals in one house, nor can they perso∣nally watch over one another, as the new Church-covenant teacheth: So neither will he have Elders 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, in cities, where many thousands were baptized, purging their own body, and its not to be supposed that actual government for ordinary scandals should be by the personal presence of the Elders of remote Presbyteries and Provinces, far less of the Elders of the whole Catholick visible Church. For Nature, Reason, and the practise of the Apostles would say, Except the scandal be more than ordinary wide and spreading, only the Churches nearest to be edified or stumbled, should have hand in healing and cen∣suring; though the whole Catholick and visible Church have also here some influence, to wit, tacit and virtual in that com∣mon Rule of Discipline which regulates the whole Catholick body, as is said hereafter.

Mr. H. The second difference assigned by Mr. R. is, that the Presbytery takes care rather of the regulating of the acts of go∣verning in all these Churches, than the governed Churches. * 1.43

Mr. H. They express their care in judicial acts, and that direct∣ly and immediately upon scandals and scandalous persons of any congregation.

Ans. Mr. H. should have added my words to the full, that the Reader might have seen my minde. What I speak compa∣ratively, Mr. H. would not hold it out to the Reader, as if I meant it absolutely. For

1. The Presbytery is glad that lesser evils be healed by Re∣bukes within the congregation.

2. I deny not but the Presbytery doth, and must directly and immediately judge greater scandals, especially between congre∣gation and congregation, between Elder and Elder, and Rulers and Ruled of the same congregation, but ever under the former Reduplication, as they are an associate body.

Mr. H. 3 Differ. The Presbyterian Elders are Elders to all the Churches, as the Elders themselves are in collegio Presbyte∣riali, * 1.44 and properly as they are in Court.

Ans. But I assume (saith Mr. H.) the Elders there are pro∣per Pastors of their own particular congregations; therefore they must (if at all) be so here. A Pastor in an Island cannot teach, admonish, excommunicate, but in coetu congregationali, or se∣vered from his Church, yet this hinders not but in these regards he is a proper Pastor to them.

Ans. Mr. H. yet halfs my words, and sets down one member * 1.45 of a distinction, and leaves out the other. They are Elders to the Churches in the Presbyterial Judicature; but separatim out of that (say I, pag. 326.) they do not watch in such a way for all the souls of the Presbyterian several congregations, as they do for the single congregations of which they are fixed Pastors. And this is enough to make different relations pastoral (which is my in∣tent) between the Elders, in order to their own congregations, and to the associated congregations, as the Elders of Antioch are Elders judging in the Synod, Acts 15. one way to Ierusa∣lem, and other to Antioch, where they have their proper fixed charge to teach and rule: and I shall not stand to yield that they act as Elders, and by the same office of Eldership in the Pres∣byterial, and in the congregational Judicature, but an acciden∣tal difference there is.

2. Its most unfound that Mr H. saith, That a Pastor cannot * 1.46 teach, admonish, excommunicate, but in a congregational meeting. This is first to make him a congregational Pope or Prophet, as the Papists do the Pope, onely in Cathedra, in the pulpit, or before the congregation. 2. All the dayes of the week, except in the actual congregational Assembly, he is a private man by this reason. But the Word shall warrant the pastor as a pastor to visit, to warn from house to house, Col. 1. 28. Acts 20 20. & 2. 46. & 5. 42. in season and out of sea∣son, 2 Tim. 4. 2. & 2. 25. for he does not these as a private gifted man.

3. By this reason a pastor is so a pastor, a husband, a watch∣man to the flock actually assembled onely, but not a pastor to give an account of this or that man or womans soul to God in the flock; then if this or that man perish through the fault of the Elder, who gave not warning, Mr. H. hath taught the Minister a good excuse: I cannot be charged as an unfaithful

watchman with the blood of this single man who is lost, Mr. H. saith, I am onely a Pastor in relation to the flock assembled Church-ways, but I am not a Pastor nor Watchman to one single man. But ah! this distinction shall not save the man from the charge of blood! Ezek. 3. 18, 19, 20, 21. & 33. 13, 14, 15. & 34. 4, 5. Heb. 13. 17. I would not have expected from such a mans pen such a Tenet.

4. Differ. The Presbytery hath a Church relation to all these * 1.47 thirty congregations not takin distributively, but collectively, as they are united in one Church classical, and in one Government. Ans. If the Presbytery put forth acts of Iurisdiction upon these Churches distributively, as they are severed, then they have a Church-relation to them distr••butively. But they admonish and censure several persons of several Churches.

Ans. 1. So do the Synod Elders at Ierusalem, Acts 15. put * 1.48 forth authoritative pastoral acts, by the grant of Mr. Cotton, upon the several Churches distributively taken, yet are they not the proper pastors of these Churches, and Commissioners of Parliament upon persons of a single city, but as they have fail∣ed not against the Laws of that city, but against the general Laws of the whole Nation and Parliament: But it follows not, that these Commissioners are Aldermen, or fixed Judges of that city; and so Mr. H. his consequence is weak.

Mr. H. These Presbyterial Elders must exercise jurisdiction over congregational Elders, which is conceived by Mr. R. to be absurd.

Ans. Pastors, with majority of official Jurisdiction over pastors of another lower species, as Bishops above pastors, I still look upon as absurd. But that Elders in a Synod exercise Jurisdiction over Elders of a congregation that are the same in nature and degree with them, is no more absurd, than for an Eldership of a congregation to exercise Jurisdiction over some two or three scandalous Elders of their own number, which Mr. H. will not call Episcopacy.

Mr. H. Mr. R. addes, Elders of an Independent congregation, are not Elders of their single congregations, being separated from their Courts. It seems a paradox, for if separated from their Court, their office remain, then jurisdiction must remain.

Ans. Its not a seeming, but a real paradox, my words are * 1.49 halfed. I said, They are not Elders separated from their court in the notion (these are my words omitted by Mr. H.) of the re∣lation of a Church-jurisdiction; for they can exercise no juris∣diction, neither excommunicate, nor relax from excommunica∣tion, being not in Court, except they be prelates.

But Mr. H. addes a real absurd paradox, that they cannot ex∣ercise pastoral acts of teaching, but in the Church-assembly; which refuted before.

Mr. H. 5 Differ. Congregational Elders have power of order, and power of jurisdiction without the Court, but they have not power of jurisdiction but in the Court. Elders have a power of jurisdiction as watchmen, but a power of Church-jurisdiction they have not, but in the Court.

Ans. I never heard that their entring into the assembly should * 1.50 adde a new power.

2. Nor did Mr. R. say, their entring and sitting in the Court addeth a new official power; they had the official power actu primo before, but they can no more put it forth in acts, being separated from the Court, than a pastor might excommunicate his alone in his private chamber; which were tyrannical and null.

Mr. H. The example of the great Sanhedrim toucheth not the cause, or then destroyeth it: Nor doth the example of Commissio∣ners of Parliament; for they get a new office to sit in Parliament, but an Elder of a congregation by sitting in the Presbytery gets no new office.

Ans. It is a weak answer, to say it helps not, and not shew * 1.51 the cause, but to lead the Reader implicitly: for the great San∣hedrim ruled over all the Tribes, and yet a Judge out of the Tribe of Dan, though a member of the Sanhedrim, did not rule over the Tribe of Benjamin, but onely in the Sanhedrim, and in some common cases. The getting of a new office is nei∣ther up nor down; the Commissioners of Parliament rule in that Court over all the Shires in the Land, and by that Com∣mission every Commissioner becomes not a Major of every City, or a Judge in every Shire. And by Mr. Cottons grant, the Elders in a Synod exercise pastoral acts, and lay on bur∣thens,

Acts 15. upon the Churches, and get no new office thereby: But they do not for that become proper Elders and pastors over every single congregation in the bounds of the Synod.

Yet to Mr. H. this is a principle, That if the Presbyterian Elders put forth pastoral acts upon all the congregations, then must they be pastors to all the particular flocks, for shep∣herd and flick are relatives, Arg. 2. 101. But the Conclusion is absurd. This is no less against Mr. Cotton, than against Mr. R. and against himself, who admits strangers to the Lords Supper, &c.

Mr. H. It is obvious to every man, that the Elder of the con∣gregation hath the nature of an Elder in general, and so can and doth put forth general actions, that are common to other Elder. Where the act is, the object must be, in its proportion; and all this he doth without the Classis in his particular station: for the species determines the act of the genus, as Socrates confines the acts of the humans Nature to himself: and its known, the Clas∣sis meddles with the particular offences, that are as special as any Elder in an Island, doth meddle within his owne place.

Ans. 1. Its obvious to all men, That Mr. H. speaks new Logick, obvious to the understanding of no man, I doubt, to his own. For the Elders of a congregation, because indepen∣dent, and subordinate and countable to none on earth, but to Iesus Christ (as Papists say of their wooden Head the Anti∣christ) determine within themselves. Suppose they he but some twelve of the twelve thousands at Ierusalem, if these be once a formal Covenant-wise married Church of people and officers, they do determine of the Doctrine of Circum∣cision, of the Doctrine of Balaam, Acts 15. Rev. 2. 14. (for Pergamos is to them an independent flock) and of Arrianism, and of Doctrines and Scandals that concern many hundred Churches about; and whether they determine right or wrong, its against the liberty and power Christ hath given to that Re∣deemed Body, of ten and twelve to tell the Churches: Oh! they must not part with their Soveraignty so; or if they consult, its but of courtesie: for, single Pergamus is re∣buked

(say our Brethren) for not using their Church-power in a Doctrine that concerned thousands as well as them.

2. What a mystery of Logick this may be, who is so happy * 1.52 as to divine? Every particular Elder can, and doth put forth general actions that are common to other Elders: Why? The species determines the act of the genus. The Reason contra∣dicts the Conclusion which it is brought to prove: For if So∣crates confines the acts of Humane Nature to himself, they leave off now to be general actions, and by being contracted to the species (his species is Socrates a single person) they are now most special actions.

Mr. H. takes our meaning to be, That the members of Sy∣nods and of the Presbytery, determine of the Ideal, general, abstracted Nature of Men, of Doctrines, of Actions in com∣muni, that needs not (saith he) for the congregational Elders put forth general actions, but confined and contracted to Socra∣tes: So doth the Classis, the National, yea the Oecumenick and General Assembly put forth acts, determinations, both of general Doctrines, and condemn them also, as confined and contracted to Socrates, to Balaam, to Iezabel, to the Nicolaitans, and to the single men of that impure Sect. And Acts 15. 24. the Synod condemns some certain particular, individual men, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, Some men from us have troubled you, and said, Ye must be circumcised. Now the abstracted na∣ture of men disputed not and made not the 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 and the rent, as v. 6, 7. but some single men. And this comes from an∣other wilde notion of Logick that Mr. H. teacheth, That the Catholick visible Church is the Genus, and under it is this or that Independent Church. Of this hereafter. S•• the Church of Boston is the Catholick integral Church: for, G••nus praedicatur de specie.

Mr. H. Its as undeniable, there be general acts in preaching and watching, which are common to all congregations, which the Presbytery neither do, nor can dispense conscienciously, be∣cause the Pastor cannot attend them: It will not suffice to say, He was Pastor to the Catholick Church before, for then before the combination he had as good power to exercise jurisdiction, as

any of them. This is against Mr. R. who grants that one Church hath not power over another.

An. 1. Its undeniable, That the Apostles who were Pastors of the Catholick Church, could not attend acts of Teaching and Ruling in all the single Congregations, for that is phy∣sically impossible. But Mr. H. saith, Its morally impossible, and unlawful for a pastor to put forth a pastoral act in any Congregation, but that to which he is married, more than a man can perform marriage-duties to any but to his own wife: * 1.53 which is shameful Doctrine.

2. Mr. H. frequently deviseth Objections of straw, and then fires them at his pleasure, He knows Mr. R. denies, that to be a pastor of the Catholick Church, gives so right to the Apostle to preach and feed in Bithynia, but there was need of a call of God going before, as is clear, Acts 16. and so must pastors of the Catholick Church now have a call from Presby∣tery and Congregation, before they can lawfelly put forth in act their general pastorship which they have to the Catholick Church. Nor is this against the Church not having power over a sister-Church, because a pastor of one Congregation hath power joyntly in a Synod to exercise pastoral acts Synodical over many Churches.

CHAP. IV.

The following Arguments of Mr. H. against a Presbyterian Church are removed. That the classical Elders separate Ruling from Teaching, are Prelates, non-Residents and Pluralists, and what not, by Mr. H. his way.

MR. H. That course which severs which God hath joined * 1.54 together is unlawful. But the classical combination doth this. Ruling and teaching belong to the office of a Pastor and Teacher, they have the prwer of the Keys, and there cannot be full binding and loosing, but by ruling and t••aching, Act. 20. 28. 1 Pet. 5. 1, 2.

2 Both binding and loosing are required as nec••ssary to Christs end, the gathering and perfecting of the Saints, Eph. 4. 12.

Ans. The assumption may import that the Presbytery must be Rulers, and by office, no Teachers, as the Prelate is, who by ma∣jority of power is the rule of the Pastors, and they his Deputies; the so severing of teaching and ruling in the subject cannot be charged upon us, but that the severing of them in regard of the object, is no sort of dividing of those which God hath joined, is clear; because the Pastors teach some, and rule in common o∣thers * 1.55 associate. And Mr. H. hath not proved the assump∣tion.

For, 1. Elders in Synods dogmatically and authoritatively * 1.56 teach, as Mr. H. teacheth, par. 4. pag. 5. conclus. 3. therefore Mr. H. himself separateth teaching and ruling. And Mr. Cotton saith more.

2. The people without officers may excommunicate all their officers, and so bind them, and receive them in again upon their repentance, and so loose them, as Mr. H. teacheth par. 1, c. 9. pag. 92, 93. and yet the people cannot teach these officers

as their Pastors. Is not here an irregular separating of ruling from teaching?

3. Such of the flock as are from their youth kept under by the terrors of God, Ps. 88. Godly Elders, who are not to be re∣buked, but intreated as fathers, 1 Tim. 5. 1. need not juridical Church-binding and loosing, and yet need the preaching of the promises. Then in regard of the act and object, exercise of ju∣risdiction may be severed from teaching.

4. Pastors can exercise no jurisdiction, but only in the Court, but Pastors not in Court may teach pastorally the whole flock.

5. The Churches that meet in a Synod, may exercise the pow∣er of non communion toward a Church (which is a Church-governing, for their edification) if the Church obstinately main∣tain an heresie; and yet the Churches so convened cannot pa∣storally teach this Church. Let Mr. H. see if he be not as prela∣tical as Mr. R. If this be Prelacy, I thought Mr. H. had been better versed in the doctrin•• of Prelacy.

Mr. H. Grand-fathers and Fathers do bear a relation to the same Children divers ways (So Mr. R.) So then as a Grand-father (saith Mr. H.) cannot be both a Grand-father and a Father to the same * 1.57 Child, neither can an Elder be both a proper Elder and a classical Elder to the same Congregation.

Answ. One man cannot be both a Grand-father and a Father to the same Child. True; nor is one man a proper Elder to his Congregation, and a classical Elder to his own Congregation; for he is formally a classical Elder, not to his own, but to all the associated Congregations.

2. It is but a comparison, and so admits of halting; a Grand-father is a Grand-father to his childrens children, but a Father to his nearest children; so the same man is a classical Elder to all the associated Churches, and a proper and providentially fixed Elder to his own flock; as one was both a Priest to judge between blood and blood, and yet, if the matter was too hard, the same man was a Judge and a Member of the Sanhedrim, Deut. 17.

Mr. H. his last difference: The Iudicature of Classis and Con∣gregations * 1.58 do not differ formally (saith Mr. R.) but onely in more or lesse extension of power.

Ans. Then there are no specifical acts that the one puts forth, but the other can put forth, as occasion shall require; gradus non va∣riant speciem, then they can ordain officers and excommunicate in the Congregation. He said before, if there be the same office, there is the same definition, and the same causes, to wit, of election, and choice of the Classical, and of the Congregational Elders.

Ans. The difference is only of more or less, as of a River and the whole Element, though divers learned men judge the Con∣gregation to be no governing Church at all, but only their El∣ders the delegates of the Presbyterial Church, which consisting of divers Congregations is the first governing Church.

2. There are no s••••cifick acts which the Elders collectively taken, may not exercise in both the one and the other: but then shall it not follow, th•••• a single cong••••gational Eldership may ordain and ex••••mmunicate in one 〈◊〉〈◊〉 Congregation there alone divided from the body? for congr•…•…nal Elders cannot teach o••derly (and he is the God of ord••r, 〈◊〉〈◊〉 〈◊〉〈◊〉 in his Church) in all the Congregations without a cal••.

Nor 2. Exercise the power of a Synod in them all.

3. I 〈◊〉〈◊〉 this argument; Archipp•••• hath the same office to the whole Congregation, and to the single m••mbers who chu∣sed him, and whom he feeds; or then he hath so many officer as there be chusing and fed members, ••••ught by the word and ruled, which is absurd: E••go, as the single vo•••• of one member made him a Pastor to one, and of a second made him a Pastor to a second, and so forth. So the ••otes of the whole made him a Pastor to the whole: for that is the same offic•• th•••• hath the same causes, and the same choice and election, saith M••. 〈◊〉〈◊〉. Ergo, where the same causes are not, the same office cannot be, but one sin∣gle electing vote, and the electing vot•••• of the whole Church by Mr. H. his way, cannot be the same causes, for one vote makes him not a Pastor.

2. If Archippu•• hath the same office to the whole congregati∣on, and to every single member, then as he 〈◊〉〈◊〉 pasto∣ral acts of teaching and ruling to the whole, so to the parts and single members; but this latter is denied by Mr. H, page 104: who saith, That a Pastor cannot put forth Pastoral acts, but in the Church assembly, A strange imagination!

Mr. H. By the same official power (saith Mr. R.) that a Pastor * 1.59 teacheth his own fleck viva voce, he teacheth others by writing.

Ans This is a new invention that I never heard of before.

1. The official power, by which he preacheth, he receiveth by ele∣ction, and he may be rejected from it by the people, in case of delin∣quency.

2. By his official power he may require them to hear, but may not require all Churches to read his writings; and if they offensive∣ly refuse to read, he cannot censure them, as he may censure them that refuse to hear the word.

3. If this power of writing of Books, to edifie the Churches, proceed from his office, all Ministers by their office should write * 1.60 Books.

4. That which another may do with as much authority, and more authority of truth, as being more able, yet being out of office, that cannot belong to the officer; but to write books is such.

Ans. 1 Official power is not from election, but from the saying on of the hands of the Elders, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. 1 Tim. 4. 14. 1 Tim. 5. 22. 2 Tim. 2 2. Tit. 1. 5.

2. It is true, that a Pastor cannot require by his office those of another Congregation to hear him preach, and receive the seals from him, nor censure them, if they refuse; but it is a bad consequence of Logick, therefore he doth not exercise these pastoral acts to them by his office, as the Brethren grant.

2. A Minister by his office may require his hearers to give much alms, pray much, read and confer much, both these of his own and other flocks; yet he cannot censure them for not coming up to the highest pitch of these affirmative duties, except he may rebuke them, and so may he do all who are remiss in reading edifying writings, and the Church may censure unsound books, Acts 15. 24.

3. Neither Mr. R. nor any judicious man can teach that ei∣ther a gift to write Books, or of eminent preaching, praying, exhorting, proceeds out of a power of office; it is a sanctified gift which the Church seeth and judgeth to be in any, before they call him to office; and any gift is by order of nature and time before the office, and so proceeds not from the office; and therefore it is not required that every Pastor should have a gift

of writing books, but if the Lord have given it to any, they ex∣ercise it as such gifted officers as the Prophets and Apostles, as such Prophets so gifted did write Canonick Scriptures; so are Pastors, if gifted, to write and preach in their way, and both to write and preach by their office. Nor is it good Logick, that all in office should write books. because some by vertue of their office writ books; for a Minister gifted with four Talents is obliged to gain with these four Talents, and that as a Minister by vertue of his office; but it is weak Logick to infer, Ergo, all Ministers by vertue of their office are obliged to gain with four Talents, for many are obliged by vertue of their office to gain with only two to their Lord, and with only one.

4. It was needless to Mr. H. to prove writing of books doth not belong to the power of office, because a learned man out of office may do it with more authority; for Mr. R. had no such intention. For, sure if such a thing agreed to the office-power, as the office-power, then all Officers, Pastors, Elders were obliged to write books, and yet Mr. H. does not very happily prove it, because many learned men unofficed may with more au∣thority of truth write books, then officed men. It is only some offi∣ced men he must mean, or it is not true. And then I retort it thus; many officed men may write books with more authority both of truth and of office (and two are better then one) then some unofficed men less learned. Ergo, some gifted Pastors do not as Pastors so gifted, and by vertue of their office relating both to the presbyterian Church, and their own Congregation edifie all the Churches about, by writing books. It follows not.

Mr. H. We are told that Elders are ruling in all Churches * 1.61 collectively taken, and they are teachers 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, in some reserved acts, not constant teachers, he that rules teacheth, but always the same flock.

Ans. Take classical Elders as they are congregational Elders, and that is all one as to say, no classical Elders, and then they are no teaching Elders; and all that is gained is this; a classical Elder as he is no classical Elder, is a teaching Elder. And so there is no distinction.

Ans. Such quirks become not grave M. H. What is a Syno∣dical

Elder? Mr. H. saith a counselling Elder. I reply, that is no Elder, but a counselling Brother or Sister. But Mr. Cotton and our Brethren say better. A synodical Elder is an Elder synodically teaching the Churches with pastoral and dogmatick authority, without all power of jurisdiction, that is a Synodical Elder, as no Congregational Elder (but as he judgeth in Synod) is a tea∣ching and a ruling Elder. Then I infer, that al Synodical Elder must be both an Elder and no Elder. So animal as he is, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, is non h••mo, but he is viv••••s. It were easie to weary the Reader with many wild unsolid notions, such like, Ergo, animal is homo, non hom••.

Mr. H. So a Pastor may be a teaching Pastor to one Church, and * 1.62 a ruling Pastor to two or three, or thirty. This is a B••shop.

Obj. The B••shop arrogates thi•• to himself alone.

Ans. Shew a rule of Christ, why the Elders may not join many Elders to join with him; for you have no rule of Christ to join many to him to rule many Churches, nor hath he a rule to assume many to him.

Ans. Not any of the separation ever refuted, with that * 1.63 strength of Scripture, Reason, Antiquity, the domineeringg pre∣lacy, as the godly presbyterians in Britain, and the reformed Churches. But so many thousand Independent Monarchies, and two Congregational, or three Elders (for a Deacon is for Ta∣bles, Act. 6.) subordinate in point of jurisdiction to none on earth, is a more lively image of a domineering Prelacy, then all the Presbyteries on earth.

2. There is no rule to join other prelates or elders to a prelate: an unlawful officer, having power of jurisdiction, the only pro∣per pastor, and all others are but pastors under him and his dele∣gates. But Mr. H. cannot say that the pastor of a congregati∣on is an unlawful pastor, to whom so many bastard pastors are added, if he do, this shall reflex upon his own way; for the Sy∣nodical Elder is a pastorally teaching Elder to many Churches, Antioch, Ierusalem, and also a teaching and ruling Elder to one congregation by our brethrens way: Is the Synodical Elder therefore a pastor of pastors, and a Bishop? And Mr. H. cannot say but that there might have been divers congregations in Ieru∣salem, and yet unformed Churches; and that the twelve Apo∣stles

did feed and rule them all in common, and so shall Peter teach one Congregation at once, and rule many whom he can∣not teach (for physically it is impossible he can feed many at once) and yet there was but one Presbytery, and this we shall hear Mr. H. confess hereafter. Ergo, the twelve Apostles and Church-Elders feeding many Congregations not formed with fixed Pastors shall bring in such sort of Bishops, as Mr. H. char∣ges upon me. * 1.64

Mr. H. If they do not both rule and teach, they cannot fulf••l their Ministry.

Ans. How is it proved that Pastors cannot fulfil their Ministry, except they both rule all the Churches with acts Synodical, and their own Congregations also?

2. How is it proved that there is a blank in the Ministry, ex∣cept Pastors both teach and rule these same persons? some of the Congregation are so experiencedly taught of God, that rebukes and censures of excommunication are never drawn out, nor need to be drawn out against them; never Interpreter so expounded Col. 4. * 1.65

Mr. H. If Pastors be Pastors and in office when they are out of Court, then have they Church-jurisdiction out of the Court; but the first is true. Also censures sh••uld be dispenced in the Congregation, and there they must preach also.

Ans. Priests when not actu••lly sitting in the Sanhedrim, Mem∣bers of Parliament are Members sitting in the House; and Pa∣stors are Elders actu primo, when not sitting in the Congregati∣onal Judicature; Ergo, they can exercise acts of jurisdiction out of Court, in their Houses; and may the Eldership preach out of the Court? it is a shame to hear such Logick.

2. Belike Mr. H. thinks it unpossible to dispence censures, but the Elders must preach: Ergo, when the people excommu∣nicate their whole Officers, because heretical; they must also preach pastorally: for it is pastoral ruling and teaching which makes a fulfilling of the Ministry: but the conclusion is absurd, let Mr. H. see to it.

CHAP. V.

The Argument from the onerousness of Presbyterial Ruling of many Churches, and of Congregationally feeding of others, against the Presbyterial Church, are discus∣sed.

MR. H. The classical course layeth a burden upon teaching Elders, which Gods word never laid, and which they are * 1.66 not able to discharge; the Apostles appointed Elders in every Church to feed the fl••ck, not the flocks. Mr. R. the way of watch∣ing over Sister Churches is as dreadful for onerous, careful, labo∣rious watchfulness in the way of conscience, as to be bound thereto by way of duty; for this bond of lovely and brotherly consociation, which is the foundation of Presbyterial governing, ties us to doe no more in governing and helping other Sister Churches, then if We had no further warrant to promote their ed fication, then the a∣lone relation of brotherly consociation. The sentence is (saith Mr. H.) unperfect; and therefore that it may reach his purpose, I think is must be thus expressed: the bond of brotherly consociation ti••th us to do no more in governing Sister Churches, then brother∣ly consociation simply can do, is true; but impertinent to Mr. R. his scope, which is to compare the bond and burthen between bro∣therly * 1.67 association and office-imposition, as if there were a parity be∣tween them.

Ans. 1. The classical course layeth no other burthen upon teaching Elders, by way of united jurisdictions in governing neighbour Churches that are the same body, and have the same seals common, as Mr. Cotton and his own Discipline agrees (as I often cite) then the way of Churches both associated by bro∣therly association, and by Synodical and authoritative govern∣ing, as the same Mr. Cotton teacheth, and Mr. H. saith it is

true, but not pertinent; and if it be true, why contend we?

2. That it is not pertinent to my purpose, is denied: Why? Because (saith he) Mr. R. his scope is to make a parity and e∣quality between the burthen of Brotherly consociation and of Office∣imposition. But that is a change of my words, and therefore must lie upon Mr. H. as his, not my words, except they be wrest∣ed; Nor is it my scope to make an equality in quantity, as if there were, as Mr. H. most mistakingly saith, the like care, onerous∣ness and labour required in duties of Christian watchfulness in a brotherly way, as in duties of office relation: But in equality of onerousness of answering to God for duties, the like con∣science, the like sincerity, the like faith of giving an account to God, is required in the one as in the other. And he leaves, up∣on this account, out the word, in way of conscience, or in fore Dei, and saith my words are imperfect; but wherein they are imperfect, he sheweth not, which maketh his own words imper∣fect: and therefore he turneth my Negative, That we are to do no more in governing sister-Churches, than in counselling and bro∣therly advising, into an Affirmative never dreamed of by me. That brotherly association tieth us to do as much, as if we had no further warrant; and t•…•… we are to do by his way as much in brotherly duties to all Christians in other Provinces or Na∣tions, in France, Germany, Holland with whom we can by no physical possibility be present, and whose faces we never saw, as we are to do, by fixed office, to the single congregations to which we have a providential call, by the election and choise of the people, for whom we are to search the Scriptures, and study pleasant words, and for whose souls we are to give an account. But

1. Its a fruitless dispute to prove in sundry pages what Mr. R. grants.

2. If he proved from my words (from his own he may) that these are necessary consequences, he had done as became a Re∣futer.

3. He cannot from what I say deny, but granteth, That bro∣therly consociation tieth teaching Elders to do no more in go∣verning neighbouring Churches, than brotherly advising, teach∣ing,

admonishing, tieth us unto, in point of onerousness and labo∣rious care, and so it well follows, That there is no more laid up∣on Presbyterial Elders in governing neighbouring Churches, than is laid upon their counselling, and brotherly advising El∣ders, in point of daily occurring scandals, as is clear in the Rise of Familists, Anabaptists, Antinomians, &c. and many scanda∣lous persons arising in sundry Churches lying together.

4. The care and onerousness in brotherly watching, essen∣tially, * 1.68 formally in rendring an account to God, as being keepers to our Brethren all the world over, with whom we converse in other congregations, haply at our door, and occasionally, is as binding before God, as the care of teaching Elders in exercising power of Jurisdiction in Collegio, and in things common to di∣vers Churches; but it follows not, that Christian love tieth me to all the positive means of warning my brother to go to Ger∣many, to America, to try and admonish all the scandals that are committed there.

5. This same Argument is thus retorted upon Mr. H. if the Apostles, as Church-members, as Believers, be obliged all the world over, to eat the Lords Supper, as Paul did at Troas, Acts 20. 11. a•• Corinth, 1 Cor. 10. 17 and in all the Churches on earth, to eat and receive the Lo•…•… Supper, not as an Apostle with an Apostolick, but with a faith common to all Christians; then must he be obliged as a Christian with the like care and onerousness to leave his calling of an Apostle & to go to all pla∣ces on earth, to remember the Lords death, and as a Christian to lay down preaching, planting of Churches, working of mi∣racles, and to teach, rebuke, as a Christian, in all places. Its not enough to say, That the Apostles

1. Were priviledged persons, and so might eat the Lords Supper all the world over, for they eat not the Lords Supper as * 1.69 Apostles, but as believers, who were to try and examine them∣selves, and so d••••ncerningly to remember the Lords death until he come again, as other believers were.

2. Is it enough to say, They were occasionally onely to dis∣charge these Christian duties, as they should be locally pre∣sent, for so are teaching Elders to perform official duties to these neighbour Churches with whom they occasionally con∣verse

in the occasional emergency of scandals: and if Pastors were in Africa or America, they might, without any new ordi∣nation or official call, preach and govern as Physicians of souls. But by Mr. H. his way, the Lord in the day of Judgment might say, Thou wast a member of that body, with which thou hadst a right to ••at the Lords Supper in all Churches on earth; therefore I require at thy hand the blood of them that are lost in America, because thou watched not over all the Christians on earth, which is physically impossible. And I require at Paul preaching in the the W••st, th•• blood of such as perished, when he was 300 miles absent from them, for Paul had an officiall call to all the believers on earth. As Mr. H. saith, our Presbyterial Elders must give an account for souls that are lost in all the Presbyterial, Provin∣cial and National Churches on earth, and go all the world over to cure scandals, leaving their own calling of Merchan∣dize. But by this (saith Mr. H pag. 115.) a pastoral care is f••r more enerous and laborious than Christian and brotherly care in some sense. I grant all, and there is nothing proved against me, who say, that this ties teaching Elders to no more in go∣verning Sister Churches, in point of binding the conscience to answer for them, as far as they have power in matter of common con∣cernment, for the wel being of all the near hand associated Chur∣ches, then brotherly consociation can do. And Mr. H. page 112. saith this is true, and yet in some sense pastoral care is far more onerous and laborious, to wit, in using more means in watch∣ing fixedly over a Congregation, by constant preaching in sea∣son, and out of season, in standying pleasant words, administring the Sacraments, &c. Nor did I ever say any thing to the con∣trary.

Mr. H. An eminently gifted man in an Island, where no Pa∣stors * 1.70 are, is no less (saith Mr. R.) tyed in conscience in the extra∣ordinary imployment of his calling, then if he were formally ordain∣ed and chosen their Pastor. In some extraordinary cases a gift and Christian love ties even as much to onerousness in using means to save, at the office it self. See what I add in that place, (Mr H. saith) then this gifted man in an Island, in using his generall calling as a Christian, destroyes his particular, as a Merchant, and turn Mini∣ster. 2. This is to confound the general and particular calling.

Ans. Not at all, for in this case, the extraordinary necessity of gaining souls, when other Pastors cannot be had; and or∣dination and election by that means are invincibly wanting hic & nunc, turns his Christian calling in place and room of the particular calling of a Pastor; and so Mr. R. said well, that in some extraordinary case like this, The naked R••lation of Iuris∣diction addeth nothing to care and onerousness in point of labour, by preaching the Gospel.

Mr. H. If we have a divine command (saith Mr. R.) to be our brethrens k••epers, then our Christian watch in that regard requires * 1.71 as much onerousness and care as office watch. It follows not (saith Mr. H.) am I bound by office to watch no more over the people left to my pastoral care, then as a Christian over these of another Pro∣vince, whom I am occasionally only to gain, and whose faces I never saw.

Ans. Mr. H. leaves out the words, in point of conscience to answer for them to God, Which I have. Otherwise in regard of * 1.72 using of more means, he is obliged to more constant feeding, by word, seals, dayly watching over the single flock, then over all Christians on the other side of the Sea, and some thousand miles distant from him.

But if the foundation of governing classical Churches be the love and union of the members of one body of Christ, then there is much care, onerousness, and labour, which is required in brotherly consociation to help, as the care & onerousness which is required in officership.

Mr. H. Ans. The proposition hath no truth, because I love all consociated in one Synod, whom I never saw, and with whom I could never meet to do good, or receive good. But if I should be bound to put forth the like onerous and laborious care for their spiri∣tual good, as for these, to whom by way of office I am bound in the same Congregation. Then officers must either do too little, or be bound to do too much.

Ans. This is neither my Argument, nor my words: my words are, Par. 1 pag. 332. Now if we distinguish ONEROUSNESS, CARE and LABOUR by way of jurisdiction, the former is as GREAT IN FORO DEI, in the Court of conscience, as the latter. These words are left out by Mr. H. qua fide; let the

Reader judge; for the toil, care, onerousness and labour in point of conscience in the kind, and sphere; I urge in both, by ne∣cessity of a divine command: but the like care, onerousness and labour in quantity, in the use of more means, in constant prea∣ching, personal comforting, to all the Christians on earth, as to the single congregation, I utterly deny. But can Mr. H. de∣ny but the Apostles and Brethren, Act. 15. did ow as much care, onerousness, and labour in a binding conscientious way in laying on synodical burdens, which bind not onely (saith Mr. Cotton) materially for the weight of the matter imposed by divine * 1.73 precept, but also formally from the authority of the Synod, upon the Churches of Ierusalem, Antioch, Syria, Cilicia, as any pastor ows to his single flock; and that because these Churches are all one consociated body? and yet Elders of the Synod were never to see the faces of all these members of the Churches.

And I put this quere to the Brethren, what warrant of Christ is there that a member of an Independent Church ow Church-care to watch, teach, admonish, rebuke, comfort, as Col. 3. 16. Heb. 3. 13. 1 Thes. 5 14. to a fellow member of the same con∣gregation only, and ow no Church-care to another brother, dwelling in the same house with him, having with him the same faith, the same baptism, the same Lord, the same covenant of Grace, the same Saviour, only because he is a member of ano∣ther Independent Church?

Mr. H. Arg. 5. If they be Pastors over all the Congregations * 1.74 of the circuit, then they were new chosen by the Congregations, or not, &c.

Ans. This is a repeated blast of an old horn; there is this re∣quired, that Churches about, by their silence approve him as Pastor to one single Congregation; but that all Congregations make a special election of him to be their fixed Pastor, is no more required, then that the Churches of Antioch and Ierusalem chose the Apostles and Elders, who yet Act. 15. exercise pasto∣ral and official acts over them by the grant of Mr. Cotton and our Brethren.

They are Elders of Ephesus, i. e. of enery Congregation of the * 1.75 combination, as all the Kings, if they were met in one royal Court to govern the Nations, in things of common concernment to all, yet

are called the Kings of the Nations. These are words (saith Mr. H. to darken:) the Elders met here, have a new power distinct from the power over their several Congregations, a Commission, i. e. a new Creature. The Kings if so convened, have a joynt power of con∣federate Princes, to act in things of common concernment, and if that power were distinct from the particular power that they have over their own territories, the comparison were parallel.

Ans. We may suppose such a convention of Kings, the Com∣missioners * 1.76 or M••ssengers of the Churches have no new office, but only are met to determin of such a thing as disturbs the Churches, Act. 15 5. they differ as Elders, and such Elders sent and nominate by the Church, and act as Elders by the same official power common to Elders that are not sent, and are cal∣led by the Church Apostles and Elders, Act. 15. 23. & 16. 4. & 21. 18, 25. then sending and commissionating is a condition of order appointed by the God of order, no devise of men: and the Churches submit to them as to no new office.

But 1. as to the messengers of the Church, and gracious and sound Elders.

2. If they speak according to the Law and the testimony, not otherwise, and the answer is as much against Act. 15. and a∣gainst Mr. Cotton and all that are for Synods, either juridical or consultative, as against Mr. R. for they go to Synods, who so go by a new power of order, not by a new office.

Mr. H. This course nullifies the power of Elders, and propl••••f a * 1.77 Congregation, and their proceeding in a righteous way; for the Classis may judge a member to be excommunicated, whom the Con∣gregation judgeth. and that truely not worthy of that censure; here * 1.78 the power of Elders and people which act in a way of Christ is wholly hindered.

Ans. This weak Argument is fully answered by me before; That Government, which of its own nature hinders and nullifies the righteous proceeding of the Congregation is not a power from Christ. True; but now the assumption is false: for the presbyterial pow∣er added to the just power of a Congregation does strengthen, and not nullifie the power of the Congregation That Govern∣ment, which by accid••nt, and abuse of their power in over vo∣ting two Elders, who proceed according to the rule of Christ, hin∣ders

and nullifies right proceeding in on•• single act, is not from Christ, is most false: For because an abused power, and abu∣sed government is not from Christ, it follows not that the power and government it self is not from God. I added an an∣swer * 1.79 to this in my Book which Mr. H. passeth over in silence. Suppose the Congregation and Synod agree in the truth, as they do Act. 15. Will you say that Peter, Paul and Iames, their power is nullified, and their three votes are swallowed up in that greater convention; because to their power is added in this dogmatical determination, the power and voices of the rest of the Apostles and Elders; yea, and some say of the whole Church, Act. 15. 2, 6, 25. & 16. 4. & 21. 18, 25. So say that the Congregati∣on of Thyatira (suppose it so to be) by assuming to themselves a huge number of Elders and visible Saints shall by over-voting the former Congregation, conclude that Iesabel shall still teach and seduce. Mr. H. cannot say, that the added power of the Elders and Members of it self is not of Christ, but rather their abusing of their power in that wicked act, is not from Christ; for the adding to the Church two thousand to three thousand, to make five thousand is lawful, Act. 5.

Mr. H. To this Mr. R. answers, de jure, the power of the grea∣ter * 1.80 in this case ought to be swallowed up of the two voices of the El∣ders of the Congregation. But saith Mr. H. so the weaker should overbear the stronger, the part the whole.

2. This opens a gap to endless dissention, the fewer say we have the truth, the other, we have the truth, and who shall be the Iudge?

Aus. Mr. A. citeth my words (as frequently elsewhere) so here imperfectly, and mutilates the sense, if their power and voices be against the truth; it is fit that many voices be swal∣lowed up by two, Iure in fore Dei: for Christ gave no power to thirty to erre, and to excommunicate an innocent person, he hath given no power, but to edifica••ion, 2 Cor. 10. 8. 1 Cor. 5. 4, 5. But I said not that Iure Ecclesiastico, the fewer, and the part, should overbear the many, and the whole. And what will Mr. H. say, the fewer names in Sardis judge that a Iezabel should be excommunicated; the whole saith no. The fewer say we have truth, the whole say, we have truth; by the brethrens

way no remedy, but be the matter heresie, or scandals, incest and parricide, the larger part of every single Congregation in the midst of 24. sound Churches hath a power independent, and from which there is no appeal on earth, to excommunicate the few names that are in Sardis and keep their garments clean. If ye say, so is it in a National, in an Oecumenick Councel by the * 1.81 Presbyterian way:

I answer in either the one or the other; if there be a mani∣fest departing from the faith, and the man of sin sit in the Tem∣ple of God, and the fornications of Babel be multiplyed, the fewer and weaker being Sa••ior pars Ecclesiae, the sounder part are (as Mr. H. saith, Iure in the Court of Heaven) the Church.

Mr. H. Arg. 7. This course cannot attain its end appointed by * 1.82 our Saviour, whose wisedom fails not, nor can be frustrate in its preparation. But the Classis excommunicating, when the Elders and Congregation refuse to submit, would be of no force.

Ans. Let the larger part of the Congregation by three votes * 1.83 excommunicate a godly sound man, and descern an Arch-here∣tick to preach, as a Godly Socinian; Where is the end of Christ attained by you?

2. It is an Arminian and unsound tenet to condemn the wis∣dom of Christ, because he draws not his Ordinances, Gospel, Promises, Precepts, Seals, Censures, according to his irresistable Decree, by which the infinitly wise Lord cannot come short of his end intended of the Ordinances themselves, finem operantis; for his Counsels and Decrees must stand, Isa. 14. 26, 27. Ps. 33. 10, 11. Rom. 9. 19. and who hath believed our report? Isa. 53. 1. Some, yea many stumble at Christ and the Word, Isa. 8. 14, 15. 1 Pet. 2. 8. Rom. 9. Shall we accuse the Ordinances, the Gospel and Seals, because God attains not the end, the Salvation of the hearers? How unjust is it to accuse the Wisedom of God for this sinful folly of men?

But the Lord draws his ordinances and seals according to his approving will, and thereby his Wisdom attains the end, finem operis, which is to save and render unexcusable; and though the Classis be divided from the Congregation, and the Congre∣gation be divided, the fewer keeping the rule, and the greater

number erring: this is no more a just ground of challenging the immaculate and spotless Wisedom of God in the ordinance of Presbyterial censuring, then we may challenge Christs coming in the world, to bring the sword, not peace, Matth. 10. 34. his or∣dinances are media nata apta, of their own nature apt to bring union between the Classis and the Congregation; if it fall out otherwise, the blame is in mens corruption.

There were answers given to these Arguments by me; Mr. H. would not set them down, nor remove them, as he answers, but in halfs and parts.

CHAP. VI.

Some seeming inconsistencies mistaken by Mr. Hooker, are cleared.

MR. H. Pastors as they stand in relation to the Congregation, and in reference (saith Mr. R.) to the Classis, have not two, * 1.84 but one office, page 329; 333. and yet they are elect to the office of a Pastor in the Congregation, l. 1. & l. 2. pag. 201. but not elect to the office of a Pastor in reference to the Classis, l. 2. 345. which is very strange, since there is but one and the same office.

Ans. Is it strange that Mr. Cotton and the dissenting Brethren teach; Elders in reference to the Synod, and Elders in reference * 1.85 to the single Congregation at Antioch, and at Ierusalem have but one and the same office of Elders; for they are not twice Elders, nor two sort of Officers, by reason of these two relati∣ons. If they be, say it out, and yet these were elect Pastors in order to their Congregations, and chosen to employ their la∣bours constantly there onely, as married Husbands to their Wives. So Mr. H. par. 1. c. 7. pag. 81, 82, 83. and yet neither Mr. H. nor Mr. Cotton can say they were elect to the office of Pa∣stors in reference to the Synod, though they exercise pastoral acts in reference to the Synod (Cotton Keys. c. 5. p. 25. Mr. H. par. 3.) and the associated Churches. Is not this strange? For

the eighth Argument repeated from Survey, c. 8. Arg. 1. pag. 99. is answered.

2. I ••esire the Reader also to consider my words, pag. 244, 245. The Congregations acknowledging and consenting to the clas∣sical Presbytery, do tacitly chuse and consent to the common charge and care that every Pastor hath, as he is a member of that com∣mon Court, which d••th concern them all. and therefore when Mr. R. saith, that Pastors are not elect to the office of a Pastor, in reference to the Classis; the sense is in every page known to be, that Pastors are not chosen to be fixed and constant feeders of all the Congregations of the Classis, because they feed and rule in things of common concernment.

Mr. H. The power of a Congregation, and of a Presbytery, and their acts (saith Mr. R.) differ not essentially. But Elders (saith * 1.86 Mr. H.) do, and must preach, watch and feed, by vertue of the es∣sence of their office, therefore they have acts formally d••fferent.

Ans. That Elders do act as Elders, and put forth specifick acts of Elders in the Congregation, and in the Presbytery; Ergo, Their acts in one differ in nature from the acts in the other: it no more follows then this, Peter laughs to day, ergo it shall be rain to morrow. That Elders must constantly and fixedly teach and feed the Churches, whom they govern synodically, is denied * 1.87 by Mr. Cotton: and that they must put forth all the acts of the es∣sence of the office, and that constantly and fixedly to all the Churches congregational, presbyterial, synodical, to which they are referred as pastors in their several relations respectively is most false.

Mr. H. If it be one and the same office of a Pastor to the Classis, and to a Congregation, as Mr. R. saith, l. 2. 329. then the office relates one and the same way to both the classical and congregational Church; then if the congregational Church be their proper flock, so must the classical Church be, quae sunt idem inter se, sunt idem uni tertio.

Ans. the first consequence is naught; If it be the same office, then the office relates the same way to both the classical and congregati∣onal Church. A Pastor hath the same office to the whole Con∣gregation, and to one single man, to whom he preaches; for he is not two Pastors, one to the whole, and another to the

part. An Elder is the same officer to Antioch, and to the Synod at Ierusalem, Act. 15. for he is not two officers in reference to these two. But it follows not that the office relates the same way to one man, and to all the Congregation; nor is he re∣ferred to the Synod as the fixed and constant feeder of the Sy∣nod, but he is referred to a Congregation of Antioch, as their fixed and constant Pastor; it is wild Logick, that one and the same office must relate, one and the same way, to one and to ten hund••••d, to the adequate, and to the inadequate correlate; and these that are one in one Faith, one Baptism, one Lord, one and the same Seals, it will not follow that they are one every way, but in illo uno tertio. For the whole Congregations on earth are one in all the essentials of a Church, one Faith, one Lord, but it follows not that all the Congregations on earth are but one single Congregation. The thumb is referred to the hand, as a member, and also to the whole body as a member; yet it is referred to the hand as a nearest and proper member; but to the whole body in a more common relation, as the toe is refer∣red to the body, yet is not the toe a part of the hand as the thumb is, but both are parts of the body.

Mr. H. The combination of Churches gives no office, and so no * 1.88 power to the Elders of many Churches, for they were Elders before the combination.

Ans. That they were Elders before the combination, and made and ordained by the laying on of the hands of the people, which is your homogeneous Church, is an unwritten Tradi∣tion.

2. The tacit consent of Sister-Churches even before the for∣mal combination is enough on their part, who neighbour with them to make them Elders.

M. H. Would you see a Pastor that hath the formal essence of a * 1.89 Pastor, and yet never did, nor is bound to preach? it is the classical Elder.

2. The Pastor may preach in his own Congregation, and Mi∣nister the Sacraments; but 〈◊〉〈◊〉 Presbytery keeps the key of juris∣diction.

3. The classical Elder is not bound to preach to them, over whom he hath jurisdiction. And this is the Bishop.

Ans. A bishop is rather a Pastor to Pastors, then to the Churches: Envy cannot say this of the Elders of the Presby∣tery.

2. The formal essence of a Pastor is not in being fixed to one Congregation, as a Husband to a Wife; so that it is adul∣tery to act as a Pastor either in a Synod, or in another Congre∣gation, as Mr. H. teacheth; for so Elders in a Synod, Apostles and Evangelists should not have the formal essence of Pa∣stors.

3. It is false that he is not bound to preach and minister the seals to another Congregation, or members thereof, if he be called thereunto. But the Bishop is a Byshop ex officio, is bound to preach to none, but a Sermon to the Clergy once a year, and not that he may be a Bishop and never preach.

3. The Pastor of a Congregation as a Pastor hath power of jurisdiction in Collegio, and hath no majority of jurisdiction and ordination at all, as the Bishop hath.

4. The Pastor of a Congregation, yea, all the officers there∣of, poor men have no jurisdiction without the people, yea, the people without them have majority of jurisdiction to make and unmake all the officers, which is the formal essence of a prelate by Mr. H. his way; the prelate is the virtual Church: tell the Church, i. e. tell one single man, the Prelate, who need neither do by vote, or consent of other Elders or people, as the prela∣tical way teacheth. Our Elders are neither over the saith of the people, nor can they dispence censures contrary to the mind of the Godly. So Mr. H. hath not found the prelate with us: but the Male, Church which is above all their officers, and all others is the prelatical Church.

But what if the Elders meet and confer this pow••r of sole Iuris∣diction upon one man, and make him more then a Moderator?

Ans. What if the firmament fall? if they make a Bishop, they make a Bishop. I cannot stand; but see more of the prelates their majority, pride, dignity, priviledges in the Authors cited, * 1.90 in nature and essence distinct from our Elders, or from Synodical Elders, against whom the argument fights with the like strength as against us. What famous Independents have refuted prelacy, I or a few can read.

Mr. H. What rule of Christ condemneth the Churches of error, for giving the power of jurisdiction to one man, but will condemn the i••vesting many Elders with jurisdiction over many Churches? let Mr. R. give me one place of Scripture, or one sound Reason for it; that one may be a Pastor to a people, by whom he was never chosen, &c.

Ans. The places of Scripture that tell us the Elders of Ierusa∣lem were over so many as their constant officers, who could not meet in one Congregation, declare they had jurisdiction o∣ver that Church, otherwise Elders of that Church they could not be: but they could not all of them be chosen their Elders constantly teaching in all the Congregations; for that was un∣possible.

And our grounds for a Presbyterian Church, and for Presby∣terian Elders are these.

1. To appoint Elders 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, in every City. Tit. 1. 5. Is to appoint a Colledge, or Church-officers in every Church, the Town, or City of Samaria receiving the Gospel.

1. As many, even from the greatest to the least, as were be∣witched by Magus, Act. 8. 6. 9.

2. Both men and women were baptized, v. 12. and so were made a Church.

3. The number being above the strength of Philip, and so more then one Congregation, they stood in need of Peter and Iohn, v. 14. to help in the work.

2. The first samplar Church of Ierusalem is one Church in Go∣vernment, * 1.91 for their Elders are called the Elders of the Church of Ierusalem, Act. 2. 43, 44, 47. & 8. 1, 2. & 5. 11. & 11. 30. But that this Church was not all one Congregation, is clear.

1. From the multitude thereof, Act. 2. 43. three thousand.

2. Act. 4. 4. Five thousand. And then 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, multitudes of men, and women, Act. 3. 14. and yet they were multiplied, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉,

exceedingly; and a great company of the Priests (hard mettal to be wrought upon) was obedient to the faith, Act 6. 7.

2. They meet in sundry places from house to house, Act. 2. * 1.92 46. & 5. 42. for the celebration of the Lords Supper, breaking of bread; nor is it like they durst bring into the Temple the new seal of the Supper. The dissenting Brethren refused that.

3. The multitude of twelve preaching Apostles for some years, and seven Deacons for the poor, declare, that in

1. Such a plentiful harvest,

2. In such a necessity of gathering souls.

3. Of preaching in season, and out of season; that one Apo∣stle could not preach to one Congregation, the other eleven hearing, that were twelve reapers all in one ridge, in one single Congregation, where eleven that time must be silent.

4. The Apostle spoke with divers tongues, that these of all nations understood, Act. 2. 1, 2, 3. Therefore in divers meetings; nor is it clear, that all the three thousand heard Peter: the Text saith (v. 37.) they that heard were pricked, Act. 2. 11. the rest of the Apostles also spoke, as Mr. H. thinketh.

5. What agreeth to the Apostles as Elders, agreeth to all El∣ders, * 1.93 but the Apostles Act. 6. as Elders, not as Apostles (which is a Presbytery of twelve Elders over divers Congregations) chose Deacons, lay hands on them, and praying ordain them, v. 6. and use the joynt concurrence of the people for the chusing of them, as a standing example to the Churches. Now what they do as Apostles either in writing Scripture, working miracles, spea∣king with tongues, &c. they neither seek nor need the help or oc∣currence of others, either people, or any else. There is no ground to say that all these thousands meet in Solomons porch, Act. 5. 12. at one act of divine worship Congregational, or that they were all joyning in one and the same prayer, or that they returned (to wit, Peter, and Iohn) to their own, that is, all the thousands, but to the Apostles, who spoke the word with boldness, Act. 4. 23, 31. nor doth the word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, multitude, note every indi∣vidual person, man and woman, Mat. 8. 37. The whole multitude of the Gadarens besought Christ to depart: Festus, Act. 25. 24. All the multitude hath deal•• with me about Paul. Luke 1. 10. The

whole multitude were praying without. See the Reverend As∣sembly at Westminster.

They meet 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, in every house (it notes a Church-mee∣ting, Act. 5. 42. & 16. 15. & 20 7, 8, 10. Rom. 16. 5. 1 Cor. 16. 19. Phil. 1. 2.) but that all these thousands interessed in ordinances and government (as the Brethren say) meet for the same word, breaking of bread, government and censures, in the same house, needs no refutation, it refutes it self.

3. The Church of Rome, though one body, had many mem∣bers, * 1.94 Rom. 12. and could not be one single Congregation.

1. In it were many Churches lesser, as the house of Aristobu∣lus, Rom. 16. 0. Of Narcissus, v. 11. & 14. Philol••gus, Ne••ea, Iul••us, and all the Saints w••th them, v. 15. the Church at the house of Aquila and Priscilla: many teachers and fellow-helpers, ve••s. 3, 9, 12.

4. The Church of Thessalonica could not be one single Con∣gregation; * 1.95 their faith being heard in all Achaia and all places, 1 Thes. 1. 6, 7, 8. of them Paul gloried in all the Churches, v. 16. Paul at one Sermon converted of them 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, a great mul titude, and of devout women, Act. 17. 4. not a few: also what must be the growth of that Church, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, Act. 15. 33. when they tarried at Antioch, Steph. some time, Beza not a * 1.96 little time. Paul and Barnabas continued there 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, with many other Teachers; and when God layeth the dayly care of all the Churches upon one man, 2 Cor 11. 28. and upon other eminent members of the same body, that the Lord sent so many eminent Teachers, and Prophets to one Congrega∣tion only at Antioch, at Corinth, who can believe it?

5. The Church of Eph••sus had divers Congregations, if not more then one, 1 Cor. 16. 19. The Churches of Asia salu•••• you, Aquila and Priscilla salute you much in the Lord, with th•• Chur••h at their house. So Marlorat, so Par••us and B••za on Rom. 16.

See the English Divines on the place, and Diodati. There were divers small assemblies in one and the self same City. See 1 Cor. 16. 19. Col. 4. 15. So were Church-assemblies ordinary for pray∣ing in the house of Mary, Act. 12. 12. Joh. 20. 19, 26. in an upper chamber, at preaching, praying and chusing of an Apostle, Act. 1. 13. praying and baptizing in the house of Iustus, Act. 18. 7, 8 preaching in the Scho••l of Tyrannus, Act. 19 9. preach∣ing. c••lebrating of the Lords supper in a house of Troas Act. 20. 8, 20. & 5. 42. & 10. 24. The Assembly of Divines at Westmin∣ster proveth that there were more congregations then one at Ephesus. 2. That there were many Elders over them as one flock, Act 20. 17, &c. 3. That these congregations were one Church, Rev. 2. To which adde,

1. The multitude of converts Luke saith, Act. 19. 10, 17. three times 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, all the Iewes and Greeks in Asia and at Ephesus heard the Gospel, a great door there was opened, Sorcerers conver∣ted, Act. 19. and Paul giveth direction to Timothy, how he should govern in the house of God. 1 Tim. 3. 15, 16. at Ephesus, 1 Tim. 1. 3. upon whom he should lay hands, 1 Tim. 5. 22. 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. 1 Tim. 6. 4. to what faithful men able to teach others he should commit the Ministry, 2 Tim. 2. 2. Had it been a single con∣gregation, where one might teach at once only, what needed such watching over false Teachers, speaking perverse things, and gathe∣ring Disciples and Churches out of one single Church, Act 20. 27, 28, 29. and trying of false Apostles, Rev. 2. 1, 2, 3. who were not sent to one single congregation, and there hath been need to take heed to such as speak lies, sow unprofitable questions, 1 Tim. 4. 1, 2, 3, 6, 11, 12. 2 Tim. 6. 3, 4. 2 Tim. 2. 14, 15, 16. and so there must have been many preaching Elders there.

6. At Corinth there have been many instructers, 1 Cor. 4. 16. many Doctors and prophets, 1 Cor. 14. 24, 31, 32.

7. Though there be many Churches in Galatia, Gal. 1. 2. yet must they be one lump, who have power to judge and censure false teachers, Gal. 5. 9. and there is a Church restoring made by spiri∣tual officers, Gal 6. 1. otherwise they might have replied, We Ga∣latians have no power in one body to cut off a troubler who in∣fecteth the whole lump, every single congregation is to see to that, and the troubler is without our Churches, save to one on∣ly single Independent power, say our Brethren.

8. Its not possible that the Churches can send their common * 1.97 Messengers whom they choose, 2 Cor. 8. 19, 23. except the Churches convene, men, women and children, or then convent in Elders of many Churches, or the Apostles must have gone from Church to Church to beg suffrages and votes: which sort of Election is never heard of in any Writer sacred or pro∣fan••.

As to the first, who can believe that men and women and children capable to hear and be baptized also (which is the one∣ly Church of Believers owned by our Brethren) the externally covenanted and redeemed did send the Apostles to Ierusalem? or received the Apostles, and did welcome them? or salute the Saints, as Act. 16 3, 4. Rom. 16. 16 Act. 15. 22, 27, 28? there∣fore need for it, the second must be said. That the Churches in their Heads, Rulers, Officers, sent them, which is a very Pres∣byterial Church.

9. If divers Churches meet for laying on burthens by power of the Keys, as M. Cot. saith, & exercising acts of Church-govern∣ment, then there is a Presbyterial Church governing without and above a single congregation, by pastors neither chosen to be fix∣ed and constant teachers, nor that can possibly teach many con∣gregations. But the former Mr. Cotton and our Brethren teach.

Obj. This is no Church-power (for a Synod is not a Church) b••cause it is no Church-jurisdiction.

Ans. 1. The Antecedent is false. 2. The Consequence is * 1.98 naught. A number of private Christians wanting all official Authority, so might lay on Synodical burthens binding mate∣rially, if this be no Church-power.

2. They are called the Decrees of Apostles and Elders, Act. 16. 4. written and concluded. Act. 21. 25. Saith Iames, Act. 15. 22. It seemed good to the Apostles and Elders, with the whole Church, to send chosen men. Now whether Church note the A∣postles, Elders and Brethren, or the multitude of believers onely, or the Church of Ierusalem, made up of both, the De∣crees must come from Church-power, governing, teaching, uniting and removing a Schism. Though it were no power of jurisdiction, yet here is a Church-power above a Church, ex∣cept it be said that so many pastors of the same or of divers

Churches, or so many private Christians commissionated from no Churches, made the Synod, Act. 15. and Synodically said, It seemed good to the holy Ghost, and to us. But this shall no more import the promised presence of Christ to such as are con∣vened in his Name, Mat. 18. 19. 20. & 28. 19, 20, 21. Ioh. 2. 21. than if so many private Christians had been convened, and so may such of a sister-Church remove all Schisms, and a Synod shall be nothing at all.

10. If Christ build the power of binding, loosing, gaining upon brotherhood, Mat. 18. If thy brother offend, &c. then as far as brotherhood goes, if I possibly can converse with him, and may be offended or edified by him, so far must the power of jurisdiction be extended; because these two, The gaining of a brother, 2. The safety of the Church by edifying of o∣thers, and removing of scandals, are intended by Christ. Mat. 18. but brotherhood is without the bounds of the congrega∣tion whereof I am a member; Rom. 16 14. Salute the bre∣thren that are with them; 1 Cor. 16. 20. All the breth••en salute you. These were brethren of other congregations.

2. If there be no Church-tye upon me to gain any but those * 1.99 of mine own congregation: then 1. There may be commu∣nion of Saints onely within the same congregation, and no communion of Churches: what Scripture is for this?

3. It must be the will of Christ that we bestow no Church-rebukes upon other Churches; which must be contrary

1. To Christian love, to save others.

2. Contrary to zeal for the Lords glory.

3. Spreading the Gospel.

4. Desire to remove Scandals.

5. To be made all things to all men, to save some.

6. To serve one another in love.

7. To promote the common interest of the whole catholick Body of Christ.

8. Its against our praying for the Church, and that all Israel may be saved. * 1.100

9. Against the Doctrine of our Brethren, who say, That Churches ought to rebuke, exhort, warn, comfort Churches.

10. Its against the communion of Spiritual priviledges of one

Head and Saviour, one Covenant, one God, one Faith, &c. Its not enough to say, We are the same Body entitativè, for that * 1.101 entitative Body without this congregation, is either visible or invisible; if visible, then members of divers congregations are of the same visible body: and to say that other congregations are not as visible as that whereof I am a member, to me and o∣thers about, is to deny twice three to be six; for one Christ, one Faith, one Profession, the same seals, are as visible in a Church within few paces to me, as in the Church whereof I am a member: to say it is invisible, is to speak against sense.

CHAP. VII.

Of a Church in an Island.

MR. H. If a Church in an Island may dispense all Censures, * 1.102 and all Ordinances, then every congregation may: But such a Church may. For 1. it is a City and a little Kingdome of Christ. 2. The essential notes of a visible Church agree to it.

Ans. The consequence from a broken arm to a whole arm * 1.103 is not good: or, because Iames the day before he be beheaded in strong prison, cannot discharge all Christian duties to bre∣thren, and to neighbour Churches, therefore he is not actu pri∣mo a Christian. A Church in an Island is not actually associa∣ted with other Churches, and so cannot in the full extent dis∣pense all Ordinances of rebuking, comforting neighbour Chur∣ches, and of withdrawing communion from them, because of the want of the object, not because of defect in the subject: I might retort the argument, Therefore associated congregations cannot dispense all Ordinances of rebuking, comforting, &c. But the latter is absurd.

2. An homogeneal Church in an Island void of pastors and

men able to teach, cannot administer the Seals by Mr. H. his way.

3. A Church so divided, and not associated, is imperfect, and may remove scandals within it self; but it follows not, Er∣go, every associated Church may remove scandals within it self, and without it self also independently, and without any sub∣ordination to united powers of the associated congregations, it follows not, the notes of a visible Church agree to such a Church imperfectly; except it be said, That the same Church from its own intrinsecal and internal independency can dispense censures, it proves nothing; but the independency here is ex∣trinsecal and objective, and so accidental, and the affliction, not the power of jurisdiction in this Church.

Mr. H. There be all the officers in such a Church in an Island, and all the operations, operari sequitur esse—and the end is the same in both, the perfecting of the Body.

Ans. There be neither all the Church-operations, because * 1.104 there is no dispensing of pastoral acts, censures, Church re∣bukings, Church-warnings to neighbour Churches; nor is there the same adequate end, which is the perfecting of the vi∣sible body round about, as far as may be, which is the complete end of an associated Church: the perfecting of one single congregation, is a mangled and imperfect end.

Mr. H. 3 Ground. Where there is an office or power appointed of God, there needs no other power, but the office to authorize the work.

Ans. There is nothing more false. Every pastor hath a power to preach, but there is need of a call of God to preach to Ma∣cedonia, not to Bithynia, Acts 16. There is need of a call to preach fixedly to this, not to this flock, and to ossociated Churches.

2. How is it proved? its but begged that there is a power independent in an associated congregation.

Mr. H. If the power be the same, and the end the same, the power must be vain, if it be not put forth to the end: the power * 1.105 and institution of Christ should be wronged, if it should be hindred in attaining its end.

Ans. This is also a false ground. Power of admonishing, of

rebuking, of preaching, is not wronged, when the object, to wit, neighbouring Churches, are not; and the Lord cannot wrong his own institution. Its a carnal reason, to say an institution is in vain, & a power, when they are not put forth in all possible acts. Steven is stoned, Iames is beheaded, Paul imprisoned, the Church scattered, that they cannot by a physical impossibility meet to remember the Lords death, preach the Gospel, dispense cen∣sures, is therefore the power given by Christ to do all these in vain?

Mr. H. Neighbourhood of other Churches, is but a separable adjunct, it can adde nothing to the constitution, and so to the ope∣ration of the Church; for death and dissentions may take away some Churches, and may nullifie them.

Ans. This is for me. Neighbour Churches are extrinsecal to * 1.106 the nature of a Church in an Island: Ergo, the Church in the Island hath a ministerial and official power actu primo to rule, and joyntly edifie the neighbour Churches, if they be. If any say Evah was accidental to the nature and to the operations of Adam, will it hence follow, a power of procreating children is accidental also to Adam? no more does it follow from the not∣existence of neighbouring Churches, that the Church in the Island hath no power to edifie, and joyntly rule those nighbour∣ing Churches, its poor Logick, because the object is not, to re∣move the power: Such a man is in a dark dungeon, Ergo, he hath no visive faculty; and because light and colours adde no∣thing to the visive faculty, or to its nature and essence; Ergo, if light and colours be removed, the visive faculty is removed. So associated Churches are accidental to the Church in an Island; Ergo, that Church is deprived of all politick power to govern associated Churches, if they were, it follows not.

Mr. H. Suppose a Church be gathered in a wilderness, any lat∣ter * 1.107 Church planted beside it, cannot binder nor abridge the liberty, power, authority and operations, that all are from Christ; and when the same intrinsecal power of constitution according to God, remains unaltered, the operations remain the same.

Ans. 1. A Church or Churches added, do not hinder or a∣bridge, nor bring any privative power; but the added Churches bring a perfecting, helping and cumulative power to perfect

objectively in complete operations the former Church in the Island, in things of common concernment, in which hoth that Wilderness-Church, and the added Churches must be either edi∣fied or scandalized.

2. When the same intrinsecal power remains unaltered, the operations may be altered to the better, and perfected. Mr. H. deviseth much Logick of his own: When the visive faculty of a man brought out of a dungeon who could not see the day∣light, seeth now, should the operations remain the same, when he is brought forth; Ergo, as he saw not before, so he sees not now.

Mr. H. If it be said the Church in an Island should submit to a combination of Churches, as well as combine as members of a congregation: Ans. 1. This is to beg the question. 2. Suppose they will not (submit) then th•• other Churches cannot cōmand that, no more than a particular congregation can cōmand me to be a member. 3. They ought not so to combine, as to prejudice the operations of that power they have received of Christ, and there is no warrant of Christ to hinder the operations of a Pastor or ruling Elder, more in one act of his office than another.

Ans. The contrary is a begging of the question. For * 1.108

1. The Church in an Island should submit to the counsel and advice of new added Churches, as to the Lords Word, by Mr. H. his grant, Ergo, a new addition of Churches, as an addition, doth help, and not hinder the power.

2. The addition of a new power of jurisdiction to the power that was in the Wilderness-church, and that in matters of com∣mon edification, as in dogmatick points, by grant of Adversa∣ries, is no prejudging, ••xcept they over-vote, in a corrupt way, the Wilderness-church. And we say, Christ never gave any power of erring, or male-administration.

3. The adding of 50 members to a Wilderness-church con∣sisting of 25, shall have the same inconvenience: for the Wil∣derness-church is to submit to these added members, if added according to God (as we suppose) as to as lawful a Church-judicature as the Wilderness-church was before the addition. But what if they will not submit? Let Mr. H. see to that. I should think, by Mr. H. his grounds, they ought to submit, for

they are added according to the Rule of Christ; and by Mr. H. his grounds they ought not to submit, (which is a contradi∣ction.) For

1. The power of the Wilderness-church, the authority within themselves, offices, officers, were before complete, were all from Christ. Ergo, the operations should be the same, and they should vote and conclude as they did before, without the addition of 50 members.

2. Those 50 added are separable adjuncts to the constitution and nature, and so to the operations of the Wilderness-church. For by Mr. H. the Wilderness-church being of 25 members, was complete in essence and operations, before the addition of 50 members.

3. The 50 members over-vote and nullifie the righteous pre∣ceeding of the poor holy Wilderness-church of 25. Ergo, here the power of a single congregation in the Island and the Wilderness must be over-turned by these three Arguments of Mr. H. Let his defenders see to it.

4. A congregation may command me a visible professor so and so, dwelling near the Fountain, to confess Christ before men, and so to be a member.

Obj. They cannot excommunicat•• a r••fus••r to be a member, for a non-member cannot be c••st out.

Ans. Its all along a false principle, that a man is no mem∣ber until

1•• A Court congregational judicially judge of his Regene∣ration.

2. Until he actually consent, and give up his Name as a mar∣ried party: 3. and that to one onely congregation; all are rotten and headless principles. What way pastors may be hin∣dred in exercising pastoral acts, or acts of ruling, is clear: he may not publickly preach in a set time of his own appointing, without the Churches consent, by whom he is to be regulated, which is no hindring of the exercise of his power, as Mr. H. ima∣gines, but a regulating thereof.

Mr. H. The addition of any thing besides an office, addes no * 1.109 power of right or jurisdiction.

Ans. True, but it extends the right of the Wilderness-church

to so many members added, to 50 Infants to be baptized when born, to ten Churches about, when the Lord shall adde them, not to rule over them, but to rule joyntly over the whole com∣bination with them, for promoting the Gospel in all.

Mr. H. The ground of the combination is of no force, to wit, the preventing or curing the taint and pollu••ion that a scandal will bring, by the nearness of combination. Therefore the combination is of no force, the scandal falls out in another Classis. 2. In the outside of the combination, nearer the congregation of another Clas∣sis than their own. 3. It goes far to another Province and Na∣tion. The righteous proceeding according to the Rule of Christ, is a cure appointed to remove it, whereever it falls out, farre or near.

Ans. By combination, we do not mean onely a combina∣tion of a Presbytery, but also of a Province, Nation; yea, of * 1.110 all the sound Christian Churches on earth, as the Synod of Dort, 1618. condemned the unsound Doctrine of the Armini∣ans, by writing to all those either within or without the Church, and nearness of habitation is not the adequate ground (though a ground it is, 1 Cor. 5. 1. It is reported there is among you forni∣cation, &c.) of the danger of pollution.

2. The reason, Because the scandal may fall out without the combination of the Classis, is no reason why the combination is of no force, for the combination is upon other grounds also, to wit, the establishing in the faith, the increase of the Chur∣ches, Acts 16. 4, 5. the gathering of the Saints, and perfecting of the body, Eph. 4. 12. edifying the body, beside the prevent∣ing and curing of scandals.

3. Its to beg the question, to say, that the proceeding of the Independent congregation of Antioch (say it were so) is a cure for the scandalous Doctrine of salvation by circumcision, preached at Ierusalem, Acts 15. 1. troubling the Churches of Syria and Cilicia, Acts 15. 23, 24. Yea, this is for Mr. H. to say, the holy Ghost used not a sufficient cure. As for that, to say scandals should not be prevented and cured by the combina∣tion, because they may fall out without the combination; his meaning is, without the combination classical, or congregation, it makes Christs remedy nonsufficient, that either there can be no

Provincial, no National scandals, contrary to experience, or then Christ hath provided no Church-remedy to remove them, but onely the power of a single congregation, which hath no power at all, but over themselves. Hence this rotten principle, * 1.111 That Church feeding is due to none under the New Testament, but to persons hampered into the Pinfold and Judaical Prison of one single congregation, against which 1. it licenseth the most godly Saints on earth, residing at Corinth, if they be no Church-members of that Church,

1. To deny Christ and Church-ordinances before men, when Christs sends out his servants, as Mat. 22 3, 4. Luke 14. 16, 17. for they may say, the Lord calls none to Church-ordinances at Corinth, but members of that Church, and such are we not.

2. It licenseth them to despise Church-prophecying, Church-praying, Church-praising.

3. To disobey a Gospel-command, though they have visibly to the conscience of all tried themselves. Do this in remembrance of me: whereas Christ limits his invitation to all who can discern his body. Mr. H. must say its adultery for the members of the Church of Philippi, to remember the Lords death in the Church of Corinth.

4. That Doctrine is not of God, which debars the birds, sheep, and children of God sojourning in what fields or land soever (as it were) from feeding as his Eagles upon the carrion, in every lawful Church-way; or from watching at the gates, and waiting at the posts of the doors of Wisdom, except in that onely congregation to which they are sworn by marriage oath, or from seeding at any table of the Lord, or dwelling all the dayes of their life in the New Testament-sanctuary, to behold the beauty of the Lord, Prov. 8. 35. 36. Psal. 23. 6. & 27 4. ex∣cept in one single congregation: but such is the Doctrine of * 1.112 an independent congregation, the onely visible Church of the New Testament, as they say.

5. That Doctrine is not of God, which confines Church-comforts, Church-praying, &c. to one single congregation, and puts us in a worse, if not in as hard a condition as the Jews, whose publick Temple-service was tied to the Temple; whereas in the New Testament, 1 Tim. 3. 8. (as in the Old also in some

sense) we may pray in every place, lifting up holy hands without wrath and doubting. But we may not pray, praise, and heat Church-wayes in any place by this way, but in our own con∣gregation, although the Lord promise to create on Zions assem∣blits a cloud and a smoke by day, and the shining of a fleming fire by night, Isa. 4. 5. and that upon all the Lords Mount.

6. The sojourner is left to the Eunuchs complaint, I am a dry tree; there is glory in this assembly, but I have neither part nor portion in it: Nor will it establish the heart to say, I see the beauty of the Lord in my own congregation, for these under the New Testament can finde no solace and comfort from that Psal. 106. Remember me, O Lord, with the favour that thou bearest to thy people. Nor can it be the comfort of an Institu∣tion, which is something more to a believing sojourner, and David banished to want, then we conceive•• when Davids spirit is overwhelmed, when he wants the joy, presence and com••ort of instituted holy dayes, Psal. 42. 4. and of Tabernacle-consola∣tion with the covenanted people of God, which made the spar∣rows more happy than he was, Psal. 84. 1, 2, 3, 4. and yet he had soul-refreshments in lively desires, Psal. 63. 1, 2. For the godly sojourner is not of that covenanted visible body with the Church to which he is a stranger; for by this way, he is an alien, and deprived of their sanctuary joy and glory of that cong••e∣gregation, both in Church-hearing, believing, and joy of the seals.

7. By this way, Christ must promise his Ministerial presence, and his Spirit, not always, as Mat. 28. 20. Eph. 4. 11, 12. Ioh. 20. 21. Acts 1. 8. and in every congregation where they open the mouth, but onely in one fixed congregation. With what faith can they preach elsewhere? or people hear the pastors else∣where?

CHAP. VIII.

Arguments against a Presbyterial Church taken from the Name and Nature of the Church, Matth. 18. are discussed.

MR. H. A Church in the Gospel is never used for the El∣ders * 1.113 onely.

Ans. It is never used in the N. T. for men onely who govern, secluding women and children, as Mr. H. takes it; nor for the people secluding the Elders as a governing Society; but of the signification hereafter. But it cannot be a binding and autho∣ritative loosing Church.

Mr. H. There cannot be a definition given that will agree to a Congregational and Presbyterial Church.

Ans. Ergo, There is no Presbyterial Church, it follows * 1.114 not.

2. As we take a Congregational Church for the Eldership ruling, it is false. One and the same nature of a Ruling Church agreeth to the Congregational, Presbyterial, Provincial El∣dership: and so they differ per magis & minus, as is said.

Mr. H. If the Congregations be species specialissimae of a true Church, then there can be no lower species resulting or arising from them, as this doth.

Ans. No Logick can say, the Church of Boston so existing * 1.115 hath other species of the Church of Boston under it. The hand of Socrates cannot be called species specialissima; nor is the hand, to speak Logically, a species; it is a part, and an uncomplete part of the body. If Mr. H. mean, as it seems he doth, that we make Presbyterian, Provincial Churches, lower species and kindes of Congregational Churches, the pious man refutes Presbyterian Government, which he understands not. For

species specialissima praedicatur de inferioribus, according to Ari∣stotle his, Ramus, and all Logick. And O what Monsters feed we if this be true properly (a Presbyterial Church is a Con∣gregational Church) or (a Congregation is a Presbyterial Church) for the congregation is an integral part of the Presby∣terian Church, the Presbyterian likewise an integral part of the Provincial: but neither of them is species to other, except we say, Euphrates is the Element of Water, the Element of wa∣ter is Euphrates.

M. H. If every congregation hath all the integral parts of a Church, then it is an intire and complete Church.

Ans. Therefore it is an intire politick Church in its associa∣tion * 1.116 with other Churches, it follows not. But what then? London is an intire city having all the integral parts of a Society, Major, Sheriffs, Aldermen, Rulers and ruled, Ergo, London is no part of England, nor ruled by the Parliament of England. VVhat Logick is this? But if the meaning be, that the congre∣gation associated in the midst of ten congregations, is so a city different in species and in nature from all other congregations, and so married to its own Pastors, as the husband and wife are, so that to exercise Church-acts, official acts without themselves, is adultery and unlawful; and so as this Church is no integral part of the body Catholick, its against Scripture and sound rea∣son, and a begging of the question.

Mr. H. Every integrum is made up of his members, therefore in nature they are before, therefore Churches before Classis; there∣fore what each have they receive from them; therefore they have no office, but from them; therefore both ordination and jurisdiction come from them.

Ans. I desider at a Syllogism.

Every whole Incorporation is made up of its members that are before the whole, and hath power, offices, ordination and ju∣risdiction from these members. It is denied by us, and nakedly asserted by Mr. H. For * 1.117

1. The Churches are before the Apostles, Ergo, the Apo∣stles had their immediate calling and power of jurisdiction

from the Churches. It is against Scripture: as women and chil∣dren are by nature before officers; ergo, officers have their ordination and jurisdiction from women and children. 3 Chur∣ches are before counselling and advising, yea as Mr. Cotton saith well before, pastorally and authoritatively determining Synods, Ergo, Synods have all their synodical power to counsel and pa∣storally teach from the Churches, they came from, it follows not, not will our brethren yeild the consequence.

Mr. H. If a Congregation grow too big, and therefore be forced * 1.118 to swarm out; or in ease they transplant themselves from one place to another, so that part be forced to go before others, to make pre∣paration for those that follow, we then send an Offic••r with the smal∣ler party, and the greater number remain with the rest: and yet are all but one Church in our account, and under one Presbytery of chosen Elders of the Congregation.

Ans. 1. Why do not our Brethren shew a practice of this in the Church of Ierusalem, consisting of so many Act. 2. & 4. & 6. thousands, if more then five thousands all in one congrega∣tion? Was there not need that four or six congregations should swarm out of six thousands, and six Officers be sent with them? in which case, suppose they go fourty miles to a new Colony, and five congregations meet in five sundry places for Word and Sacraments, here must be five Churches, ••s our brethren take the word Church, 1 Cor. 11. 18. Act. 11. 16 & 21. 22. & 4. 31. Mat. 18. 17. & 16. 18. Sure, though they had no Officers, they are a homogeneous true visible Church, as Mr. H teacheth, page 1. c. 5. page 5. and so here, or six Churches (if we contend not a∣bout names) under one Presbyterial government, which is the yeelding of the cause, and yet at forty miles distance, and yet by no will or appointment can they meet in one place, O but they are all one Church in our account! one congregation in Christs account. Shew us Scripture for this acception of the word Church in Old or New Testament; that they are one sin∣gle congregation, otherwise Mr. H. his account is no account: If they be one Church, because they have one and the same power, jurisdiction; officers they had before. So we say, and the same power and jurisdiction in nature and essence we grant; but so all the congregations on earth have one and the same

power and jurisdiction, covenant, seals, saith, Christ, hope of glory; so we agree. Why dispute we, if the meaning be, that all these six swarmes (for a thousand will be a number too great for one congregation, if not sufficient) are but one indivi∣dual congregation, though now separated by forty miles, and meeting in six sundry places.

• 1. Give us Scripture for that Church.
• 2. Give us any Greek Author sacred or prophane, that so speakes, for we stand not to Mr. H. his account in this.
• 3. Where there are and must be six sundry meetings, coitiones six numero distinctae.

2. Six companies hearing at the same time six several Ser∣mons.

3. Partaking of six Tables of the Lord numerically distinct, * 1.119 here sure must be fix congregations, as our Brethren define us a Church, a company of Believers meeting in one place, &c. And if so, here is a prelacy.

3. A number of non-residents; for all are Elders ruling; but it is physically impossible, that all can be Elders teaching. So Mr. H. then it is no•• essential to a Church that they meet all * 1.120 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, in one place, as the brethren often tell us.

M. H. But when the Congregations are fixed, and they esta∣blished in peace, and setled with support about them, not more then may comely and comfortably meet together, to partake of all ordinan∣ces, should be one Church.

Ans. If the six swarms, which issue out of the numerous * 1.121 Church of Ierusalem, disturb the peace, and make war and di∣vision in the Church, it is strange. The Eldership or Presbytery over these six swarms, so separated by many miles in divers Co∣lonies, may either meet and exercise discipline, and dispence censures to these six swarms not yet setled, and provided with Officers, or they may not meet. To say they may not meet for that end, is to deny that they are under one Presbytery of the same chosen Elders, contrary to what Mr. H. said. If they may meet to dispence censures, here shal be ruling Elders, & no physi∣cal possibility of teaching the swarms so separated as fourty miles, they may haply hear of written Decrees, as Act. 16. 4. but cannot be edified by preaching.

2. So this Church congregational which cannot comely and comfortably meet to partake of all the ordinances, is no ordinance of Christ, and so no congregational Church. But such are these swarms that are fourty miles distant.

3. This Church is either visible, or not; neither can be said by Mr. H. his principles, as elsewhere is proved.

Mr. H. Hence an answer may be easily accommodated to the ex∣amples which Mr. R. brings for a Presbyterian Church.

1. That of the Apostles will no wise suit his end for to make up a Presbyterial Church; there must be many congregations, many Elders appropriated to these congregations, which have power over their own only, and not over others; and these must combine, and upon the combination, the Elders must assemble and d••spence their censures, and set down their decisions. But there were no Elders at Jerusalem appropriate to their several charges and Churches, which had power only over them; and such Elders the Apostles could not be, because though they had all power in them, yet they had no power limited for that should contradict their Apostolick commis∣sion.

Ans. I smile to read this worthy man yeild in terminis a Pres∣byterial * 1.122 Church; and yet be saith, the examples serve not Mr. R. his end. Why? saith he,

1. To make up a Presbyterial Church, there must be many congregations; good: so say we.

2. There must be many Elders appropriated to these Congrega∣tions, which have power over their own only (saith he) and not over others; That we deny. I should say, any other save this worthy man, (whom I much loved and ever honoured) who would write a Book against Presbyterial government, and yet did not understand the constituent elements of a presbyterial Church, deserves to be censured; for Mr. H. yieldeth all the presbyte∣rial Church that Mr. R. pleads for, or that the famous Synod at Westminster desire; where there were eminently learned men, who well understood Presbyterial government, and all adver∣saries thereof. An eminent man Mr. Ier. Burroughs, one of the dissenting Brethren, did not oppose, nor enter his dissent against the proposition, concerning a Presbyterial Church, as Mr. H. does; nor look upon it as a principal of Presbyterial govern∣ment;

only the Dissenters did hold, there was but one single congregation at Ierusalem, in which they are redacted to mi∣serable absurdities; and in these two Mr. H. contradicts them: let them compose their domestick contradictions. See the an∣swer of the Assembly of Divines to the seven dissenting Bre∣thren, An. 1644. Suppose in Jerusalem (saith the Synod) there * 1.123 were ten congregations, and twenty officers, feeding and ruling them in common, not one of them fixed to any one congregation. This kind of Presbytery would pass for a lawful government: and none of these incongruities or absurdities are charged on them, by this argument: and it shall not follow that ruling and teaching are not commensu∣rable, as the Holy Ghost makes them commensurable.

2. Mr. H. cannot, nor any man for him, clear from that text Act. 2•• whether they were fixed or not fixed, they are the Elders of the Church of Ierusalem, that is, as Mr. H. saith, contradi∣cting the dissenting Brethren, Elders of divers congregations, under one Presbyterial government, which is all we crave.

2. Fixedness or not fixedness of Elders is an accident of the * 1.124 visible governing Church to our Brethren: who hold that it is the same numerical Church homogeneous, which being void of Elders, may chuse their officers, and thereafter being fixed and formed, may excommunicate all their Elders, if they turn here∣tical; so that the people is the Church without their officers, and the officers to Mr. H. are separable adjuncts, and the co∣ming or going of the separable adjuncts of the Church cannot alter the nature of the Church. It is most weak, that Mr. H. saith, that the Apostles could not be fixed Pastors to them, for then they should be limited Pastors to them, and so not Apostles: for there can be no contradiction between Apostles and Pastors, for their fixed preaching, and fixed administring of the seals. For example, Pauls pastoral officiating a year and six months at Corinth, Act. 18. 11. and so many years at Sphesus, so many years at Rome, differs not in nature and essence from the pa∣storal preaching and administring of the seals in constantly fix∣ed Pastors, chosen to the congregation for all their life: and yet he remained habitu, and actu primo an Apostle. Yes the ad∣ding of an extraordinary seal of a miracle, contradicts not the charter, or the preaching of the Gospel, more then Samuels

judging at Gilgal, is opposite to his judging all Israel at Ramah: Extension of preaching to many is a meer accident; and a mem∣bers receiving of the Supper in his own Church is not opposite to his receiving thereof in four other Churches. See the An∣swer of the Assembly, page 115, 116.

As also, if the twelve Apostles govern, as they do, Act. 6. All the twelve meetings, and yet neither do, nor can preach all * 1.125 of them to every one of the twelve, except all the twelve be in twelve several meetings at once, then (which is a monstrous im∣possibility)

1. Ruling is divided from preaching.

2. Then all the twelve cannot fulfil their Ministry. Yes,

3. Then Episcopal ruling of many Churches, and neither being bound, nor able to teach any of them, or all of them, is not sinful. But sure the Apostles might govern, send their de∣crees, and Epistles to many Churches, the members whereof they never saw in the face.

Nor could all the many thousands, who had power of judg∣ing with the Elders, as our Brethren say, meet in one place come∣ly and comfortably to act: and therefore Christ so must never have appointed such a judicature, to rule all these congregati∣ons, who are entitatively one; so must they say what we say, and more. For all the congregations on earth are entitatively and in nature one, and yet our Brethren will be far from saying, that they are all under one government, as they say that these meetings at Ierusalem were.

M. H. The rest of the examples of Antioch, Ephesus, Rome, though it were granted upon their greater growth, and increase, and so want of Elders, they might meet in divers places for the while, these might still be under one presbytery, their officers in a distinct manner attending upon them. And therefore Gerson Bu∣cerus in his answer sayes here, Quis adeo ineptire sustinuerit, &c. Who can say; that because they meet in divers places, they were un∣der divers Presbyteries, or Elders?

Ans. 1. This is a short way of answering, with a leaving out of the Church of Samaria, a great City, wherein all both men and women were baptized, the Church of Corinth, of Thessalo∣nica, &c.

2. And yet there is no lesse cause to say all the Saints * 1.126 at Rome, Antioch, Ephesus, Samaria could not meete in one place, then that these of Ierusalem could not.

2. If they might meet in divers places, for the while, and yet be under one Presbytery; Here is a Presbyteriall Church of many Congregations, for a while. Here is a Pre∣laticall and Antichristian Government, for a while, at least ordained by Christ.

And Mr. H. writes a Book with a huge noise of absur∣dities, with which he burdens his Brethren the Presby∣terians; yet he will suffer their Church to stand, for a while.

3. Who told Mr. H that a Presbyterial Church may stand for a while, during the time of the growth of the the Church of Ierusalem, Antioch, Ephesus, but no lon∣ger? for when the swarmed out Churches are once set∣led, the Presbyterian Church must downe againe, since the Scripture speakes nothing of this. Who gave Mr. H. leave to set up an Antichristian Tabernacle (for so is the Presbytery to him) for an houre, and pull it downe a∣gain?

4. It is a wonder that Mr. H. should cite Gerson Bu∣cer cuttedly, as a Witnesse so much for a Presbyteriall Church, not in the swarming out of Churches onely (of which Bucer hath not one word) but in the setled state of the Church: for Bucer contradicts Mr. H. and all his as foo∣lishly erring, when they say such Churches meet in di∣vers places for the Word and Seales; Ergo, they are inde∣pendent in their government, and cannot be under one com∣mon government. Bucer saith, if they lie near together, it is folly to say they are under divers Presbyteries, and so say we.

Mr. H. 2. It doth not appear out of any Text, nor any evin∣cing Argument gathered therefrom, that (setting aside the Church of Jerusalem) they should needs meet in several pla∣ces.

Ans. Then the Church of Ierusalem met in sundry places, by Mr. H. his argument: but this shall offend the dissenting

Brethren, that maintain against the Synod at Westminster, that * 1.127 they meet all in one place.

2. Mr. H. should have given a reason, why the Church of Ierusalem met in sundry places, and not the other Churches of Antioch, Ephesus, but because he saw our Arguments run as strong for other Churches as for Ierusalem. He was pleased to dictate what he could not demonstrate, and so leave the Reader in the dark.

3. Before I leave this, let Mr. H. or his teach what is meant by this, that there were about three thousand added to the Church, Act. 2. 21. whether by the Church be meant the one hundred and twenty, of which ch. 1. and whether there the one hundred and twenty were there to receive the three thou∣sand as members at that time in a judicial way? And if they were not there, how the three thousand were not added prima∣rily to the Catholike Christian Church that then was; and se∣condarily * 1.128 to this, or to that Church? as we say. For when there were said to be added to the Church, they were not added to themselves.

Mr. H. 3. Let it be considered, whether by Church may not be meant many Churches. Saul made havock of the Church. i. e. of the faithful of many Churches.

Ans. It is weak as water, Saul persecuteth the Church, i. e. * 1.129 members of the independent Church: Ergo, there is no Presby∣terial Church. Ergo, there is not such a thing as a Synod, for he persecuted Iames, Peter, and the Elders and Brethren, mem∣bers of the Synod, where he might find them; now the Apostles were not fixed member of congregations: and let Mr. H. con∣sider whether Luke gives not a better interpretat on then he, Act. 83. Saul made havock of the Church, entring into every house, and haling m••n and women, and committed them to p••ison. So that Saul destroyed the scattered members, that were n••t inchurched, and where he found any of this way, Act. 9. 2. whether members of a congregation, or not, even members of

divers meetings under one Presbytery, as he grants, he perse∣cuted them. And by this the Church at Ierusalem, Act. 11. 22. must be Churches congregational at Ierusalem. And Act. 2. The Lord added to the Church such as should be saved; that is, the Lord added to divers Independent Congregations, such as should be saved; good: but this Church and these com∣mon Elders meet for acts of Government, Act. 2. 18. and the day following, Paul went in with us to J•…•…, and all the El∣ders (verse 25.) were present. S••re the place shewes they meet for acts of Government. Yea, Act. 11. 30. & 21. 18. They sent alms to the Elders of Iudea, to be distributed to the distressed in Iudea. As also the Elders of Iudea were members of the Synod, Act. 1••. And how could there be administrating of the seals without any jurisdiction at all to debar the unwor∣thy?

CHAP. IX.

The Arguments of Mr. R. for a Ministerial Church from Matth. 18. are vindicated from the Exceptions of Mr. Hooker.

MR. H. If Christ allude to the Synedry, then must Mat. 18. * 1.130 be expounded of a Presbyterial Church. Mr. H. both Pro∣position and Assumption is denied.

Ans. Mr. H. leaps from one Book to another. I no * 1.131 where frame an Argument from a meer allusion: but so, if Christ so allude to an authoritative company, that hath power of binding and loosing, as the Jewish Sanhedrim in this Mat. 18. then he judgeth the Church, Mat. 18. to be a Juridical Church.

2. Its a poor Argument, he alludes not to the Jewish Syna∣gogue, because that Synagogue had no power of Excommuni∣cation, as this Church Mat. 18. hath, saith he: but can there be no allusion to a Iudicature, except the one, to which allusion is made, and that of which the present speech is, have the like power? Then cannot the Scripture allude to earthly Princes, who place their greatest Courtier upon the right hand, because earthly Princes have not the like power with the Father of Jesus Christ. This destroys all allusions, which abound in the Scripture; as Paul, Rom. 10. 18. alludes to the Sun; Malachi compareth Gospel-worship to the burning of Incense, chap. 1. shall it then follow, that the one is of the nature of the other? That allu∣sions bring little light, is said without ground; for they being grounded upon Metaphors often, which bring light, must bring much light.

3. That Synagogues had no power to excommunicate, seems to bring darkness, and not light. The contrary is Iob. 9.

and 16. Though they abused that Ordinance.

Mr. H. Its in vain to send the plaintiff to a general Councel, he might be dead before he be relieved, and the Councel be ga∣thered.

Ans. We send no man by a loup to a General Councel, but the grieved man may appeal to the nearest Judicature; and Mr. H. will have him to loup to a General Councel at the first, being accused of a scandal, which declares, that he would elude all the Government of Christ, between him and that Judicature.

2. We do not maintain any Appeals whatsoever, but onely * 1.132 righteous Appeals. Illud tantum p••ssumus, quod jure possu∣mus.

3. So may the plaintiff be buried before a Synod, by way of consultation, may be had; the wayes of Discipline, a•• all Christs ordinary wayes in the Gospel, may possibly never take effect in those to whom the word is a savour of death unto death, but that doth not nullifie an Ordinance of God.

Mr. H. Our Saviour, Mat. 18. points at a standing Tribunal of such a Church as is at hand, whereof both parties were mem∣bers. * 1.133

Ans. Its a perverting of the words of Christ, Mat. 18. that * 1.134 no man trespassing, whom I must endevour to gain, can be my brother, but he who is a member of the same congregation of which I am a member. This is to renounce and quit all brother∣ly communion with all Churches on earth, but onely that sin∣gle congregation of which I am a member; when not one bro∣ther, but twenty or many Churches of brethren without the congregation, as false brethren of Iudea trespass against An∣tioch by perverse doctrine, Act. 15. there is not a Judicature a•• hand, hath Christ provided to tell no Church, and left no re∣medy to remove the greatest of scandals?

Mr. H. How could a Church in an Island, or the first Church at Jerusalem, Act. 1. 23. exercise discipline upon an offender upon this ground?

Ans. Why not? since the purpose of Christ is, That every Church, even the less of one hundred and twenty, Acts 1.

and the greater of ten thousands, Act. 2. & 4. & 6. should re∣spectively purge themselves; and when association of many * 1.135 Churches about shall be, they should also purge those without the congregation. Scandals fall out where many meetings are, and one onely Presbytery over them, as Mr. H. granteth: to which of the meetings shall: the plaintiffs complain? The offenders are of divers Meetings or Churches that are not at hand.

Mr. H. The Sanhedrim is a mixt Iudicature, partly of Ec∣clesiastical, partly of Civil Iudges, Deut. 17. 12. 2 Chron. 19. Ergo, allusion cannot be made thereunto.

Ans. The Consequence is naught. * 1.136

2. Mr. H. with the Prelates, confound the Judicatures, but they are clearly distinguished, while one is appointed for the matters of the King another for the matters of the Lord, 2 Chron. 19. 11. So are they distinguished, The Priest or the Judge, not the Priest and the Judge, Diut. 17. 12. Men might sinsully confound them; but sin is no institution of the Lord.

Mr. H. Arg. 2. The Church of believers is that which meets for prophecying and for praying: but this, Mat. 18. especially for binding and loosing, and censures. Mr. H. The Church of be∣lievers is assembled mainly for prophecying and praying, yet not onely, but for censures also, the Word being ended.

Ans. That is indeed in question, That men, women and chil∣dren meet ordinarily every Lords-day for to act in all Ordi∣nances; and after Sermon to leed witness, binde and loose, and that under the notion of believers, for neither here, nor in Scripture, is there warrant for this.

Mr. H. Arg. 3. The Church Mat. 18. is such a superiour and judicial Seat, as is to be obeyed in the Lord, under the pain of ex∣communication: But a multitude of believers are not such a seat. So Mr. R. Mr H. The Major is the question, and the Conclu∣sion is to be proved, whether a particular congregation be the highest Tribunal, or the classical Church: and Mr. R. takes one part of the Conclusion to pr••ve the other: If the congregation be not high∣est, then the classical must be. The Minor should have been proved, not nakedly propounded.

Ans. I propound a Syllogism, and for answer to the minor, Mr. H. transforms my Argument, which I dreamed not of, and sayes, I take one part of the conclusion to prove the other, If the congregation be not highest, then the classis is. But, Sir, that is not one part of the conclusion to prove another; but since you bring it, its a lawful Syllogism, Either the congregation or the classis is the highest Tribunal: But not the congregation. Yet this is Mr. H. Arg. not mine.

The Church Mat. 18. is such a superiour seat, as is to be o∣beyed, as being over us in the Lord, &c. But no Scripture, no * 1.137 Divine in the world saith, That the multitude of believers (I use not there the term Congregational Church at all) is such a su∣periour Seat, that is over the Guides, and whom the Guides do obey in the Lord, or disobey under the pain of Excommunica∣tion. This minor of mine is not nakedly propounded. The Scripture saith, the officers are over the multitude of believers in the Lord, 1 Thess. 5. 12, 14. 1 Tim. 5. 17. Heb. 13. 17. But the contrary is never said; they do not awake that say, this is to take one part of a conclusion to prove the other; for its a conclu∣sion proved by a medium, that is no part, neither subject nor at∣tribute of the conclusion.

Mr. H. Arg. 4. of Mr. R. Whatever the Church may excom∣municate, every member thereof convened with the Church may inflict all inferiour censures.

But all the members cannot inflict lesser punishment; for neither women, nor aged children, nor the unofficed brethren, can rebuks, exhort, or, by the Word, openly convince the officers. Ans. The consequence is feeble, as appears from the nature of delegated power, which is committed by Christ to persons capable thereof, which women for their sex, children for the want of the exercise of understanding, cannot do. People have power to choose officers, therefore women have power to put in their voices. The Body of a Corporation may put out a Major upon desert; therefore women and children may do it. No, the wise God hath included the votes of women in the male.

Ans. Nay, but Mr. H. shall not so elude the Argument. Whatsoever the judging, binding and loosing Church of belie∣vers may do, that every member of the joynt community may

do, in collegio, if the Keyes be given to them (as Mr H. and Mr. Cotton say) as actual believers, giving Peters confession, Mat. 16. and therefore Mr. H. too suddenly sayes, The consi∣quence (he would have said the major, for its a lawful Syllogism) is feeble; for women, children, sons come to ag•• servants, which he left out, are formal and essential parts of the believing Church, to whom the Keyes are given as to the first subject. If the Keyes be not given to them as confessing and professing be∣lievers, because not to women, sons, servants, then not to all confessing and professing believers, as such; then not to all blessed, as taught by a teacher above flesh and blood, as Peter was, Mat. 16. This shall cross the Principles of our Brethren (& the Truth and Scripture cannot but cross them) nor can it be denied, but women, sons come to age, servāts, are no less members of that Church, than the multitude of male-believers, for they confess Christ, as Peter, are blessed, and built on the Rock, as well as Peter, and are no less conceived in charity, to have some spi•…•…l good in them, as Mr. H. dictates, cap. 2. par. 1, 15, 16. and these must be visible Saints to whom Mr. H. his definition of visible Saints agrees; and therefore our brethren must either quit the principles they follow, or then a multitude of believers of visible Saints must be larger than the actual binding and loo∣sing Church, Mat. 18. and against their will this, Tell the Church, must be understood of, Tell some believers onely, (if they will) The Officers; but, Tell not women, nor sons, nor servants, for they are no part of the binding and loosing Church; and, If he hear not the Church; that is, as the Hebraism there, If he obey not the Church, if he obey not some believers Men, and Heads of Families, not women, servants, ••ons, Let him be to thee as a publican, &c.

2. So woman are either not capable of believing and visible * 1.138 Saintship, which none can say; or they are not capable of a power of binding and loosing: and so a power capable of binding and loosing is not given to the multitude of believers, as the Church, Mat. 18.

3. Nor are women, sons, servants, debarred from voicing in Election, because it is a Church-power, for it is no power of jurisdiction. For

1. Their tacit voices and consents are not excluded, because they must try the spirits, & not upon trust, & fide implicitâ believe every teacher more than men, or believe as the Church believes, more than their husbands, nor must they take Doctrines as truth: upon their husbands word; not are women so excluded from speaking in the Church, as they may upon no occasion confess their faith.

2. Profess vocally repentance.

3. Depose as Witnesses.

4. Accuse the guilty before the binding Church.

4. Nor may a Corporation cast out a Major by an authorita∣tive power, such as binding and loosing is, Mat. 18.

5. We seek a warrant why the votes of women in choosing their Pastors, must more be included in the votes of the male, than their being essential parts of the redeemed Church is in∣cluded in the males, or their confessing publickly, that Jesus is the Christ, as many women Martyrs, and sons and servants have gloriously done; and yet their confession of Christ to the death must be personal, and not included in the confession of husband or parents, as Mat. 10. 32.

Mr. H. Arg. 5. of Mr. R. Those to whom the essence and de∣finition * 1.139 of a Ministerial Church, having power to excommunicate, doth belong; those and those onely are understood under the Name of the Church, Mat. 18. But the essence and definition of a Mini∣sterial Church, having power to excommunicate, doth not neces∣sarily belong to a great company of believers assembled Church∣wise.

Ans. Both propositions may be denied. Neither a Church with∣out officers, nor as having them, is here onely understood; but the second sense is here firstly attended. For both people and Elders have their power, parts and places in a right order and manner; when its said, a Ministerial Church is here understood, Ministe∣rial notes either Ministers without the body exclusively, and that is false, or Ministers with the body inclusively. Now a Ministe∣rial Church in the fairest sense aims at both. In the first sense,

the proposition is false; in the second it doth not conclude to whom the essence and definition of a Ministerial, i. e. of a Church of Mi∣nisters, without the body, having power to excommunicate, doth necessarily belong: These and these onely are here understood. This Mr. R. l. 1. p. 226. refu••eth. * 1.140

Ans. Well then Mr. H. denies the conclusion; then both a Ministerial Church, and a Church of Redeemed, meeting to partake of Ordinances, have their part here: Ergo, women have their part here.

2. If a Church in both s••nses be here understood when all the Officers turn grievous Wolves, Socinians, Papists, Familists, such as say they are Apostles, and do li••; then

1. Must the people that are stumbled complain to themselves. This is not just, to make the complaining party (saith M. H.) judge. What if they unjustly complain, and say their officers are Pres∣byterial and Prelatical, and are Legal Preachers, and preach neither Christ nor Free-grace, then hath Christ ordained them whose lips preserve not knowledge, to be the onely judging and first Church, which hath power to excommunicate, to be the * 1.141 first and onely Judges-of sound Doctrine, and Heresie in offi∣cers. And suppose the Church of people and officers be here firstly understood; we cannot complain of the Familist people (of which there were too many in N••E.) to the Elders, for the same reason.

2. Nor is it true, that people and Elders (the people must in judging be first, by Mr. H.) have their power, parts and place in this work, for all Elders and people have equally a decisive voice, except women, and children, and se••vants; and by what reason they want votes, a reason 〈◊〉〈◊〉 yet is not heard of.

3. There is no reason that binding and loosing may be trans∣acted by onely a power of judgement in people, for then a * 1.142 power of office is accidental to binding and loosing, how then can a society with both power of judgement and of office be understood here firstly? as Mr. H. saith. Therefore I ask a rea∣son, why officers, who are meer adjuncts, such a•• come in at the by, and as latter in nature, power, and operation to the visi∣ble Church, should have any hand in binding and loosing, since all officers are made and unmade, ordained and cast out by the male-Church, by this way?

4. Nor can the officers binde and loose as officers, nor hath Christ given this power to the officers as officers, by this way of our Brethren. For they say,

1. That the Keyes were given to Peter, Mat. 16. as to a be∣liever, not as to an officer.

2. Officers to them are but adjuncts of the visible Church, and the Keyes are given to the visible Church before they have officers, and the people may make and excommunicate them.

3. Here is strange work! the Keyes were not given to Peter as an officer, but as a believer, and yet he useth the Keyes as an officer.

4. The Church is not made Ministerial by us, without the body exclusively wholly (for Christs Government is voluntary) nor ought any new thing to be concluded in our Assemblies, while the people hear of it: for if the Romans used rogare & suadere legem, and obtain the consent of the people thereunto, far more are they not to be acknowledged as Church-laws, that are to be obtruded upon the godly against their will and know∣ledge; and much more if they be against the Word of God, and former godly acts with consent agreed unto by the Church; that is, whether the people consent or not, but yet without the body, whether they exercise acts of jurisdiction or not, for no act of jurisdiction is due to them; and to exclude the consent of women, no less interessed in practise of conscience than men, is to be Lords of their faith.

Mr. H. The sixth argument refers to former proofs, &c.

Ans. And Mr. R. refers to former Replies.

Mr. H. Its evidently false, that there can be no complaint to a multitude; for complaints may be made to a Parliament.

Ans. How can complaints be made to ten thousand of the * 1.143 Church of Ierusalem, for that Church, as Mr. H. grants, pag. 128, 129. met in sundry places, not in one: No Parliament or Judicature consisteth of such a number. We cannot complain to the many Churches of Galatia of their wicked tenet of Ju∣stification by Works, for they are scattered in divers societies, and its unlawful (say our Brethren) to meet in their officers to exercise jurisdiction.

Mr. H. Arg. 8. The house of Cloe complained to Paul.

2. Paul gives rules about the Elders receiving of complaints.

Ans. That house complained to Paul, because his Apostolick Authority might have been helpful, but they might have com∣plained to any of the Church of Corinth. Paul advises Titus to hear complaints, to prepare them for the Church. 3. If the people must consent tacitly to the censures, before they be dispensed they must hear the complaints.

Ans. Paul gives rules and directions to Timothy, 1 Tim. 5. 19. v. 1. and Titus, cap. 2. as to pastors, not as to believers, concerning the manner of receiving complaints, nor is there in Scripture, Precept, Promise or practise of believers to receive * 1.144 complaints, we are surer than our Brethren; and its safer to ex∣pound thi, Tell the Church, that is, Tell Timothy and the El∣ders; then, Tell the Church, that is, Tell any member of the Church at Co••inth, i. e. Tell any woman, or servant, for they are as essentially members as Timothy or any of the Elders: 2. and must joyn their consent to censures, because members must hear the scandals, because they must tacitly consent before censures be dispensed, it follows not that members must be told; for the tacit consent of women is requisite, for they may be scandali∣zed or edified by the good or evil dispensing of censures as well as men.

2. They may not converse with excommunicate persons more than men.

3. Their consciences must not be Lorded over more than the consciences of men, in the dispensing of censures.

4. They must have a vote tacit or formal in choosing of a Pastor, and must not take him blindly; and complaints to wo∣men, sons, servants, yea, and the precepts of withdrawing, Rom. 16. 17. 1 Cor. 5. 6, 10. 2 Th••ss. 3 14. 2 Tim. 3. 5. Tit. 3. 10. Ioh. 10. 11. oblige the consciences of women, sons and ser∣vants, then women may receive witness against Elders; as well as Timothy, 1 Tim. 5. 19 20. but with such qualifications and limitations. For Mr H. maintains this connexion, Complaints may be made unto the Church (Tell the Church, Mat. 18.) to all, without whose tacit consent there can be no proceeding to excommu∣nication. But without womens consent there is no Excommuni∣cation, no Admission, no Election, Responde it a, vol non.

Mr. H. The people may censure heretical Elders in an Island.

Ans. So they may in justa tutela aeterna salutis, but not by the power of the Keyes.

2. And so may the Elders, remaining godly and sound, re∣move with the Tabernable and Candlestick from a people in an Island, if they dance to the golden Calf, and be incorrigible: Yea, if the Elders and men in an Island turn Familists, and the women, sons, servants remain sound, Let Mr. H. shew what the sounder part of the Church may do. And though women be forbidden authoritatively to teach in the Church, 1 Tim. 2. 7. * 1.145 1 Cor. 14. and publickly, yet they may teach the younger wo∣men, Tit 2. 2, 3. give a seasonable rebuke and counsel to men, 2 Sam. 20. 16, 17. 1 Sam 25. 23, 24, 32, 33. and a woman a sister is to labour to gain a sister, by Matth. 18. and that in a Church-way; and women, as other Church-members, are to teach, exhort, warn, according to their place, as well as men, Col. 3. 16. Rom. 15. 14. 1 Thess. 5. 14. Heb. 3. 13 & 20. 25. Let M. H. teach us how their faith is included in the men in these duties, in consenting that a savoury man, not an Heretick, be their pastor.

Mr. H. Arg. 9. That Church is here understood to whom the Keyes are given, Mat. 16. but they are given onely to a Classical Church. Ans. The minor is barely affirmed.

Ans. My Argument is divided: The minor is not barely af∣firmed. The Keyes are given to Peter, as representing Elders and Apostles, to whom Christ saith, Iohn 20. Whose sins ye for∣give, they are forgiven; to whom he said, As my Father sent me, so I send you: but this official sending is most undue to the people; and its equivalent to that Mat. 28. Go, teach and ba∣ptize. But Christ said not to unofficed Brethren, Receive the * 1.146 holy Ghost; Whose sins ye forgive, &c. Go, teach and baptize. So Cyprian.

Mr. H. Arg. 10. of Mr. R. The onely apparent argument a∣gainst this interpretation is weak, and therefore this sense hath ne strength.

Ans. Both parts fail: 1. There may be other Reasons given. 2. It doth not follow, that the different sense is clear, because many better Reasons haply may be rendred, than were alledged. Mr. Ball according to his sagacity and sharpness of dispute, seeketh far and wide where to finde, where the word Church noteth onely the El∣ders, but all cometh to this, One may suppose such a sense.

Ans. 1. Mr. H. denies the Antecedent and the Consequence, * 1.147 and proves both to be false with the same Argument, Because many better Reasons may haply be given; which is bad Logick: for other Reasons may be given (and Separatists, Morellius, Anabaptists, and Prelatical men have besieged, but never taken in this Text) but if this be the onely seeming and apparent rea∣son given for popular jurisdiction, yea or that can be given, the consequence is not proved by Mr. H. his Adverb haply, which implies No as well as I. And when Mr. R. saith, the Reasons against our sense are Sophisms, its not an answer to say, I. but stronger arguments haply may be rendred by others, such as never were alledged before. What if one should say stronger Reasons and clearer Scriptures yet than ever have been alledged, may haply be rendred for unwritten Traditions, Image worship, Praying to the Dead? Papists should be little stronger than they are.

2. The Argument is but this:

If the word Church in all the Scriptures so often mentioned, be never taken for the Elders onely, it a strong suspicion it is not so taken in this place, Matth. 18. But the word Church—is such.

1. The major is denied. All the judiciou•• Interpreters finde a word onely in this sense in this place, and that it cannot bear sense according to the analogie of faith, but in this sense onely, as scope, matter and circumstances of the place inforce; and yet the same word must be otherwise taken in many other pla∣ces: And when all is done, the conclusion of the apparent reason amounts but to a suspicion; and Mr. H. of his own addes the qualification of strong suspicion, and Mr. R hath leave upon better grounds to adde, that his own suspicion is weak.

Mr. H. wrongs that eminently learned and godly man, Mr. Ball, who proves the Elders here must be meant, and no other Church, and Mr. H. touches not with one finger his rea∣sons.

2. I retort the Argument. If the word Church of the Redee∣med meet to partake of all Ordinances, Word, Seals, Censures, &c. often mentioned in Scripture, be never taken for Brethren onely, excluding believing women, sons come to age of 15 or 16 years, which are the far larger number of the Redeemed, confederate, visible Church, called, sanctified, as 1 Cor. 1. 1. 2 Cor. 1. 1. Eph. 1. 1. Col. 1. 2. 1 Thess. 1. 1. 2 Thess 1. 1, &c. then can it not be so taken, Mat. 18. and the Assumption must be as strong, That the word Church in this sense is destitute of the least loving look of the allowance of any Text, that might be a se∣cond in the field; as is the Rhetorication, in place of Disputa∣tion of Mr. H. therefore we desire a parallel place for the ac∣ception o•• the word Church or onely male-Church of Redeem∣ed meeting for all Ordinances.

Mr. H. answers not, when he tells us, that Women for their sex, and children for want of the exercise of understanding, are exclu∣ded from governing.

Ans. That is another question, whether they be excluded from * 1.148 governing from this, what is the notation of the word Church, Mat. 18. and whether women, children come to age, and ser∣vants, be not essential parts, and the far larger part of the Church of believors, fed, redeemed, of the Church which Chr••st hath insti∣tuted in the Gospel—that is, (saith the Discipline of N. E.) of a combination of faithful godly persons, meeting for that end, to par∣take of all the Ordinances of God in one place-built on the Rock, Mat. 16. If such a signification of the word Church be not in all the Scripture, is not this to have in the bag a stone & a stone, when we say, Tell the Church—and if he hear not the Church, Mat. 18. is the Church-meeting in one place for hearing the Word, recei∣ving the seals, professing the faith of Peter built upon the Rock, which essentially includes women, aged children, servants, but yet Tell the Church, is not Tell the women, aged children and servants, for they are excluded from governing (say they) true, but they are not excluded from being members of the Church,

Mat. 18. which in its proper signification (as our Brethren say) signifieth only this redeemed visible Church built on the rock mee∣ting in one place, &c.

3. The word Church, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, must in Scripture be restri∣cted to the subject matter and the end, wherefore the conven∣tion * 1.149 is instituted; and seldom is it taken, but it excludes some such, as Act. 19. it cannot signifie the Church of Christ, but a civil tumultuary meeting. The town Clerk dismissed the Church.

2. Eph. 5. 26. Christ loved his Church, and gave himself for her. The Church there is such a Catholick body visible, or in∣visible, as he shall present without spot or wrinkle, and exclu∣deth rotten members professors, as Magus, who are no more but visible members, but includeth all real Saints, Men, Women, Infants, Jews, Gentiles, &c.

3. It notes these who convene in the same place to be fed with Word, Seals, Censures, Act. 11. 26. a whole year they assem∣ble with the Church, 1 Cor. 14 4. he that prophecieth, edifieth the Church. It must exclude Infants, who though members of the visible Church, yet cannot be edified by prophecying: but can∣not but include Women, more aged children and servants: and say there were but one place in all the World, where the Church came together for the hearing of the Word, receiving of the Lords Supper, that one place were sufficient to teach what the word Church notes in that place. And so here, Mat. 18. is the like case.

4. Tell the Church must be, tell the Church that hath power to bind and loose on earth, and which if the offender hear not, he must be declared a heathen; but this is neither women, chil∣dren, nor servants, by our Brethren.

2. The binding and loosing here is to be expounded of the specifick acts of office, never given to any by other Scriptures, but only to officers, 2 Thes. 5. 12, 14. Luke 10. 16. Heb. 13. 17. 1 Tim. 4. 14. 1 Tim. 5. 17, 20. Act, 20. 28. Rom. 12. 7, 8. Mat. 16. 17.

1 Pet. 5. 1, 2. Tit. 2. 5. Ioh 21. 15. Ephes. 4. 11, 12. Is. 6. 5. Ier. 3. 15.

5. Tell the Church, if he hear not the Church: shall be by us gladly expounded of both Rulers and Professors in their own * 1.150 kind.

1. Let him be to thee as a Heathen, that is, to the whole Church, women and servants, by withdrawing from his compa∣ny. Pu••ge out, all ye who have been puffed up and mourned not, and such were women, and so men also to whom he writ∣eth. 1 Cor. 1. 1. And women were a part of the lump in danger to be infected; and upon that hazard were not to eat & drink with an excommunicated man, 1 Cor. 5. 6, 12. and were not to be mixed, but to eschew scandalous persons, 2 This. 3. 14 Rom. * 1.151 16. 17. nor receive such a man unto their house, nor bid him God speed, 2 Ioh 10. 11. Tit. 3. 10. which the women were to do one way, and the Elders another way. So 2 Cor. 2. 7. Ye ought ra∣ther to forgive him, and comfort him. Sure women, children of age, and servants, to whom he writes, were to forgive, in their way, for to them he determined to come, 2 Cor. 1. 15. They were a part of his rejoycing. v. 14. they were anointed, established, sea∣led * 1.152 by the Spirit, v. 21, 22. as well as the men and Elders. And say the word of confirming their love, were an authoritative word, as it is; Yet it is so, as applied to the Elders, not as ap∣plied to women. As the same word of Worshipping relating to Iehovah is a religious adoring, relating to David is civil reve∣rence, 1 Chr. ••9. 21. The people bowed their heads, & worshipped the Lord and the King, 1 Sam. 12. 18 All the people greatly feared the Lord and Samuel. Though they were two really distinct actions. And this cannot be denied by Mr. H. who gives to the Elders an official power of jurisdiction, to the Brethren a judicial power of judgment; Ergo, they excommunicate not one and the same way.

6. Yes, and Paul writes to Timothy, not as to a Christian simply, but as to a Pastor representing the company of Elders (as Christ speaks to Peter, Mat. 16.) as to a Pastor to take heed to Doctrine and reading, 1 Tim. 4. 14, 16. What Widows, 1 Tim 5. 9. What Watchmen, 1 Tim. 3. 1, 2. 2 Tim. 2. 2. 1 Tim.

5. 17, 22. What Deacons, 1 Tim. 3. 10, 11. there should be in the Church. How he should rebuke, preach. Now this way the people should be warned, how to preach, how to rebuke, not to lay on hands suddenly, to save themselves and others by prea∣ching, if they have a joint power of ruling with officers. It is true he writes to Timothy as to a Christian, to flee the lusts of you h••, but in order to the Ministry, that he may be an example to the flock, 2 Tim. 2. otherwise women, children come to age, servants, are to flee lusts, and to follow righteousness, faith, love, peace, &c. yet they are to exercise no jurisdiction.

7. Tell the Church, cannot bear this, as Mr. H. would say, tell first the Church of Officers and people, when the officers are too ordinarily grievous wolves, seducers, blind guides, Idol-shep∣herds, Act. 20. 29. Mat. 7. 15. 2 Pet. 2. 1, 2. 1 Iohn 4. 1. Rev. 2. 14 20. Tit 3. 10. Ier. 23. 9, 15. Ier. 14. 14, 15. Isa. 56. 10, 11. Mich. 3. 5, 6. Zach 11. 8, 15, 16. Then must the keys and power of bin∣ding and loosing be firstly in the people, not in the officers who are separable adjuncts (as our brethren say) the garments of the Church, not parts of the Church, as garments are not parts of a man.

Lastly, Mr. H. cannot build his new house, but by raising the foundation stones of all our worthy Protestant Divines, and Fa∣thers, * 1.153 who prove that the Pope should hear the general Coun∣cil from Matth. 18. So Chrysost. hom. 85. in Ioan. Orig. hom. 7. in Ezek. August Ssrm. 49. de ver. domini. Cyprian. Iewel Apolo. c. 8. div. 2. page 55. Tho. Mort. Appel. Protest. l. 4. c. 2. sect. 8. page 451. 452. Aene. Sylv. in Gest. Conc. Basil. fol. 5. 51. Rom. Pont. non audist Eccles. Christum non audiet. And Riv. Catho. Ortho. To 1. Tract. 1. q. 8. Papists that are sounder, as Gerson, Almain, Occum, Cusanus, Contaren••••s, Ca••etanus, Ferus, Toletus, Meno∣chius, Maldonatus, &c. say the Pope is a Brother, and ought to hear the Church.

Mr. H. The Angel of the Church of Ephesus stands for the whole Church. saith Mr. R.

Ans. See how strangely shall that sound, To the Angel of the Church of Ephesus, i. e. To the Church of the Church of Ephe∣sus.

Ans. This is a poor consequence, it is known there are often two Tropes in one word. The word Angel being put for many * 1.154 Angels, as Didoclavius and other learned Authors from Psal. 34 7. prove. And then these many overseers are put for the Church, and rebuked in the people, and the people in them. When an Embassador speaks to the Parliament, he speaks to En∣gland, and when he speaks to the Speaker, he speaks to the Par∣liament. Will it follow, the Embassador speaks to England of En∣gland? A headless conceit, and such quirks make a cause to be suspected; so when one offended tells the Church, he but tells the brethren of the Church; and this is the Church of the * 1.155 Church. And if women, sons, servants be excluded, as Mr. H. excludes them, then he tells the Church of the Church.

Mr. Parker, though not far from our Brethrens way, hath said the very same; for which Mr. H. refuteth Mr. R. And if Mr. Parker shews my mind in that, when Mr. H. refutes therein M. Parker, I yield; but he contradicts Mr. Parker.

Mr. H. It is said Acts 18. 22. Paul saluted the Church at Je∣rusalem, it cannot be thought in reason, that the Elders only were saluted; because the scope of Paul was to confirm the hearts of the Disciples, and therefore had an eye to the weakest, and those that wanted his sweet refreshing, who heard of his arrival, and assem∣bled to give comfortable entertainment to him, and to be comforted by him.

Ans. The Argument must then be thus, if any: Paul salu∣ted and kissed (for so is the original word) as many as he con∣firmed and encouraged in the way of grace at Ierusalem. But

he confirmed in that way, all and every one, man, woman, ser∣vants, rich, poor; Ergo, he kissed them all, and saluted them all. Let Mr. H. see to the conclusion, it is all his own.

2. The Argument is not brought to prove that the word Church there noteth precisely only the Elders. Nor does Mr. R. alledge it upon that account precisely; but that the word Church may note some eminent professors, and note a Church of all, men, women, children, yea the thousands who meet in * 1.156 sundry places, by the grant of Mr. H. came not out to meet Paul, and were saluted of him; for to be saluted, was but a mat∣ter of courtesie, though Christian, but to be comforted and con∣firmed in the faith is another thing.

Mr. H. The word Church in the Hebrew and Greek used by the Septuagint, notes the Rulers of the Church, not always the body; and it is granted without any hurt to our cause.

Ans. Since the signification of words, and of the word * 1.157 Church, as Moses and the Prophets use them, is frequently fol∣lowed in the New Testament by the Evangelists and Apostles; it is clear, our Saviour, Mat. 18. departed not from the recei∣ved signification of the words in the Old Testament used by the Septuagint. And so the word, Tell the Church, hath a better warrant to be expounded. Tell the Rulers, then, tell all the faithful men, women, children, and servants; therefore the sus∣picion is so strong, as Mr. H. said, that there is no parallel Text for this signification of a male-Church excluding women and officers, who may excommunicate all officers; and whereas he so much contends for the signification of the word Church, Let him answer what is meant there, 1 Cor. 11. 16. If any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the Chur∣ches of Christ. If the meaning be, that the congregations mee∣ting in the same place, contend not among themselves; what if they so should do? who should right them, by our Brethrens way? and if that be the Church that meets in one place onely, when shall the Church Catholick which Christ loved, and gave himself for, meet? not until the day of Judgement? and did the Brethren testifie of the charity of Gaius, 2 Ioh. 16 before the Church, was that in the convened together congregation? or was it not before the men of the Church? And 1 Cor. 11.

When ye 〈◊〉〈◊〉 together to the Church, Was not this to the mee∣ting of men and women, except women be debarred from the Lords Supper? And when Saul made havock of the Church, he must persecute only the binding and loosing Church; but the Scripture saith, he persecuted both men and women, Act. 8. 3. & 9. 2.

Mr. H. Arg 11. The Church which the Plaintiff must tell, is to admonish publickly the offender. But this is the Church of El∣ders, 1. Thes, 5. 12. 13. 1 Tim. 5. 20. Luk. 10. 16. for they onely are to receive publick complaints, Tit. 1. 13. 1 Tim. 5. 19. 2 Tim. 4. 2.

Ans. Complaints are to be given to the Elders, that they may prepare them for the congregation, and lend the action. T••••••e∣fore the incestuous Corinthian 〈◊〉〈◊〉 said to be r•…•… of many, and so judged of many, not by the judgement only of discration; for so they might judge these that were without, but legally.

Ans. Mr. H. answers not one word of Scripture for telling the complaints to the Elders. Christ saith, Tell the Church, that is, tell all the visible Saints, say our Brethren.

2. That the incestuous Corinthian was rebuked legally of many, that is, of the Elders and Brethren, or Male-Church only, that is said, not proved. If we speak of judging by the judge∣ment of discretion, he was rebuked of Elders, Brethren, Wo∣men, aged Children, Servants, for it concerned them in consci∣ence to have knowledge of it, and to yield to withdraw from him, and to forgive him, upon his repentance to joyn with him, else their obedience must be blind.

2. The minor is false.

1. For though they judge Heathen with the judgement of dis∣cretion, it follows not, that therefore Brethren, Women, aged * 1.158 Children, and Servants should not also judge an excommuni∣cate person by the same judgement.

2. The probation is faulty, for I appeal to the conscience of our Brethren, whether there be not sundry kinds of judgement of discretion, and whether Church-members have not one kind of judgement of discretion toward the excommunicate man, who is now under a medicinal Church-cure, and another judge∣ment of discretion toward them that are without, and were never members.

Mr. H. to Mr. R. his twelfth Argument, It hath received an 〈◊〉〈◊〉 out of a mistake, because neither women alone, nor children will make a Church, nor have any publick power put into their hands for that purpose.

Ans. I never said in any Argument, that women and chil∣dren there alone ma••e a Church, nor spake I of womens ruling there: But yet I say, women, children of years of discretion, serva••••s being the Lords freemen and professing the faith.

Arg. 1. The essential parts and largest part of the Congre∣gation•…•… Church of Believers, professing the faith of Peter buil∣ded upon the rock, Mat. 18. ••••••ting every Lords day to partake of all the Ordinances; and therefore if the Church, Mat. 16. * 1.159 signifie such a Church 〈◊〉〈◊〉 ••hat which you say, women and such children and servants must especially be understood as parts thereof, under the name of the Church, tell the Church, and if so, the Church to which we complain, doth not bind and loose by your own grant.

2. What ground is there in the Word, that the Brethren a∣lone, * 1.160 because men should, only be mooned by the name of the instituted Church in the Gospel, or the 〈◊〉〈◊〉 Church of Belie∣vers, partakers of all the ordinances, excluding women and such children and servants, since there 〈◊〉〈◊〉 neither made nor fe∣male, bound nor free to be regarded in the condtion of belie∣ving visible Saints? Gal. 3. 28. 〈◊〉〈◊〉 9. 14. 1 Cor. 7. 21, 22. So is not this very like to the respect of persons condemned by the Apostle I•…•…, ch. 2, 3, 4, 5. when brethren because of their sex, and heads of families must be the only Church of be∣lievers, built upon the rock, the Body of Christ, the Kingdom of Christ, the Redeemed of God, partakers of all the precious ordinan∣ces, and the only visible Church above all the officers, women, children, servants?

3. Nor hath such a Church of only few, any such power put in their hand, and so to say, because it is said, Tell the Church, except Mr. H. prove them to be the governing Church above the Officers, is to beg the question; for Mr. Cotton and Mr. Burroughs say, without officers the brethren can exercise n•• ju∣risdiction, * 1.161 no excommunication, one of the highest acts of rude in the Church; they have nothing without the officers (saith Mr.

Burroughs) but brotherly admonition, no jurisdiction. And Mr. H. is to give a parallel place in old and new Testament if he hear not the Church, id est, the male-Church of Brethren, let him be cast out.

Mr. H. Arg. 13. Not only the Church must convene to worship God in Spirit and Truth, but that they bind and loose by the Pasto∣ral Spirit of Paul, and officers in their convention.

Ans. The Church met hath power to execute all acts of disci∣pline, as well as doctrine.

2. The Church of Corinth is blamed, because without the know∣ledge of Paul, or his authority (as they ought to have done) they did not excommunicate the incestuous person, only for their encou∣ragement, he expresseth his consent, and the concurrence of his spirit.

Ans. That the Church of Believers without the pastoral spirit and authority of Paul or any other officer, and excluding the tacit consent of women, children of age, and believing ser∣vants, could exercise all acts of Discipline and Doctrine, that is, of pastoral preaching, destroyes Mr. H. his principles; for who can preach but sent Pastors? Rom. 10. 14. not unofficed bre∣thren. And as to the point of Jurisdiction, Mr. Cotton and Mr. Burroughs, with me, deny it, and Mr. H. nakedly saith it. That the Church of Corinth was rebuked for not excommunicating the man, is true: But 1. what means he by the Church re∣buked?

1. All that were rebuked must be the Church; can Mr. H. deny but women, children of years, servants, were rebuked, as those who were puffed up, and mourned not? ver. 1, 2.

2. And as those who were a part, and the largest part of the * 1.162 lump, that is, of the body of the people in danger to be leaven∣ed with that scandal, ver. 6.

3. As those who were to keep the feast (Christ being sacri∣ficed for them) With sincerity, ver. 8.

4. As those who should not familiarly converse with scan∣dalous

fornicators, ver. 11. but all of them were to judge, and put away the wicked person from among them, ver. 13. in a way suitable to their place, that is, the officers with Pauls Spirit, or a pastoral authority like unto it, the brethren, women, children of age, and servants, professing the faith in their way, by con∣senting, and by the judgement of discretion so far as belonged to their practise in withdrawing from the delinquent. 2. Not did I deny that the Church of Corinth should have excommu∣nicated the man before Paul wrote to them, but that they should have done it without Pauls knowledge, is onely said, not proved; and that any save officers, and such as were in∣dued with such a pastoral spirit as was in Paul, could have done it, is onely asserted by Mr. H. his sole word; and this an∣swer insinuates, that the onely male-Church did it, and they needed not any pastoral spirit; onely Paul addeth ex super∣abundanti his encouraging consent, whereas the work might have been done without officers by this new male-jurisdiction, which is contradicted by Mr. Cotton, and not owned by the Scripture.

Notes

• * 1.1

  Mr. H. par. 1. c. 8. pag. 89. Mr. H. is dubi∣ous what is the instituted Church in the New Testa∣ment. Way of the Church of N. E. c. 1. sect. 1. pro. 1. pag. 1, 2.
• * 1.2

  Pa. 8. par. 1. p. 90, 91.
• * 1.3

  Mr. H. makes a Church with∣out Rulers, to be a Ruling Church to or∣dain officers, and excommu∣nicate. Mr. Cotton Keys c. 4. par. 2 as the Pres∣bytery cannot excommuni∣cate the whole church (though Apo∣states) for they must tell the church—so neither can the church excommunicate the whole Presbytery, because they have not received from Christ an office of rule, without their officers. M. Cot. contradicts M. H.
• * 1.4

  There is no warrant in the word for a male Church-ruling and ad∣mitting mem∣bers, ordaining & excommuni∣cating officers, and yet that is void of rule and office
• * 1.5

  The Ep•…•… to Timot•…•… Titus are ne•…•… ther written to them as to Prelats, & Pa∣stors of Pa∣stors, nor to unoffic'd chri∣stians, nor to them as Evan∣gelists, but e∣specially as re∣presenting El∣ders, to be a copy to offi∣cers, to the ap∣pearing of Christ.
• * 1.6

  Pauls Presbyt. cap. 4. ans. to ar. 6. p. 45.
• * 1.7

  Page 90, 91.
• * 1.8

  The Logick of Mr. H. God set officers in the Church; Ergo, the Church without offi∣cers is a ruling Church before they have Ru∣lers, is naughty. So Mr. Robinson, Justif. of Separat. Pref. p. 9. Bishops and Elders are the onely ordinary Governors in the Church—But not essential to the Church. Sure they must be essential to the governed Church. Mr. Robinson ib. p. 295.
• * 1.9

  Page 92.
• * 1.10

  By Mr. H. the adjuncts be∣get the sub∣ject, the sons the fathers.
• * 1.11

  The Churches Rev. 1. 2. are not a number of unofficed believers, but the believers with Doctors and Teachers as shining Lamps.
• * 1.12

  Pareus Com. in Apocalyp. in loc. Candelabris assimilantur—quia Ecclesia gestat facem coelest is doctrinae. Pignet. Apoc. 1. Quia in ea v••rum lumen lucet. Marlor. Quia in ea sunt Prophetae, Apostoli, Evang••listae—quia lucent per saluberrimam vitae doctri∣nam. Piscat. Apoc. 1•• observ. 39. Candelabra illa quae vidisti—in vera Ecclesia instar auri splendet & lucet pura doctrina. So Diodati, English Annotations, Beza.
• * 1.13

  Mr. H. Survey, p. 92.
• * 1.14

  It is not a like in a Church wanting offi∣cers, as in a ci∣vil corporation wanting Ru∣lers. Papists so ar∣gue. See Jac. Gualter. in Tabula Chro∣nographic. Se∣cul. 1. ad an. 100. verita. sect. 1. p. 150.
• * 1.15

  Page 92.
• * 1.16

  It is not ab∣surd that a po∣litick body de∣stroy its own politick being, when they re∣m••ve Lions & Leopards which destroy∣ed h••m.
• * 1.17

  Page 92, 93.
• * 1.18

  To remove the candlestick is to remove the Ministry, and so the church is not a poli∣tick church a∣ny more.
• * 1.19

  Pag. 93.
• * 1.20

  The way of the Churches of Christ in N. E. c. 1. sect. 1. prop. 1. p. 1, 2.
• * 1.21

  Survey par. 1. c. 9. p. 94.
• * 1.22

  Officers can be no essential parts of the visible Church by Mr. H. his way.
• * 1.23

  Pag. 94, 95.
• * 1.24

  The two first Pillars of a Presbyterial Church, to wit, 1. framed Churches. 2. Formal commissioners sent to Pres∣byteries, are to us no pillars, to Mr. H. they are.
• * 1.25

  People that are no stew∣ards have no authority to censure, or thereby to edi∣fie.
• * 1.26

  How pastors are regulated in the exercise of their cal∣ling.
• * 1.27

  Survey c 〈◊〉〈◊〉. par. 1. p. 99.
• * 1.28

  The Chur∣ches united have more power exten∣sively after they are uni∣ted than be∣fore; but not intensively, & in nature more
• * 1.29

  Actual volun∣tary combina∣tion is no pil∣lar of the Pres∣byterian Church.
• * 1.30

  Page 99, 100.
• * 1.31

  Twelve pastors feed 12 con∣gregations in Jerusalem, or in some large city in cōmon, not being fix∣ed any of them to any one con∣gregation, all the 12 are pa∣stors to all the 12 congrega∣tions, & yet it is not possible physically, that any one man can reside in all the 12 con∣gregations; here shall be divers Non-re∣sidents & Plu∣ralists, but not in a Prelatical sense.
• * 1.32

  The Elders of the Presbytery are fixed and proper Pastors, only to one flock and Pa∣stor in com∣mon, in mat∣ters of com∣mon con∣cernment to all the rest of tho associate Churches.
• * 1.33

  A Pastor may administer the Supper of the Lord, which he doth as a Pastor to these of another Congregation, yet is he not a fixed proper Pastor to those of another congregation. Cotton Keys. c. 6. n. 3. p. 25. Mr. H. Survey. par. 2. c. 2. p. 65. Way of the Churches of Christ in New England. c. 6. sect. 6. pag. 103 Hr. H. Survey. par. 4. c. 1. p. 1, 2, 3, 4. Our brethren destroy Synods, though they give them the name of ordi∣nances of Christ. Mr. H. Survey. par. 4. p. 1, 2, 3. When no more is given to a Synod but to counsel and advise, it is for that no more an ordinance of God, then a private man or woman giving a counsel is an ordinance of God.
• * 1.34

  Private Chri∣stians and wo∣men giving counsel to men may as well be called an or∣dinance of Christ as a Sy∣nod.
• * 1.35

  Survey. par. 4. c. 1. p. 6.
• * 1.36

  Pag. 101.
• * 1.37

  A Pastor con∣stantly feeds his own flock, and admini∣sters the Lords supper to forty persons of for∣ty congregati∣ons about, as Mr. Cotton and Mr. H. grant: but he hath not fourty pa∣storal offices for that.
• * 1.38

  Mr. H. Survey. par. 2. c. 2. p. 65 Way of the Churches of N. E. c. 6. sect. 6. p. 103.
• * 1.39

  Survey. par. 2. c. 2. p. 65.
• * 1.40

  Pag. 102.
• * 1.41

  The place Mat. 18. is mis∣taken by our brethren, con∣trary to the scope, and to the minde of Fathers, Do∣ctors, Divines, Councels, Martyrs. So widely D. Bils. mistaketh the place M••t. 18. Perpet. go. vernm. c. 4.
• * 1.42

  Why only the nearest Chur∣ches have real hand in heal∣ing offences.
• * 1.43

  The differen∣ces betweene Elders govern∣ing in the Presbytery or Classis, and of the same El∣ders in their fixed congre∣gations.
• * 1.44

  Page 103.
• * 1.45

  Mr. H. sets not down M. R. his words perfect∣ly, but often in halfs, & scarce that, as here.
• * 1.46

  A pastor is not a pastor onely to the assem∣bled congrega∣tion, as Mr. H. saith, but also to them all se∣verally, and to this or that single person of the flock.
• * 1.47

  M. H. pag. 103, 104.
• * 1.48

  Though pa∣stors in a Sy∣nod, by M. Cot∣tons grant, put forth pastoral acts upon ma∣ny congregati∣ons, yet shall it never follow, that they are proper & fixed pastors to these congregations: so neither doth this militate against a Presbyterian Church. Page 104. See Bilson, perpetual Go∣vernment, c. 5. c. 12.
• * 1.49

  Pastors can exercise no ju∣risdictiō being separated from the court, but pastoral acts of teaching they may in private exer∣cise, and that from house to house. Pag. 104, 105.
• * 1.50

  Sitting in Court gives no new power of office to elders, but they can∣not put it forth in formal jurisdiction but in the Court.
• * 1.51

  Its a mistake all along in Mr. H. th•••• if an Elder put forth pastoral acts in a Synod or in a Presby∣tery, to this or that congre∣gation, that therefore he is a fixed pastor to this or that congregation.
• * 1.52

  How wide Mr. H. is in his Lo∣gick, the Pres∣byterian Elders determine of special actions & persons, for species deter∣mines the act of the genus.
• * 1.53

  Neither to be an Apostle, nor to be an ordi∣nary Pastor, doth so give right to any to feed the flock in Macedonia, nor in Bithy∣nia, in this flock and con∣gregation, and not in this, without the intervening of some special call of God.
• * 1.54

  Pag. 106, 107.
• * 1.55

  The separa∣ting of ruling and teaching in Pastors, in regard of office is unlawful; but the separating of them in acts and objects is not unlaw∣ful, but necessary.
• * 1.56

  See Bilson, Per∣petual Go∣vernment. c. 5. c. 12. M. H. doth no less separate ruling & tea∣ching then. Presbyterians do.
• * 1.57

  One may be both a classi∣cal Elder to the associate Churches, and a fixed Elder to a single congregation, as the same man is both a Grand-father and a Father to divers chil∣dren.
• * 1.58

  Pag. 107, 108.
• * 1.59

  Pag. 108, 109.
• * 1.60

  A Pastor fixed to a congrega∣tion may exer∣cise pastoral acts of wri∣ting, preach∣ing to other congregations then his own.
• * 1.61

  Pag. 109.
• * 1.62

  Pag. 110.
• * 1.63

  A Pastor tea∣ching one con∣gregation fix∣edly, and ru∣ling in Collegio other associate Churches is no Prelate.
• * 1.64

  Pag. 100.
• * 1.65

  Pag. 110. 111.
• * 1.66

  Pag. 111.
• * 1.67

  Of the one∣rousness and labour in go∣verning associ∣ating Chur∣ches; how it is the same with onerousness & labor in coun∣selling united Churches, and how it is not the same.
• * 1.68

  The obligati∣tion to bro∣therly help to my brother, though it be as onerous as an obligation of teaching the flock, it doth not tie me to the use of all the means po∣sitively to go all the world over, and warn and admonish as the other doth.
• * 1.69

  Apostles were t••ed not as A∣postles, but as Christians to eat the Lords Supper in all Churches all the world o∣ver.
• * 1.70

  Pag. 115, 116.
• * 1.71

  Pag. 114, 115.
• * 1.72

  A man is tyed to use more means for fee∣ding the sin∣gle fl••ck, that he is a fixed Pastor unto, then as a chri∣stian he is to use toward o∣ther churches.
• * 1.73

  Mr. Cotton Keys of the Kingdom, c. 6. pag. 25.
• * 1.74

  Pag. 117.
• * 1.75

  Pag. 117. 118.
• * 1.76

  A commission in a Presbyte∣ry is no new office, but a∣power of order appointed by the God of or∣der.
• * 1.77

  Pag. 119, 120.
• * 1.78

  Due right of Presbytery. The votes of associated Churches ad∣ded to the votes of the Elders of a congregation strengtheneth, but hindereth not right pro∣ceeding, except by accident.
• * 1.79

  Due Right. p. 335.
• * 1.80

  Pag. 120.
• * 1.81

  The sounder part of the Church is the Church.
• * 1.82

  Pag. 121.
• * 1.83

  How the ordi∣nances are not conttary to the Wisedome of Christ though they attain not al∣ways finem o∣peris.
• * 1.84

  Png. 122.
• * 1.85

  How Pastors are Pastors in reference to the Congrega∣tion, and how to the Synod, and associated Elders.
• * 1.86

  Par. 1. c. 9. pag. 122.
• * 1.87

  It is, and must be the same office of a Pa∣stor in refe∣rence to the congregation, and in refe∣rence to the Presbytery & Synods superi∣or.
• * 1.88

  Pag. 114.
• * 1.89

  Pag. 123. The classical Elder hath nothing to do with Prelacy.
• * 1.90

  Niceph. l. 8. c. 11. Sozom. l. 1. c. 14 Tripart. Hist. l. 1 c. 19. Cypr. Epist. 80. Bernar. Epist. 80. Euseb. l. 10. c. 3. Hieronymus in Episto. ad Titum, & ad Euagrium Epist. 85. ad Nepotianum de vita Clericorum. Socrates l. 7. c. 35. Cyprian. l. 1. Ep. 4 &. l. 4. Epist. 2. Concil. Antiochen. c. 14. Bernard. in Canti. Ser: 77. & Epist. 82. Brightm. in Apol. 3. See Archiep. Spalaten. de Rep. Eccles. l. 3. c. 1. Edwar. Didoclav. in altar. Damasceno. p. 24, 25, 26, 27. & fere per totum. Beza De gradibus Ministr. c. 1. &c. August. Epist. 19. Whitaker Cont. 4. q. 1. c. 3. sect. 30. Waldenses aut Aeneas Silvius Histor. Bohem. c. 35. Thom. Waldens. Doct. fidei, Tom. 1. l. 2. c. 60. Tom c. 7. Reinold. Colloq. cum Ha••t.
• * 1.91

  A presbyterial Church was at Ierusalem, Rome, Thessalo∣nica, Ephesus, &c.
• * 1.92

  Synod at West∣minster.
• * 1.93

  The Apostles act as an ordi∣nary Presbyte∣ry, Act. 6.
• * 1.94

  The Church of Rome was a Presbyterial Church.
• * 1.95

  The Church of Th••ssalonica, of Antioch, Pres∣byterian chur∣ches.
• * 1.96

  Steph. Cum ali∣quid temporis ib•• consumpsis∣sent. B••z••. Ali∣quandiu, tempore non parvo. Lorin. In Loc. non solum P••∣trus, sed Pau••us aliique Apo∣li & Apostolici viri versati sunt. Marloratus, Hoc quidam exponunt quod sacer coetus in eorum d••iro cogeretur. Pareus Com. in Rom. 16. Observemus ve••o Ecclesiae nomen paucis fide••••ous Christi nomine congregatis convenire—ubi duo vel tres—nemo tamen inde collig•••• Ecclesiam dom••sticam esse infallibilem. B••za in Rom. 16. 5. Neque mirum est in tam am∣pla civitate distinct••s fuisse fidelium coetus. Calv. ib. Horum itaque domum Ecclesi••m dixit, non solum quia Christi fidem exceperunt, sed quia hospitio credentes admit∣terent.
• * 1.97

  That sund••y Churches send messengers prove a meet∣ing of the El∣ders of those Churches, for all men & wo∣men who are the Churches of the redeem∣ed ones could not meet in one place. M. H. Survey, par. 1. c. 3. p. 40.
• * 1.98

  There is a Church-power in a Synod without and above a single congregation.
• * 1.99

  Mat. 18. can∣not warrant me to gain no trespassing brethren in a Church way, but onely the brethren of that congre∣gation of which I am a member.
• * 1.100

  Narration of the practise of the Churches of N. E. p. 16, 17, 18.
• * 1.101

  Way of the Churches of Ch••m. N. E. c. 6. sect. 1, 2, 3. Cotton Keyes.
• * 1.102

  Par. 1. c 9. sect. 3. p. 125.
• * 1.103

  The indepen∣dence of a Church in an Island is its affliction, not its power.
• * 1.104

  There are nei∣ther the same perfect opera∣tions, nor the adequate and complete end of edification in a Church in an Island.
• * 1.105

  Pag. 126.
• * 1.106

  The non-exi∣stence of asso∣ciated Chur∣ches addeth nothing to the power intrin∣secal of a con∣gregation to rule the associ∣ated Churches if they were.
• * 1.107

  Page 126.
• * 1.108

  The adding of associated Churches to a Wilderness-church doth strengthen & perfect, and not nullifie the intrinsecal power of the Wilderness-church.
• * 1.109

  Pag. 117.
• * 1.110

  When scan∣dals fall out far off or near hand, how as∣sociation of Churches re∣moveth them.
• * 1.111

  The limiting of Church∣edifying and Church-com∣forting to one onely congre∣tien whereof the man onely is a sworne member, is an unwarrantable and comfort∣less way.
• * 1.112

  The Way of Churches of N. E. c. 1. sec. 1. p. 1. c. 4. sec. 3. sec. 4. p 70, 71. Mr. H. Survey, pa. 3. c. 2. p. 10. M. Cotton, keys of the kingd. c. 7. p. 39, 40, 4••.
• * 1.113

  Mr. H. par. 1. c. 9. p. 127, 128. sec. 4. 3 ground
• * 1.114

  One and the same nature a∣grees to the congregatio∣nal, presbyte∣rial Church, &c. Pag. 127. 128.
• * 1.115

  The congre∣gational, Pres∣byterial, Nati∣onal, Oecume∣nick Churches are species spe∣cialissimae.
• * 1.116

  How a congre∣gation is an intire church. Tertul. in A∣polog.
• * 1.117

  Though the Churches of believers, men and women be before the Apostles, Evangelists, Pastors, Presbyteries, Synods, yet it follows not, therefore must Apostles, Pastors, Synods have their calling and authority from those Churches.
• * 1.118

  Sect. 4. p. 128. Mr. Hooker ac∣knowledges that divers meetings and Church con∣ventions may may be all un∣der one Pres∣byterial go∣vernment, on∣ly he will not call them Churches.
• * 1.119

  Way of the Church. c. 1. sect. par. 1.
• * 1.120

  Survey par. 1. c. 9. p. 110, 111 &c.
• * 1.121

  Mr. H. must be forced by his own principles to grant there is one visible Church which cannot meet conveniently 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, in the same place, and yet under the same Elder∣ship.
• * 1.122

  Mr. H. yeilds to us a Presbyte∣rian Church at Ierusalem.
• * 1.123

  Page 51.
• * 1.124

  Fixedness or no fixedness of the Elders of Ierusalem to their own pro∣per congrega∣tions is alto∣gether acci∣dental to the Church pres∣byterial. The Apostles fixed feeding at Rome, at Co∣rinth, is not op∣posite unto, but of that same nature with his feeding pastorall all the world o∣ver.
• * 1.125

  All the incon∣gruities that are the onely arguments of Mr. H. against a Presbyterial church, are mi∣litant against the presbyteri∣al Church which Mr. H. grants was at Ierusalem.
• * 1.126

  Mr. H. well near also yiel∣deth that there was a Presby∣terian Church at Antioch, E∣phesus, Rome.
• * 1.127

  There are the like reasons, that the mul∣titudes of Believers at Rome, Antioch, Ephesus, Corinth, Samaria, Thessalonica, could not meet in one place, and so there must be in these huge Cities many Congregations under one Presbyterial Government, as for the multitudes at Ierusalem.
• * 1.128

  What is meant by Church, Act. 2. were added to the Church.
• * 1.129

  Mr. H. inclines to exp•…•… the word C•…•…h of the ••••••thful, Saul made ha∣vock of the C•…•…. E•…•…, there is 〈◊〉〈◊〉 Presbyteri•• a church. How watery is this L••gick?
• * 1.130

  Par. 1. c. 10. p. 130.
• * 1.131

  Mr. R. argu∣ment, Mat. 18. from allusion unto the Jew∣ish Sanhedrim abused, not answered.
• * 1.132

  M R. is not for all appeals whatsoever, justor unjust, but for such as are edifying and necessary, and relieves from tyrannicall oppression the plaintiff.
• * 1.133

  Pag. 131.
• * 1.134

  The removing of scandals, Mat. 18. can∣not be of onely scandals be∣tween brother and brother of the same con∣gregation, ex∣cept I must not owne as brethren to be gained, those of another Church beside me.
• * 1.135

  Christ willeth every little congregation to exercise di∣scipline upon an offender, Ergo, there is no discipline to be exerci∣sed in a greater Church. So Mr. H. But the contrary rather strongly followeth.
• * 1.136

  The Sanhe∣drim was not mixed by in∣stitution.
• * 1.137

  Pauls Presbyt. c 8. p. 88. The Church, Mat. 18. is to be obeyed in the Lord by the people, but the Church of the people is not to be o∣beyed in the Lord by the people.
• * 1.138

  Women are as essential parts of the belie∣ving Church as men, and wom••n must no more blind∣ly believe what the Church believes, than men; nor must their faith in discerning the voice of Christ in this pastor, not in this, be blindly included in the males discerning and so women must be a part of the binding and loosing Church, Mat. 18.
• * 1.139

  Survey, par. 1. c. 10. p. 133.
• * 1.140

  The Church principally meant Mat. 18. must be the binding and loosing bre∣thren which are the Church fi••st••y, the offi∣cers are onely separable ad∣juncts thereof, saith M. H. Par. 1. c. 11. p. 198.
• * 1.141

  When all the office••s turne wolves, the people must complain to the people, & when the peo∣ple turn Fami∣lists, Socinians &c. to whom s••a••l the offi∣cers complain, acco••ding to M. H. minde?
• * 1.142

  The officers cannot binde potestate officii, since the Keys were given to the Male∣church, before the officers had being, as M H saith.
• * 1.143

  We cannot tell the church of Jerusalem or Galatia, by M. H.
• * 1.144

  Women have no less a tacit consent, a faith of practise in eschewing the society of the excommunica∣ted, in admit∣ting of him a∣gain, and of all members, & in election of officers, than men, and in other duties recommended to Church∣members.
• * 1.145

  Let M. H. shew how women are all exclu∣ded from Church duties in their way, more than men.
• * 1.146

  So Cypr. Ju∣ban. Epist. 73. pag. 22. Nam Petro primum Dominus super quem adificavit Ecclesiam—Mat. 16. Istaem potestatem (clavium) dedit—& post resurre∣ctionem—sicut me misit pater, &c. Firmilian. ad Cypr. Epist. 75. Cypr. pag. 239. n. 14. Hinc intelligi potest quod soli Petro Christus dixerit, quemcunque ligaveritis, Matth. 16, &c. Quando in solos Apostolos insufflavit Christus dicens, accipite Spiritum San∣ctum, &c.
• * 1.147

  The word Church can signifie no o∣ther, but the ruling Church Mat. 18. and the notation of the word Church in our brethrenssense is neither Mat. 18. nor else∣where. See how Bil∣son, Perpetual G ve n. c. 4. mistakes in this.
• * 1.148

  Though wo∣men, children of age, and ser∣vants, be ex∣cluded from governing, yet the question now is a farre other thing, Whether the word Church, Mat. 18. if it be the Church of Redeemed ones meeting to and for pub∣lick ordinan∣ces in the same place, include not women, &c.
• * 1.149

  The word 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, Church, is ever taken in Scri∣pture accor∣ding to the subject matter and scope of the place, and so must the binding and loosing, or excommunicating Church, Matth. 18. be taken, and cannot note a compa∣ny of redeemed ones, Men, Women, Servants, Children of riper age come to∣gether in one to partake of Word, Seals, Censures, the onely acception of the Word Church that our brethren can give us from Scripture.
• * 1.150

  The Church, Matth. 18. & 1 Cor. 5. in∣cludes all who meet for the publick worship, Elders, Men, Women, Servants, aged Chil∣dren, every one according to their place, according as Paul rebukes, comforts, teaching in his Epistle, 1 Cor. 1.
• * 1.151

  〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 Rom. 16. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉.
• * 1.152

  The women in their daily practice are concerned in conscience to censent unto, or dissent from the sentence of excommunica∣tion, or forgi∣ving and re∣admiting a∣gain, and that upon rules of the Gospel as well as men.
• * 1.153

  Caelv. Inst. l. 3. c. 4. sec. 12. In∣stit. l. 4. c. 1. sec. 2. Instit. l. 4. c. 12. sec. 2. l. 4. 9. 2. Pet. Martyr, 1 Cor. 8. Dav. Parens in explic. catech. q. 85. Art. 4. Obj. 1. p. 480, 484. Com. ••n Mat. 18 Gul. Buc••n. loc. com. de potest. Eccles. & Syno. lo. 43. q. 25. Dan. Tilenus Synt. dis. 30. de Concil. Th. 4. 9••. 〈◊〉〈◊〉, 23. Profess. Leyd. Synop. purio. Theolo. diso. 49. thes 10. pag. 779. Ioan. Pisc. com. in Ma••th. ••8. 15 d Eccles. lo. 23. thes. 73. Willet Syn. Papis. con. 3. Gen. Conc. 4. 7. pag. 140, 141. B••za in ••n. Mat. c. 18. Trem. lius in vers. Syr. Mat. 16. 19, 20. Iunius dis. 47. De Discip. Ec∣cles. th. 〈◊〉〈◊〉. th. 6. Ioan. Comerio Tract. in quo Eccles. Roman. p••ae exam. c. 17. pag. 567. Anton. Walaeus To. 1. defunct. Eccles. pag. 467. Wende••••n Theol. l. 1. c. 28. fig. VII. q. 1. pag. 622, 623.
• * 1.154

  What is ment by the Angel of the Church, Rev. 2. Mr. H. his conceit re∣moved.
• * 1.155

  Rob Parker. de Politia Eccles. l. 3. c. 15. n. 1. Ex his qui elu∣ctari, capit no∣biscum, sentire necesse est Ec∣clesiam fidelium à Christo intel∣lectam esse (Mat. 18.) non quia simpliciter consideratur, sed quia disciplinam exercet juxta tem∣peramentum Aristocraticum in Presbyterio, Ecclesiam quippe primo loco dic Ecclesiae praecise par∣tem Aristocraticam, id est, Presbyterium existimamus, quae vero posteriore his verbis, Si Eccle∣siam non audietit, &c. sic excommunicantem propter contemptum Ecclesiam, includit, & non decernentem tantum & examinantem, tum & partem Ecclesiae Democraticam continet, quâ po∣puli consensus ad excommunicationem necessarius est.
• * 1.156

  The place Act. 18. 22. Paul sa∣luted the church is wronged by M. H.
• * 1.157

  The word Church is not in scripture, as our brethren take it. Nor is there a place in Old or New Testa∣ment, or in a∣ny Divines, imaginable for the sole male-Church.
• * 1.158

  It cannot be denied but all in their owne respective ways officers, men, women, ser∣vants, 2 Cor. 2. did rebuke and censure, and also forgive the incestuous Corinthian.
• * 1.159

  The way of the Church, c. 1. sect. 1. p. 1, 2.
• * 1.160

  Women by our brethrens way, servants, and children of age, who meet to partake of the ordinan∣ces, word, and seals, as our brethren say, must be parts of the Church, Matth. 18.
• * 1.161

  Cotton Keyes. par. 16. Burroughs Iren,
• * 1.162

  If as many doe excommuni∣cate, as Paul writes unto, 1 Cor. 5. and as Paul rebukes for not mourning, and were a part of the lump in danger to be leavened, and were to keep the feast, and eschew the company of the scandalous, that is, the whole redeemed Church, as Mr. H. argues, then sure Women must excommunicate, 1. Cor. 5. as well as men. See Mr. H. par. 1. c. 10. p. 138.