St. Augustine, Of the citie of God vvith the learned comments of Io. Lod. Viues. Englished by I.H.

Whether it be probable that the Platonists say, That the gods auoyding earthly contagion, haue no commerce with men, but by the meanes of the ayry spirits. CHAP. 16.

FOr it is false that this Platonist saith Plato said: God hath no commerce with man: and maketh this absolute seperation, the most perfect note of their glory and height. So then the Diuels are left to deale, and to bee infected by mans conuer∣sation, and therefore cannot mundifie those that infect them, so that both become vnclean, the diuels by conuersing with men, and then men by adoration of the di∣uels. Or if the diuels can conuerse with men, and not bee infected, then are they better then the gods: for they cannot auoid this inconuenience: for that he makes the gods peculiar, to bee farre aboue the reach of mans corruption. But (a) God the Creator (whome we call the true God) he maketh such an one (out of Plato) as words cannot describe at any hand, nay and that the wisest men in their greatest height of abstractiue speculation, can haue but now and then a sodaine and (b) mo∣mentary glimpse of the (c) vnderstanding of this God. Well then if this high God (d) afford his ineffable presence vnto wise men, sometimes in their ab∣stracti•…•…e speculation: (though after a sodaine fashion) and yet is not contaminate * 1.1 thereby: why then are the gods placed so farre off, sor feare of this contaminati∣on▪ As though the sight of those ethaereal bodies that light the earth were not suf∣ficient. And if our sight of the starres (whome hee maketh visible gods) doe not •…•…minate them, then no more doth it the spirits, though seene nearer hand. Or•…•… mans speech more infectious then his sight, and therefore the goddes (to keepe them-selues pure) receiue all their requests at the deliuery of the diuells? What shall I say of the other sen•…•…s? Their smelling would not infect them if they were below, or when they are below as diuells, the smel of a quicke man is not in∣fect•…•…s at all, if the steame of so many dead carcasses in sacrifices infect not. Their taste is not sō crauing of them as they should bee driuen to come and aske their meate of men: and for their touch, it is in their owne choyce. For though (e) handling bee peculiar to that sence indeed, yet may they handle their businesse with men, to see them and heare them without any necessity of touching: for men would dare to desire no further then to see and heare them: and if they should, what man can touch a God or a Spirit against their wils: when we see one cannot touch a sparrow, vnlesse he haue first taken her? So then in sight, hearing & speech the goddes might haue corporeal commerce with man. Now if the diuels haue thus much without infection, and the gods cannot, why then the goddes are sub∣iect to contamination: and not the diuels? But if they bee infected also, then what good can they doe a man vnto eternity, whome (beeing them-selues infected) they cannot make cleane, nor fit to bee adioyned with the gods, between whom and men they are mediators? And if they cannot doe this, what vse hath man of their mediation? Vnlesse that after death they liue both together corrupted, and neuer come nearer the goddes; nor inioy any beatitude, either of them. Vnlesse some will make the spirits like to spunges, fetching all the filth from others, and

retayning i•…•… in them-selues: which if it bee so, the gods conuerse with spirits that are more vncleane then the man whose conuersation they auoyd for vncleane∣nesse sake. Or can the gods mundifie the diuels from their infection, vn-infected and cannot do so with men? VVho beleeues this that beleeueth not the diuels il∣lusions? Againe, if the lookes of man infect, then those visible gods, the (f) worlds bright eyes, and the other stars, are lyable to this infection, and the diuels that are not seene but when they list, in better state then they. But if the sight of man (not his) infect, then let them deny that they do see man, we seeing their beames stretcht to the very earth. Their beames looke vn-infected through all infection, and them-selues cannot conuerse purely with men onely, though man stand in ne∣uer so much necessity of their helpe, wee see the Sunnes and Moones beames to reflect vppon the earth without contamination of the light. But I wonder that so many learned men, preferring things intelligible euer-more before sen∣sible, would mention any corporall matter in the doctrine of beatitude. VVhere is that saying of (g) Plotine: Lette vs flie to our bright country, there is the father, and there is all? VVhat flight is that? (h) to become like to GOD. If then the liker a man is to GOD the nearer hee is also, why then the more vnlike, the farther off: And mans soule the more it lookes after thinges mutable and temporall, the more vnlike is it to that essence that is immutable and eternall.

L. VIVES.

GOD (a) the Creator.] Apul. de d•…•…o S•…•…crat. & Dog. Platon. GOD is celestiall, inef∣fable, and vn-name-able, whose nature is hard to finde', and harder to declare▪ * 1.2 words The of Plato are these 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 To finde God is hard, but to comprehend him impossible. Thus farre Apuleius. Plato in his Timaeus, that to finde out the fa∣ther of this vniuerse is a hard matter, but to expresse his full nature to another, vtterly impossible. And in his Parmenides, disputing of that One, Hee saith it can neyther bee named, defined, 〈◊〉〈◊〉 comprehended, seene nor imagined: (b) Momentary. Signifieth that the dimme light sodain∣ly with-draweth it selfe, leauing a slender species, or light impression thereof only, in the mindes of such as haue seene it: yet such an one as giueth ample testimony, of the •…•…ensity and lustre thereof. (c) Vnderstanding] In the world there are some markes whereby the 〈◊〉〈◊〉▪ Maker may be knowne, but that a farre off, as a light in the most thicke and spatious d•…•…ke: and not * 1.3 by all, but only by the sharpest wits that giue them-selues wholly to speculation thereof. (d) Afford his] Nor doth the knowledge of God leaue the wise minde, but is euer present when it is purely sought, and holyly. (e) Handling] Contrectation, of Tracto to handle. (f) Worldet bright] Apulei▪ de deo Socrat. For as their maiesty required, he dedicated heauen to the immor∣tall goddes, whome partly wee see, and call them celestiall: as, you the worlds bright eye that guides the times: Vos O Clarissima mundi Lumina, saith Virgill of the Sunne and Moone. Georg. 1. (g) Plotine] Plato saith hee, Coleyne copy. (h) To become] The sentence is Plato 〈◊〉〈◊〉 wee rehearsed it in the last book. Hee calls heauen our countrey, because hence we are exi∣led: Our bright countrey, because all thinges there are pure, certaine and illustrate, here soule, fickle and obscure: There is the father of this vniuerse, and all thinges about him as the King of all, as Plato writes to Dyonisius. How shall wee gette thether, being so farre, and the way vnpasseable by our bodies? Onely one direct and ready way there is to it, to follow God with all our indea•…•…r of imitation. This onely eleuateth vs thether.

Notes

• * 1.1

  God not polluted by being present vn∣to wise men.
• * 1.2

  God incō∣prehensible
• * 1.3

  God is to be partly kno•…•…ne of his crea∣tures.