The defense of the aunsvvere to the Admonition against the replie of T.C. By Iohn VVhitgift Doctor of Diuinitie. In the beginning are added these. 4. tables. 1 Of dangerous doctrines in the replie. 2 Of falsifications and vntruthes. 3 Of matters handled at large. 4 A table generall.

Of the residence of the Pastor. Tract. 5. (Book 5)

Chap. 1. the first Diuision.

T. C. Page. 46. Sect. 6.

Now that I haue proued that there are no Euangelists, Prophets or Apostles, and that the ministeries of the word, which remayne, are limited vnto certayne places: I will take that whiche you graunt, that is, that the Pastor or Byshop ought to haue a speciall flocke. And demand of you, wherefore he should haue it? Is it not to attend vpon it? And can he attend vpon it, vnlesse he be resident and abiding vpon it? But he cannot be abiding vpon it, if he go from place to place to preach where he thinketh necessarie. Therefore being Pastor or Byshop of a congregation allotted vnto* 1.1 him, he may not go from place to place to preach where he thinketh good, much lesse to haue a ma∣stership of a colledge in one corner of the land, a Deanry in another, and a Prebend in the thirde, and so be absent from his pastorall charge in such places, where eyther he preacheth not, or needeth not to preach, those places being otherwise furnished without him. For then how is this difference kept betweene the Pastor and other ministers, that the one is tyed to a place, and the other is not. For if you say, that it is in that he shall preach more at his flocke, than at other places, I answere that the Euangelists and Apostles did carrie longer in one place, than in another, and taught some congregations yeares, whē they did not othersome moneths. And therfore they say nothing, which alleadge for the nonresidence of Pastors that S. Paule called Timothie and Titus from Ephe∣sus and Crete, for first they were Euangelists and no Pastors, then they went not of their owne heads, but called of the Apostle, which was a chiefe gouernoure of the Church. And thirdly they went not, but hauing other sufficient put in their place, as it appeareth in their seuerell epistles, so that if that place make any thing it maketh not to proue the non residencie, but rather whether a minister may be translated from one Church to another.

Io. Whitgifte.

Your reader, if he iudge indifferently, cannot but acknowledge this, that you so cō∣fidently speake of proores, to be but a vaine bragge and nothing so.

There is no man that denieth but that a Pastor ought so to attend vpō his slocke,* 1.2 as he may be well able to do his duetie towards the same, and with a good conscience answer his doings before the chiefe Pastor, to whome he shall giue his accompte. In the meane time if he be godly, if he preach among them as often as he is perswaded to be conuenient, if he haue a care ouer them, that they be not destitute of that, whiche is necessarie, if he haue such as are honest, learned, and diligent to supply his absence, he may be bolde to say to his vnlawfull iudges, tu quis es, qui iudicas alienum seruum, pro∣prio* 1.3 domino stat, aut cadit. VVho art thou, which condemnest another mans seruant? he stan∣deth or falleth to his owne Master▪ Whether a Pastor hauing a flocke, may also preach out of his owne charge, is another question. And although it be by you denyed, yet by∣cause your words without proofe weigh not much, I will (for the auoiding of confu∣sion) speake nothing thereof in this place, but this only, that as the opinion is strange, so is it most vntrue, and not to be iustifyed eyther by Scripture, aunciente fathers, or reasons.

But (oh T C.) who séeth not the mark, you shoote at? who perceyueth not how you* 1.4 slide from the matter to the person? To what ende do you here recite a mastership of a colledge, a Deanrie▪ a Prebend, but that your meaning is to note some one particular man, whome (bycause he hath withstoode your erroneous and contentious doctrine, hath not exalted you, as it is wel knowne you haue desired, hath executed those lawes vpon you, whiche (for the auoyding of manifest and wilfull periurie) you oughte to* 1.5 haue executed of your selfe) you séeke by all meanes possible to deface. Is this consci∣ence▪ Is this praebe, e te beneuolum magistro, non solùm dum in eo vixeris, sed etiam postea pro vi∣rill. &c. The Lord forgiue you, and giue you grace to know your selfe.

If he that hath this mastership, Deanry, Prebend & benefice, neglect his duetie in any one of them, if he do not that, that both Gods lawes and mans lawes require of him, if be be a loyterer, if he séeke his ease, if he be not able to giue an accompt of his doings when he shall therevnto be called, then let him susteyne both the shame, and the blame also.

The Pastor is not so tyed to any place, that he may not from the same be bodily* 1.6 absent vpon occastō, as I am ready to proue by sufficient both reason and authoritie, when I shall be vrged there vnto. The examples of the Euangelists and of the Apostles do verifie the same, for they fully instructed the churches, wherein they preached, in all things necessary to saluation, though they did not cōtinually remayne with them, but now and then visit them. And therefore the Pastors may so do in like manner.

Touching Timothie and Titus (whome you so oft without any kind of proofe de∣nie* 1.7 to be Pastors) I haue spoken else where at large: notwithstanding bycause your too too bolde asseuerations may appeare what they are, I will in a few words euen in this place declare, bothe that Timothie and Titus were Pastors, and that their ex∣amples do euidently proue that a Pastor may be vpon occasions absent from hys flocke. And for this time I will be content with that only, that M. Caluine writeth tou∣ching* 1.8 the same matter, referring the reader for further proofe, to that, that I haue in more ample manner written of the same. M. Caluine. 1. Ti. 1. doth call Timothie Pa∣stor of the Church of Ephesus. And in the. 1. Ti. 4. expounding these words, ne donum quod* 1.9 in te est. &c. he saith that the holy ghost had by oracle appointed Timothie to be receyued into the order of Pastors. And. 2. Ti. 4. that he did excell vulgare and common Pastors, meaning that he was an excellent Pastor, endued with more singular and notable gifts, and of greater authoritie, than the common sort of Pastors be. And in the same Chapter speaking of Paules sending for Timothie from Ephesus to Rome, he sayth, that there was no small cause why Paule sent for Timothie from that Churche, whiche he ruled and gouerned, and that so farre off: heereby we may gather (saith he) how profitable conference is with such men: for it might be profitable to all Churches, whiche Timothie might learne in a small time: so that the absence of halfe a yeare, or of one whole yeare, is nothing in comparison of the commoditie, that commeth thereby. Whereby it is mani∣fest that Caluine both tooke him to be a Pastor, and also excuseth his absence. So that the example of Timothie maketh much for the pnrpose: The like may be said of Titus, and of sundry other in the scriptures.

Now if the Apostle being a chiefe gouernoure of the Church might call Timothie and Titus so farre from their cures, and that for no great, nor yet common matters of the Churche, but for his owne priuate businesse, as it appeareth. 2. Tim. 4. then I trust you will also thinke it lawfull, that suche as be rulers and gouernours of the Church, may do the like. There is no man that writeth so exactly of Non residence, but* 1.10 he confesseth certaine necessary causes of absence, as if it be for the commoditie of the Church, whereof he is Pastor, or for the commoditie of the whole church of that king∣dome, or for the commoditie of other particular churches in the same, or for necessitie, or vpon commaundement of higher authoritie: in all these and such like cases the ab∣sence of a Pastor is lawfull, and it is praesentia rather than absentia, if you will beléeue learned writers. Now if you will demaund of me who shal allow these causes, I an∣swer, no one priuate mā, of what calling soeuer he be, but the magistrates, to whome the gouernment of the Churche is committed, if they allow the absence, and the Pa∣stor satisfye his owne conscience, there is no man of God, no good conscience, no mo∣dest spirite, that dare presume to iudge him, much lesse to condemne him.

That he ought in his absence to prouide a sufficient deputie, I confesse, and that example of Tichichus doth proue that, for he was Timothies deputie, and not his suc∣cessor, as you séeme to insinuate. M. Caluine saith that S. Paule sent Tichichus to Ephe∣sus,* 1.11 whē he sent for Timothie to Rome, in the meane time to supplie his absence: So that he was but Timothies deputie. Moreouer it is manifest that Timothie was oft ab∣sent* 1.12 from Ephesus, twice with Paule at Rome, and that he retourned thither againe this last time, as well as he did at other times, as both M. Caluines words before men∣tioned

do declare, and I also haue euidently proued in that place, where I proue Ti∣mothie* 1.13 to be Byshop of Ephesus.

Chap. 1. the second Diuision.

T. C. Pag. 47. Sect. 1.

But I will neuer weary my penne to confute those, whome their owne * 1.14 consciences are too strong for, and confuteth euery night when they go to bed: for that were nothing else but to reason with the bellie, that hath no eares to heare, or with the backe that hath no eyes to see. Those that thinke that they hauing charges of their owne, yet may go from place to place where they thinke it necessary, and that it skilleth not where they preach, so they preache: must consider, that if they thinke that God is the authoure of their placing in their flockes, then that eyther their abode there is needefull and expedient, or else that God did not see well and cleerely, what was meete to be done in placing them ouer that congregation, and appoynting that that congregation shoulde hang and depend vpon them, for their nurrishment and good gouernment.

Io. Whitgifte.

A sore iudgement and presumptuous: still I say tu quis es. &c. who art thou whyche* 1.15 condemnest. &c. The rest of that section is builded vpon the petition of the principle, for there is no man (I think) that so regardeth preaching in other places that he neg∣lecteth it in his owne. But I am fully perswaded, y^e God hath so called no man to one place, that he hath restreyned him from doing good in other places also: and I cōstant∣ly beléeue, that in the mo places he laboureth and doth good, the more his seruice to be accepted vnto God. And it is a token that he is truly called when he hathe an hartie desire to profite many.

All congregations of Christians are deare vnto God: wherefore he doth not so much incline to any one, that he woulde haue the other altogither neglected. And therfore if there be but one good man placed in a whole shire, I thinke that he is there placed to do good in the countrie round about him, and that he ought so to do, bycause they be all shéepe perteining to one folde: but yet so must he labour generally, that he haue an especiall care of his owne particular flocke.

Chap. 1. the. 3. Diuision.

T. C. Page. 47. Sect. 2.

And you see that if I woulde follow those noble metaphores of watchman and Shepheard, which the scripture vseth to expresse the office of a minister with, what a large field is opened vnto me. For then I could shew you how that cities besteged, and flocks in daunger of the wolues, are* 1.16 * watched continuallie night and day. And that there is no citie so sore and so continually besieged, nor no flocks subiect to so manyfold diseases at home, or hurtfull and deuouring beasts abroade, and that without any truce or intermission, as are the Churches, the Shephards, and watchmen whereof are Pastors or Byshops.

Io. Whitgifte.

I haue shewed before what your metaphors of watchmen and the pheards cā proue:* 1.17 what dissimilitudes there is betwixt them and spirituall watchmen and Pastors. I thinke your meaning is not, that the Pastor should preach both night and day, or that* 1.18 there is no continual watching, but continuall preaching. If I were disposed to dal∣lie with you in your metaphores, I could say vnto you that watchmen must of neces∣sitie oftentimes haue their deputies, or else that there must be many of them, and so watch by turnes. I could also say, that assoone as the watchman hathe told the citie of the enimies approching, and hath discrieb them vnto it, he may depart from his sta∣tion and take his rest.

Likewise that the watchman hath least to do, when his enimies are nighest, especi∣ally when they haue inuaded the citie: for then are the souldiers to driue them away by force. Wherefore by these metaphors this onely can you proue, that the Pastors ought to admonish their flocks of their enimies, discrie them in time, and will them to be vigilant. The enimies are knowen, the armoure is certaine, the citizens reaso∣nable,

wherefore if they neglect the Admonitions giuen in due time and order, if they be not vigilant, their bloud be vpon their owne pates, the watchman hath done hys duetie. The like in all respects may be said of shephards and shéepe.

To what purpose you haue quoted in your margent the. 2. of Luke. I knowe not,* 1.19 except it be, bycause it is there said, that the shepheards were watching their shepe in the night. The which how you can apply to your purpose I would gladly learne, for these shepheards went from their shéepe, and left them in great daunger.

Chap. 1. the. 4. Diuision.

T. C. Page. 47. Sect. 3.

But I will leaue that to their considerations, and will shew that the partes and duties of the minister be suche and so many in his owne flocke, that if he were as wise as Salomon was, as great in councell as Ioseph, as well learned as S. Paule, as actiue as Iosue, which fought so ma∣ny battayles in small space, yet al were little inough or too little, to perfourme to the 〈1 line〉〈1 line〉ul that, which his charge requir〈1 line〉〈1 line〉th of him. Of the Pastors therefore is required not only the preaching of the word, and ministring of the sacraments, whereof, the preaching of the word, & ministring of the sa∣crament of baptisme, ought to be continually, and as oft, as the Church may conueniently assemble, the other sacrament of the Lord his supper, although not so continually (sor that the Church shall hardly haue so much leysure from their necessary affairs of this life, as that they may celebrate it as 〈1 line〉〈1 line〉ften as the other) yet so often, as that we remember▪ that too rare and seldome celebrating it, argu∣eth a mind too too much forgetfull of the vnspeakable benefyte of our redemption, and argueth al∣so that we are farre behind the primitiue Church in zeale, which did celebrate it euery Saboth: I say beside the preaching of the worde, and ministring of the sacramentes, there is required of hym that he should admonish priuately, and house by house those that are vnder his charge.* 1.20

Io. Whitgifte.

Certaine it is, that the charge of a Pastor is great, and that he, which doth the best, must confesse and say that he is but an vnprofitable seruant: and yet if he occupy hys talents, be they mo, or be they fewer, and gaine with them more or lesse, he hathe a mercifull master, who will embrace him with mercie, and will accept of his seruice. And therefore, though he be much inferioure to Salomon in wisedome, to Ioseph in councell, to Paule in learning, and to Iosua in actiuitie, yet may he be a faithfull ser∣uant,* 1.21 and heare of his Lord and master, Euge serue bone & fidelis. &c. It is wel done good seruant and faithfull.

If you should thus streightly deale with the Pastors, and leaue them no consola∣tion, you should not follow our sauioure. Christ his mildenesse and mercie.

But let the bitternesse of your speaches go, and let vs come to the weight of your reasons: you say that there is required of the Pastors preaching of the word, and ministring of the sacraments, & priuate admonition, & that y^e preaching of the word & ministring of the sacramēt of Baptisme, ought to be continuall: and priuate exhortations likewise, & therfore the Pastor may not be absent. Touching y^e preaching of y^e word I haue spokē before something, it must be according y^e to cōscience & discretion of the Pastor, who hath to cōsider what is best for that cōgregation, wherof he hath y^e charge, both for the often preaching, & for the ma∣ner of preaching also: The sacraments maye be administred by other, than by the pa∣stor, as they were in the Apostles tyme. 1. Cor. 1. & Act. 10. Priuate exhortation must al∣so be vsed as occasion serueth, according to the discretion of the minister. But I mer∣uayle that you saye, the ministryng of the sacrament of Baptisme ought to be continually. &c.* 1.22 You knowe that in Victor his tyme it was celebrated but once in the yeare at Ea∣ster. And in Tertullians tyme at Easter and Pentecoste, and in many Parishes in Englande there is no such dayly néede of administring that Sacramente. To con∣clude, both the Sacramentes maye bée as well ministred by an other if occasion serue. And therefore of all other reasons this is the slenderest.

Sainct Paules meaning in the. 20. of the Actes, is not that he dayely went into their houses to exhort them, but that he did so as occasion serued.

Chap. 1. the fifte Diuision.

T. C. Page. 47. Sect. 3.

Now tell me howe this can be done profitably, without a diligent marking and looking into their manners? How can either publike preachings, or priuate admonitions haue their effect and working, vnlesse the word of God be applyed according to the disposition or state of that people, vn∣to which it is preached? And vndoubtedly hereof it commeth that the word of God is no more ef∣fectuall in this realme than it is, for bycause it is preached hand ouer head, without knowledge and vnderstanding the estate of the people. For so, oftentimes the promises and glad tidings of the gos∣pell of our Sauioure are preached vnto those, that being before secure in their sinnes, are after the hearing of the promises rocked into a dead sleepe thereof, and they that are ouerthrowen with the conscience of their sinne, and confounded in themselues, are by the sharpnesse of the law, and hea∣ring of the iudgement of God broken into peeces, & driuen to desperation. And so likewise, the peo∣ple are taught sometimes how to leade their liues in honest conuersation, when all that doctrine falleth to the ground, bycause they haue no knowledge of Christ, nor of faith in him: and to be short, it is as much as if eyther the surgeon should apply his plaister, or the Phisition his medicine, when they neyther know of the wound, or disease of their patients. But this knowledge of their estate, cannot be withoute a continuall abode amongst them, therefore a continuall residence is necssary.

Io. Whtgifte.

The Apostles and other in their time, did not long continue in one place to learne* 1.23 the peoples manners, and yet did they muche preuaile by preaching: neither is it so hard a matter to know the peoples manners and conditions, though a man be not perpetually resident among them.

The word of God (his name be praysed therefore) hath bin effectuall in England, and numbers are by the same conuerted from superstition, blindnesse, and ignorance, to the true knowledge of God. But this is an old and vsuall obiection of the Anabap∣tists against the Church of Christ, that in their Churches there is a manifest amendmēt* 1.24 of life, but in other Churches, which seeme to professe the gospell, there appeareth no such frute: & that the gospel is preached, but no man the better. This I say, is the slaunderous speach of the Anabaptists against those Churches, from the which they haue deuided themselues, and it is very oft vsed by you.

You must thinke that there be Pastors and Preachers in England, that vnder∣stand the state of the people, and know what discretion to vse in their sermons and exhortatiōs, as well as you can teach them. But this is most true, that as you thinke none learned but your selfe, so do you also iudge all men to lacke both wit add discre∣tion but your selfe. And here in this place haue you taken vpon you this censure most confidently, I will not say arrogantly.

In the end of this diuision you conclude thus, the knowledge of the estate of the people cannot be knowne without a cōtinual abode with them: therfore a continual residence is necessary. You must proue the Antecedent, for it is false. The Apostle knew (so farre as it was* 1.25 necessary for him to knowe) the Romaines, the Corinthians, Galatians and other Churches to whome he wrote, and yet was he not continually resident among them▪ And so did the other Apostles and Preachers, whiche were not resident in any one place: and yet a preacher may do good in preaching among them, whome he knoweth not, for it is God that directeth him in his words and matter. And for as muche as he cannot but knowe that euery congregation consisteth of diuers mindes and affecti∣ons, therefore (excepte he be voyde of discretion) he will so moderate and temper hys sermon or exhortation, that it may profyte all, and hurte none, but suche as do not accordingly receyue it. And therefore bothe these propositions are false: th〈1 line〉〈1 line〉 a man by preaching cannot profyte such, as he knoweth not: and that he cannot know them, except he be perpetually resident with them.

Chap. 1. the sixte Diuision.

T. C. Page. 48. Sect. 1.

Moreouer as in the law the priests were ready in the temple to answer to al the doubts & que∣stions, that any of the people should come to aske: so the ministers in their seuerall parishes shoulde be ready to dissolue the difficulties, that eyther one hathe with another, or with himselfe, touching the conscience, for want whereof, the consciences of many, after doubtfull and daungerous wrast∣ling with the deuill, and wich dispaire are strangled. And therevpon some hang or drowne them∣selues, some other putting away all care or conscience of sinning, and labouring to haue no sense nor feeling of their sinne, close vp the wounde vnhealed, which after, eyther breaketh out more daunge∣rously, or else euery day more and more waxing senselesse, and withoute feeling, treasure vp vnto themselues the wrath of God against the day of iudgement. For although the iudgement of God doth not for the time follow them so hard, as them, which through terroure of conscience vntaught and vncomforted, kill themselues: yet their estate is neuer the lesse daungerous therefore, but ra∣ther more, for asmuch as by a longer line of sinne drawne out, they also pull vpon themselues a hea∣uier conde〈1 line〉〈1 line〉nation. Which things when they see oftentimes before their eyes, that will consider it, it is easy to iudge that it commeth to passe a great deale oftner than we can see.

Io. Whitgifte.

You do not referre me to any place, where I might reade that the priests in the lawe were ready in the temple to answere all the doubts and questions, that any of the people shoulde come to aske. &c. And I do not remember any suche place in the scripture, excepte you meane that, which is written in the. 17. of Deute. verse. 9. &c. where there is no suche* 1.26 attendance mentioned: but only the people are willed to bring their controuersies to the priests and the iudge. If you meane the. 12. verse of that Chap. where it is said of the priest that he standeth before the Lord to minister there, you haue also missed the quisshi∣on. For the meaning of that place is that whosoeuer presumptuously refuseth to har∣ken vnto the Priest (so long as the prieste is the true minister of God, and pronoun∣ceth according to his word) shall die. &c. The priest here had to do in ciuill and iudiciall matters togither with the iudge: the priest was but in the chéefe place, where iudge∣ment was heard, and not in euery particular congregation. Wherfore if you would conclude any thing of this place, it must be, that the Priest must be ioyned with the Iudge, and haue to do in ciuill and iudiciall matters, and remaine in some chiefe place of the countrie where iudgements are to be heard. You can by no meanes hereof con∣clude, that euery particular congregation should haue a Pastor continually remay∣ning with them.

There is not now any such general ignorance, but that there may diuers be found able to answer all such doubts, as you speake of sufficiently, though the Pastor be ab∣sent. The scriptures also are publikely red in euery mans house, whiche are as Saint Paule saith. 2. Ti. 3. profitable to teach, to improue, to correct, to instruct in righteousenes,* 1.27 that the man of God may be absolute, being made perfect in all good works: and as Chry∣sostome calleth them, they be an apothecarie his shoppe, where euery man may finde* 1.28 remedy for his diseases.

Moreouer the sufficiencie of his curate may be suche, that he shall be aswell able to answere all suche questions, as if he himselfe were present. Neyther are those cases you put vsuall (God be thanked) and they oftentimes happen, where there is leaste cause to complaine of any absence of the Pastor.

Chap. 1. the. 7. Diuision.

T. C. Page. 48. Sect. 1.

When as therefore the only preaching of the word of God being continuall, is a bond strong e∣nough to hold the Pastor to his flocke, then the enquirie of the maners & behauioure of his flocke, the priuate admonitions and consolations, the dissoluing of doubts, when any riseth, as a three or foure fould cord ought much more to hold hym: so that he which shall breake all these things wil∣lingly and wittingly, cannot easily be thought to breake them as Sampson did his, by the strength of God, but rather by some other power not of God.

Io. Whitgifte.

I would not haue any man to thinke, that I take vpon me to maintaine carelesse &* 1.29 slouthful pastors: I speake only of such as be vigilant, & occupie themselues profitably in the Church, visite their seueral flockes, & teach them to the satisfying both of the pa∣rishes, and of their owne consciences also: such I am persuaded, may do as much in al those points here by you mentioned, to the commoditie of their flocke being somtimes absent, as if they were continually present, besides the good they may do, to the whole Church generally, wherof they are also members and Ministers.

But I muse with what face you can thus seke to deface true pastors that do good in* 1.30 the Church, though not so much as you thinke they should do, seing you your self, and a number mo do no good at all in any place, but only range vp & downe, liue at other mens tables, disturbe the Church, & thinke that you haue done your duties, when you haue defaced all other mens doings. I am verily persuaded, that he which preacheth at his cure but one sermon in a yeare, offendeth God lesse, than you doe, that haue for∣saken your calling.

Chap. 1. the eyght Diuision

T. C. Pag. 48. Sect. 1.

Besides that S. Paul commaundeth that the pastor should be a paterne or example in al good∣nesse,* 1.31 & holinesse of life vnto his flocke, & our sauiour Christ saith that when the she〈1 line〉〈1 line〉harde hath 〈◊〉〈◊〉* 1.32 forth his sheepe, he goeth before them, but if the Pastor be not amongst his flocke▪ and haue not his conuersation there, they can not follow him. If they haue not the example before their eyes, 〈◊◊〉〈◊◊〉 not make the like vnto it. Therfore this commaundement also bindeth them to residencie amongst their flockes. S. Peter willeth the Pastors of the Churches, that they shoulde feede the flockes. What flockes? Not euery one, but those, which are committed to their faith or trust, or which de∣pendeth vpon them. And S. Paule speaking to y^e ministers or Bishops of Ephesus, willeth them* 1.33 that they should take heede vnto the flockes, ouer the which the holy Ghost had made them ouer∣seers, where he restra〈1 line〉〈1 line〉eth, as S. Peter did their ouersight and watch vnto their particular flock.* 1.34 S. Paul saith that he toke it heauily that he was separated from them but a small time. If ther∣fore the Apostle was away with griefe from them, whom he had taught, whō his calling compel∣led to be awaye, and woulde not suffer to be alwayes there: what shall be thought of the Pastors, whose callings is to be with their flockes, & which are consecrated vnto them, euē as the Apostles were vnto y^e whole world? what I say shal be thought of them, that are away monethes & yeeres?

Io. Whitgifte.

Christ is a paterne and an example to vs in all goodnesse, whome we muste fol∣lowe,* 1.35 and yet we neuer saw him, but haue only heard of him by his word. S. Paule willed the Corinthians. 1. Cor. 4. &. 11. and the Philippians chap. 3. to followe him, and yet was he not perpetually resident among them. A man may be throughly knowne touching his externall conuersation, of those with whom he is diuers times conuer∣sant, although he be not alwayes abiding with them. I thinke there be Pastors very well knowne to their flockes both for their life and doctrine, and yet doe not continu∣ally remaine with them: you and I haue not bin long nor much conuersant together, and yet surely I suppose that I know you both touching your Religion, conuersation, and affectiō, as well as if I had béen twentie yéeres companion in your chamber with you. And therfore this is no good argument, to say that the pastor muste be an example to his flocke, and therfore he must of necessitie be continually among them, for he maye so be, and that perfectly, if he be sundry times among them, and likewise if they heare of his good conuersation in place where he remayneth, when he is not among them.

The same answere serueth for that which is alleaged out of the. 10. of S. Iohn.

S. Peter. 1. Epist. Chap. 5. doth not onely exhort Pastors and such as be addicted to some certain place, but all other also to whom this word presbyter doth reach, as it may appeare in that he himself sayth qui sum & ipse presbyter, whiche am also my selfe an el∣der.* 1.36 Wherfore it is an exhortation generall to al preachers and Ministers of y^e word, and not only proper to pastors: the words that follow be diuersly expounded: some say feede the flocke of God, which dependeth vpon you, some, which is committed vnto you, and othersome, as muche as lyeth in you, which is the most common interpretation, 〈◊〉〈◊〉 it is as much as though he should say, according to the Talent that God hath gyuen

vnto you. But how soeuer it be interpreted, the meaning is, that euery mā labour in teaching, instructing, and gouerning the Church of Christ, and the charge committed vnto him faithfully and diligently. Which exhortatiō of Peter may be obeyed of him that is not continually remaining in one place, if he do, as I haue said before.

The words of S. Paul Acts. 20. tend to the same ende. A minister of the word and pastor must be diligent in his calling, not slouthfull, and ought to séeke by all meanes possible to profit the Church of Christ, and especially in such places, where vnto he is especially called: all this I graunt.

The place of S. Paule. 〈1 line〉〈1 line〉. Thes. 2. is far from the purpose. For Paule declareth his singular good will and affection that he had to the Thessalonians: he doth not expresse any dutie of his ministerie, and therfore a learned man interpreting that place sayth, binc colligimus, quod sancti etiam se videre secundiòn carnem gestiunt, hereof we gather, that the Saincts also do gladly desire to see one another bodily. A man to expresse his singular af∣fection towards his friend, will say, that it gréeueth him to be out of his companie one houre. But how followeth this argument. Paule was desirous to be corporally pre∣sent with the Thessalonians, and to remaine with them, Ergo a Pastor must neuer be absent from his flocke? if it be lawfull to make such arguments, I will conclude any thing.

Chap. 1. the 9. Diuision.

T. C. Page. 48. Sect. 1.

And indeede those that feede their flockes faithfully according to the commaundement of God, doe see what a great wisedome and mercy of God it is to appoynt euery flocke his pastor, & euery pastor his flocke. They can tell of a wonderfull loue, that God worketh in them towardes theyr flockes, and in their flockes towardes them. A greate encoragment vnto them, and as it were a pricke to sturre vp their dulnesse it is, when they see the blessing of God vpon their labours, and thereof a maruelous care, and thought to turne all such things away, as shoulde hinder the encrease of that blessing, which they can not haue any feeling or experience of, which are not conuersant with their flockes, besides a familiaritie betwene the pastor and the flocke is profitable to this, that eue∣ri〈1 line〉〈1 line〉 one maye be emboldened to come and demaunde to be satisfyed of those things they doubte of, which they will neuer do vnto those, whome they are not by continuall conuersation acquainted with.

Io. Whitgifte.

How can you tell? you haue no such experience, for you neuer had flocke: or what boasting pastor hath so bragged of himself? Peraduenture bicause some troublesome persons delighted with contentions and straunge opinions made much of him, & the rest gaue him some countenance, he thought they loued him, when as peraduenture it was nothing so. But be it true of those, whom you meane: I doubt not but there be flockes that haue that loue towardes their Pastors, and Pastors that haue that loue to∣wards their flockes (though they do not continually remaine with them) which ought to be in the Children of God, and which neuer will be remoned, deface you them as much as you can.

Chap. 1. the tenth Diuision.

T. C. Pag 49. Line. 2.

And it is not nothing, that Aristotle disputeth against Plato his communitie, which would haue all thyngs common, and that all men indifferently shoulde haue care of all things, and shoulde haue nothing, whiche he shoulde saye to be his owne. For therein Aristotle saide verye well, that that which was (*) 1.37 cared for of all men, was neglected of all, and cared for of none: so that the preser∣uation of wife or Children, or of any other possession, was then the best and surest, when as euery man had a certaine possession committed vnto him, whiche he shoulde care for, and take charge of. And so the Lord his wisedome was for the better suertie and saluation of his Church, not to make many Ministers, which should in common and indifferently take care of all, but ordeyned that the Church should be deuided in diuerse partes, and that euery one should haue a peece to care for, and to giue accompt for.

Io Whitgifte.

What hath Aristotle to do with non residence? Authoritie is scarse when his helpe is* 1.38 required. But what saith he? forsoth, that that which was cared for of all men, was neglected of all. I thinke that you report not Aristotles wordes truely: for as farre as I remem∣ber, he sayth that that which is common to all, is neglected of all. The other can not be true, for that which is cared for of all men, can not be neglected of all (for to care for, and to neglect, be contraries) but must of necessitie be well prouided for, and looked vnto. But to what purpose do you alleage this? Bycause I saye that no man must so loke to his priuate* 1.39 charge, that he neglect the other partes of the Church: do I therefore say that there is no priuate charge, but all things are in common? It is the duetie of euery member in the common wealth so to loke to his owne priuate affaires and businesse, that he neg∣lect not the common state of his country: are all things therfore common? neither did Aristotle euer teach that a man should so care for his certaine possession, that he preferred not the common vtilitie before it: and so likewise Christ hath deuided to euery man a portion of hie Church to care for, but yet not so, that he should thinke himself no lon∣ger bound to the whole, or that he must now cease from profiting the whole.

Chap. 1. the. 11. Diuision.

T C. Page 49. Sect. 1.

Now if any man will say, that in such great scarcitie of Pastors, it is good, that when a man hath trauailed in one place, & remoued them from superstition, & brought them to beleeue in God through Christ, to go to another place, and assay also to draw them from Idolatrie: first I vrge that, which I did before, which is the calling, wherein euery man must abide, and without the which no man ought to attempt any thing. Then I say, that it is as hard a prouince, and as painefull a thing vn∣to the pastor, as acceptable and precious a worke vnto the Lorde, to kepe those, which are gotten, as to get those, which are not gotten: and that that saying is fulfilled here, if in any thing else, Non minor est virtus, quam quaerere, parta tueri.

Io. Whitgifte.

This obiection is of greater force, than you are able to withstande. For the same God, that hath called him to the one place, to plant his true Religion there, hath also called him to the other, that he may doe the like euen as he did the Apostles, Prophets and Euangelistes, and pastors also, who haue béen euen immediatly after the Apo∣stles time transferred from one place to another, for the greater commoditie of the Church: Neither can it be proued that any man should be so tyed to one place, that he may not be transferred to another to profit more.

It is true that the deuill most greuously assaulteth those, which haue embraced the truth, bicause now they are become his professed enimyes, & openly withstand hym: But they are sufficiently armed with faith, and with y^e word of God, so that although they be tempted, yet can they not be ouercome. The other that remaine in ignorance he wholy possesseth, and bicause they haue yéelded themselues vnto him, he doth suffer them to be quiet: therfore to deliuer such out of his seruitude and bondage, and so to arme & instruct them, that they are not only able to withstand, but to put to flight the deuill also, must of necessitie be both the hardest, and the most acceptable worke vnto God: except you will say that it is more commendable to helpe him, who is sufficiently ar∣med, and able to resist, than him that is altogether vnarmed, and as it were vnder the foote of his enimy. Certainly the most acceptable worke vnto God is, to conuert sinners vnto repentance, and to heale such as be sicke, & therfore Christ himselfe sayd, that he* 1.40 came to seeke that which was lost: and the parable of the lost grote, and of the Prodigall* 1.41 sonne doth with might & maine ouerthrow your sayings: so do the whole dealings of the Apostles, and the whole course of the Scriptures.

Chap. 1. the. 12. Diuision.

T. C. Pag. 49. Sect. 2.

For we knowe that after that the Deuill perceyueth, that men are pulled oute of the power

of darknesse, into the glorious light of the Gospel, he sweateth and laboureth by a thousand meanes to destroy them, and bestirreth himselfe more then, than in the time of their ignorance, and in steade of that one chayne of ignorance, and want of the knowledge of God, he layeth a thousande trappes for them, to snare them with. So that the continuall daunger that the Churche is in, dothe as it* 1.42 were speake vnto the pastor in the cōmon prouerbe, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉: that is, looke diligently to that charge, whiche thou hast receyued. For if the watcheman should forsake the citie, where vnto he is appoynted, and go, and watche in another, where he is not called, although he saue that, if he loose the other, he shall not therfore escape the punishment of betraying the other citie▪ where he was placed watchman.

Io Whitgifte.

So it is: but all the diuels in hell can not preuayle agaynst them: therefore sayde S. Paule to the Ephe. cap. 6. Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to* 1.43 resist the euill day. &c. euery Christian is in this case, yea the pastor himselfe: but wote you what Christ sayth, Ioh. 10. My sheepe heare by voyce, and no man shall take them* 1.44 out of my handes. The Scriptures, as Chrysostome sayth, be continuall scholema∣sters: and he that hath vnderstanding may therein learne howe to withstande Sa∣than and all his assaultes. And therefore sayde the Apostle to the Coll. 3. Let the worde of God dwell in you abundantly, in all wisdome, teaching and admonishing your owne selues, in Psalmes and hymnes. &c.

If the watcheman hathe sufficiently admonished the citie, and hathe ministred wea∣pons vnto them, brought them out of the bondage of their enimie, and leaue some o∣ther behinde him to supply the rest, and then go to another citie to deliuer it also from the like slauery, if in the meane time the former citie be lost, or reuolted (which is not like) their bloud be vpon themselues, the watchman hath done his dutie. When Io∣〈1 line〉〈1 line〉s had tolde Niniuie hir offences, & shewed his message for the which he was sent,* 1.45 was there any more required of him? Moreouer I am persuaded, that wheresoeuer the preacher may do most good, thither is he called of God: neyther is this to forsake his station, but to followe his calling, and to do good.

Chap. 1. the. 13. Diuision.

T. C. Page. 49. Sect. 3.

Touching the behalfe of God and his glory, if any man will say that they can not perish, which once haue beleeued, and therfore those may be left, and others attempted, I can say of those that are in ignorance and blindnesse, that they can not perishe that be elected, although they neuer haue the Gospell preached. And therfore we must walke in those wayes that God hath appoynted, to bring them to saluation, which is to feede them continually, and watche ouer them so long as they are in daunger of hunger, in daunger of wolues, in daunger of the enimies, within and without, which is so long as the Churche is heere vpon the earth.

Io. Whitgifte.

God forbid that any man should vse any suche kinde of excuses, to take away the meanes wherby God vseth to cal such as be his: but it is a cōfort to the pastor, when he is in conscience persuaded, that he hath not omitted to open vnto his flocke those wayes and meanes, and that he ceasseth not still to admonish thē of the same in time conuenient. S. Paul Act. 20. sayth to the Ministers of the Church of Ephesus, that he* 1.46 was free from the bloud of them all, and that he had opened vnto them the whole counsel of God. &c. and yet he had not bin muche with them: and after that time he thought that he should not sée the most of them any more. Wherfore a man may do his dutie, and open all things and meanes necessarie vnto saluation, although he be not conti∣nually remayning in one place. Chrysostome expounding the place in the thirde to* 1.47 the Collos. Let the worde of God dwell in you. &c. after that he hath willed them to pre∣pare them Bybles, and tolde them that it especially perteyneth to them to reade the scrip∣tures, he addeth: cast not all vpon our shoulders. You are sheepe, but yet reasonable, the A∣postle hath committed many things vnto you. Those that are to be instructed muste not alwayes learne. &c. And agayne he sayth: Habes oracula dei, nemo te docebit quemadmodùm illa: Thou hast the word of God, no man can teache thee like vnto it.

Chap. 1. the. 14. Diuision.

T. C. Pag 49. Sect 4.

Upon all which things I conclude, that the residence of the Pastor is necessary, & to doubt whe∣ther the Pastor ought to be resident amongest his flocke, is to doubt whether the watchman should be in his towre, the eye should be in the head, or the soule in the body, or the shephard amongest hys flocke, especally where the sheepe are continually in daunger of wolues, as in the land of Iurie, frō whence this similitude or maner of speach was taken, where they watched their flockes night and day, as I obserued before out of S. Luke.

Io. Whitgifte.

The question is not whether the pastor ought to be resident or no, but of the time, the maner and kind of residence. No man must continually be absent, for that were alto∣gether to neglect his flocke: neither is it required that he be continually present, for that can not be. But if he neglect not his duetie in preaching, & performe other things requisite, although he be sundry times absent vpon the occasions before specified, yet is he not to be condemned, seyng it often times commeth to passe, y^t such kind of men do most good, both in their Churches particularly, and in the Church generally.

Of the watchman and of the shephard I haue spoken before, and shewed wherin the si∣militude* 1.48 holdeth, & wherin it holdeth not: no one watchman is continually in y^e towre, neither is it possible that he should be: it is sufficient if the towre be watched, & the chiefe watchman neglect not his duetie: the shephard also is not alwayes present wyth his shéepe, but sometime he leaueth them alone, when he hath folded thē, or brought them into a safe pasture, & sometimes he cōmitteth thē to his seruaunt, or to some o∣ther to be kept in his absence. The similitude of the eye and of the soule, in some pointes may be aptly applyed, but not in this of residence, for if either the eye be plucked out of the head, or the soule separated from the body, neither of them both can be restored again. But you must confesse that there be causes why a pastor may be absent frō his flocke without any such vncurable daunger: and therfore these similitudes in these cases of absence holde not.

T. C. Page. 49. Sect. 5.

If any will here vpon conclude, that they haue no space giuen them to slepe, to eate, to drinke. &c. they are cauils, which I will not vouchsafe to answere.

Io. Whitgifte.

A very modest, and short answere.

Chapter. 1. the. 15. Diuision.

T. C. Pag. 49. Sect. vlt.

Againe, if he will say, that then they may not go forth of the towne to do their necessarie businesse* 1.49 * 1.50 for their families, I desire them in the name of God, y^t they abuse not his graces, in deuising cloakes to couer their disorders, but that they would set before them the loue of Christ, which shalbe found to de so much, as they shall shew themselues diligent in continuall feeding their flockes, & to feare the iudgement of God, before whom no feined, or coloured excuse will stande. And so I trust they will make no longer absence, than must needes, and if vpon any occasion at any time they be some∣what longer, that the same be not without the leaue of their Churches, whose they are, and which they for the Lord his sake serue, & then also that in suche rare and necessary absence (*) 1.51 they prouide thē of some able man to teach in the meane season, which the Churche by hir gouernours wyll al∣lowe of.

Io. Whitgifte.

Yet such doubtes woulde be directly resolued, for they séeme something to trou∣ble you. And in very déede they cause you to ouerthrow whatsoeuer you haue hetherto gone aboute to builde: for nowe you confesse that the Pastor maye be absente of hys owne priuate busynesse: if he haue leaue of hys Parishe, and if he prouide some able man to teache in the meane season. &c. I pray you let me aske you a few questions: may not a man be aswell absent for publike affaires, or at the commaundement of the Prince

or chiefe Magistrate, as he may be for his owne priuate businesse? Is not his flocke in as great daunger when their Pastor is absent with their leaue, as when he is absent without their leaue? or where do you finde it in scripture, that the Pastor oughte to aske leaue of his Parishe, when he hath occasion to be absent? Or howe shall he get* 1.52 an able man in the meane season, to teache his flocke, when as you affirme, that no man may be admitted into the ministerie, except he haue a certayne flocke committed vnto him. And that then it is not lawfull for him to preache out of his owne cure? These questions woulde be answered, and these contrarie spéeches of yours reconciled, if it be possible. For vn∣doubtedly they do not agrée with your former talke.

Of pluralities, or hauing moe benefices than one.

Chap. 2. the. 1. Diuision.

Admonition.

Then had euery flocke his shepheard, or else y 1.53 shepheards: Nowe they do not onely runne fisking from place to place (a miserable disorder in Gods Church) but z 1.54 couetously ioyne liuing to liuing, making shipwracke & 1.55 of their owne consciences, and beeing but one shephearde (nay, would to God they were shepheards and not wolues) haue many flockes.

Ansvvere to the Admonition. Pag. 50. Sect. 3. 4. & Pag. 51. Sect. 1.

You say also that euery flocke had his shephearde or else shep∣heards. And to proue that one flocke had moe shepheards, you cyte Act. 14. which maketh nothing for your purpose: yet I deny not but one flocke maye haue moe Pastors, for I see nothing in the worde of God agaynst it.

To be shorte, you say nowe they go fisking from place to place, and couetously ioyne liuing to liuing. &c. & beeing but one shepheard haue many flockes. If you meane by fisking from place to place, such as preache in diuers places, and not in their owne cures onely, your phrase of fisking is to light and scurrilous. When you alleadge any reason why men may not goe from place to place to preache, where they thinke it necessarie, you shall eyther be answered, or yeelded to. In the meane time I thinke it agreable bothe to Gods worde, and conscience.

Agaynst couetously ioyning of liuing to liuing you alleage the. 5. of Esay, which is farre from your purpose: for the Prophet speaketh there of suche as oppresse the poore, and will not suffer them to haue a place to dwell in: yet I do not allowe suche as couetously ioyne li∣uing to liuing, of what kinde or degree of men soeuer they be.

Io. Whitgifte.

To the abusing of the. 14. of the Acts by the Admonition, nothing is answered by T. C. nor to the. 5. of Esay.

Chap. 2. the second Diuision.

Ansvvere to the Admonition. Pag. 51. Sect. 1.

But I see no cause why one good and diligent Pastor may not rather be credited with moe flockes, than a slothfull, vnskilfull, or negligent with one. You thinke (I suppose) that there be dyuers parishes in Englande which might be ioyned in one, and so commit∣ted to one man, and why may they not be so in like manner, when they be distinct?

T. C. Pag. 50. Sect. 1.

And heerevpon also is ended another question that the Answerer maketh, whether one may haue many flockes, which is, whether one shepheard may be many shepheards, one watcheman many watchemen. For if his residence be necessarie in one place, then he oughte to content hym selfe with one.

Io. Whitgifte.

My question is this: why one man may not aswell haue diuers pa∣rishes, when they be distinct, as he may when they be ioyned togi∣ther? for the compasse, the number, and the distance of place, is all one: you confesse* 1.56 that the one may be, and the reformed Churches in Fraunce dyd so vse it, where (as I am credibly enformed, and you before séeme to affirme) sixe Townes or mo were committed to one Pastor. This béeing lawfull, I sée not why the other shoulde not be so in like maner: neither haue you answered to any one worde in this parte.

Chapter. 2. the. 3. Diuision.

Ansvvere to the Admonition. Pag. 51. Sect. 2.

I speake not this to encourage any man to take more vpon him than with a good conscience he may well discharge. And I woulde wishe you to absteyne from iudging too farre, when you see a man that hath mo liuings, vse himselfe vprightly and carefully in them all, and otherwyse profitably to the whole Churche.

T. C. Pag. 50. Sect. 2.

And whereas you would haue men charitably iudge of those, whiche take many liuinges▪ surely if so be that he taketh many flockes, not to the intent to haue more liuing to maynteyne an ambicious pompe, or to satisfie a greedie desire of hauing more than inoughe, but to this ende, that he may bring in a more plentifull haruest vnto the Lorde: it were good that he would be content to take but that liuing of all his flockes, which he nowe hath of one, especially where one is able to keepe and maynteyne him and his familie honestly. Else let him heare what (*) 1.57 Councels & others haue thought of those which haue more benefices than one.

Io. Whitgifte.

You kéepe no order in answering my booke, but place and displace at your plea∣sure, onely to this ende, as it should séeme, that you would not haue your Reader per∣ceyue what you omitted vnanswered. But I will followe you, and examine what Councels and other haue thought of suche as haue more benefites than one: for in this porti∣on you vtter but words, and take vpon you to iudge mens intents and purposes, and to prescribe them their stipende.

Chap. 2. the. 4. Diuision.

T. C. Pag. 50. Sect. 3.

In the. 15. Canon of the Councell of (a) 1.58 Nice, it is commaunded that no clearke should be placed in two Churches, and he addeth the reasons, wherof the first is, that it is a poynt of mar∣chaundise,* 1.59 and of filthy gayne. The seconde, that (*) no man can serue two masters. The thirde,* 1.60 that euery one ought to (*) tarrie in that calling, wherin he is called.

Io. Whitgifte.* 1.61

It should séeme that you woulde gladly make men beléeue, (and it is very like that you your selfe are also persuaded) that this Councel was the first Councel of Nice:

For else why doe you in the nexte section place Damasus, and name the second tome of the Councels, when as Damasus was long time before this your Councell of Nice, and the same Councell is in the seconde tome of the Councels. Least therefore the Reader may be deceyued, I let him to vnderstand, that this Canon héere by you alleaged, is a Canon of the seconde Councell of Nice, holden about Anno. 795. or. 781. and one of the corruptest Councels that euer was, wherein not onely praying to Saincts, & adoring of Reliques, but also worshipping of Images. &c. was confirmed.

But yet let vs examine this Canon of that Councell. In the ende of that same* 1.62 Canon it is thus written: Et haec quidem in hac regia ciuitate, in his autem quae extra sunt locis, propter hominum inopiam permi〈1 line〉〈1 line〉titur: And these things are to be vnderstanded in this regall Citie: for in those places that be without, it is permitted for the scarsi〈1 line〉〈1 line〉ie of persons. Wherby it is playne, that the meaning of the Canon is, that no one man should haue committed vnto him mo great cities than one: but that he might haue mo townes or villages committed to his charge, it is manyfest by those words of that Canon that I haue rehearsed. And therefore Gratian himselfe dothe thus expounde that Canon: Sed duae ecclesiae intellig untur ecclesiae duarū ciuitatū, in quibus nullus debet conscribi: But by two* 1.63 churches are ment the churches of two cities, wherin no man ought to be appoynted. And for the proofe thereof he alleageth this Canon of the Councel of Calcedon: Clericū in duarum ecclesijs ciuitatū conscribi non oportet: A Clearke may not be appoynted in the Chur∣ches of two cities. And the Glosse vpon that place sayth: that one man may be intituled in two Churches, if the Churches be poore: or if the Bishop doe dispense and thinke it conuenient, or if the number of Clearkes be fewe: or if he be intituled to the one, and haue the other in commendā, or if the one be neere to the other. And the authoritie of this Glosse is as sufficient as the credite of that Councell of Nice, if the Canon did not ex∣pounde it selfe. I omit the absurde allegation of the Striptures to confirme this their purpose. For the place Mat. 6. is to be vnderstanded of contrarie masters: and that in the. 1. Cor. 7. of the kinde of vocation, and not of the place. He that dothe his duetie in mo places, is lawfully called to them all, as I haue sayde before.

Chap. 2. the. 5. Diuision.

T. C. Pag. 50. Sect. 4.

And in the (*) 1.64 seconde tome of the Councels, Damasus in his fourth Epistle likeneth those that set ouer their charges vnto other, vnto harlots, which assone as they haue brought foorth their children, by and by giue them to be nourished of others, to the intent that they might the sooner ful∣fill their inordinate lustes.

Io. Whitgifte.

You are deceyued: it is in the first tome of Councels, and therefore the more like it is, that you take the former Councel to be the first Councel of Nice: But such dealing is vsuall with you: if you had ment playnely, you would haue sayd, the seconde Coun∣cell of Nice, and not simply the Councell of Nice, whiche argueth either that you were deceyued your selfe, or else sought to deceyue others.

This place of Damasus is nothing at all to your purpose, which you might easi∣ly* 1.65 haue perceyued, if you had red that Epistle. For he onely there speaketh agaynst suche as were called Chorepiscopi, who were in degrée inferiour to Bishops, and yet did they despise to be counted no better than Priests. There were certayne Bishops in Damasus time, that gaue them selues wholly to idlenesse and pleasure, and cōmit∣ted their office to suche, as were called Chorepiscopi, as it is euident in that Epistle: neyther dothe he meane any other charge than consecrating of Priests, Deacons, and virgins, imposition of hands, blessings, erecting of aulters, dedicating of Churches, and suche like, whiche were taken properly to perteyne to the Bishop, and yet not∣withstanding was by some Bishops passed ouer to such Chorepiscopi. This negligence of bishops in such matters Damasus cōdēneth, togither with y^e office of Chorepiscopus.

And this is the whole drifte of Damasus in that Epistle, as it is most euident. And therefore sayth Leo (as Gratian reporteth) Dist. 68. Hi (meaning chorepiscopi) propter* 1.66 insolentiam suam, qua officia episcoporum sibi vsurpant, ab ecclesia prohibiti sunt: These men for their insolencie, wherby they vsurpe the offices of Bishops, are excluded from the Church. So that héere is not one worde in this whole Epistle agaynst Curates, and suche as* 1.67 are lefte to supplie the Pastors absence. Moreouer you your selfe in the beginning of this page confesse, that a man béeing absent may leaue his Deputie in his place. But yet heere you haue forgotten your purpose, that is, to proue that one man may not haue moe benefices: in whiche cause also it appeareth that you are destitute of proofes, béeing compelled to vse onely corrupt authorities?

Chap. 2. the sixte Diuision.

T. C. Pag. 50. Sect. 5.

Whether it were better that one diligent Pastor should haue many flockes, than a negligent and vnskilfull Pastor one, is not the question: for we say neyther is lawfull, nor ought to be done.

Io. Whitgifte.

You say muche, but proue little. I thinke it muche better that one man haue dy∣uers, than that any should be vntaught. For I speake of that time wherein there is not a competent number of preachers to be had for all places.

It passeth to sée howe you haue dismembred my booke, euen of purpose to auoyde the answering of diuers things, and euen very héere you haue omitted one principal poynt. For I aske also this question, why that Parishes beeing distincte, may not aswell be committed to one man, as the same mighte be, if they were made all one, as you woulde haue them? for the distance of pla∣ces, and the number of persons is not altered: onely the ease of the Pastor, and grea∣ter paynes of the people is procured. For whereas the Pastor before came to them, nowe must they take paynes to come to him. But suche things you wil not voutsafe the answering, bicause in déede you can not.

Chap. 2. the. 7. Diuision.

Ansvvere to the Admonition. Pag. 50. Sect. 1.

For who deuided Parishes? and who hathe authoritie to ioyne* 1.68 them? dyd not Dionisius a Monke, and Pope of Rome? for it is thus written of him, Tom. 1. conci. Dionisius Monacbus Papa presbyteris ecclesias diuisit, & coemiteria, parochias{que} & Dioeceses constituit: Dionisius a Monke and Pope deuided to Priestes Churches and Churcheyardes, and appoynted Pari∣shes and Dioces.

T. C. Page. 50. Sect. 6. 7.

Do you beleeue that, whiche you set downe of Denis the Monke and Pope, that he deui∣sed and deuided parishes? If you doe not, why woulde you haue vs beleeue it? If the law doth condemne him that turneth a blinde man out of the way, or layeth a blocke before him, what dothe it him, which woulde put out the eyes of them that see their way already? I haue shewed, and* 1.69 the matter is playne, that the Lord deuided nationall Churches into parishes and congregations. So that if S. Paule haue not the worde of parishe, yet he hathe the thing. And those that haue read stories, knowe that 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 (whiche we call a Diocesse, and whiche conteyneth with vs numbers of parishes) was at the first, taken to be the same that parishe is, and vsed a great whyle before Denis was borne, or munkerie begotten.

And as for Coemeteria or Churcheyardes, if you meane those places that lye next round about the Churches, as they came in with the Monke, they mighte well haue gone out with him, for any profite eyther to the Churche, or common wealth by them. But if you meane as the Greke

worde, whiche is there vsed, signifieth, a fitte place where the bodies of men sleepe, and are bu∣ri〈1 line〉〈1 line〉, attending the tyme of their rising vp agayne in the iaste and generall daye of iudgement, then these Churcheyardes were in the tyme of the Lawe, and in the primitiue Churche in all times, when there was any outwarde pollicie of the Churche, and especially when the Churche had quietnesse and peace; that it mighte without daunger (*) bury their dead in some certayne con∣uenient* 1.70 place therevnto appoynted, whiche was, for feare of the infection commonly, as it maye* 1.71 be gathered, in the fielde out of the Towne, vnto the whiche vse and custome (if it mighte be done* 1.72 cōuemently) it were wel that we were restored, both because it is more safe for the preseruation of the Townes and Cities in their health, as also for that through the superstition, which hath beene of beeing buried rather in the Churche, than in the Churcheyarde, in the Chauncell rather than in the Churche, nearer the highe altar, than further of the remnauntes whereof are in a greate number of mens heartes yet, whiche mighte muche be helped by the bringing in of that custome agayne, of burying the dead in some honest place out of the towne thereto appoynted.

Io. Whitgifte.

I haue tolde you my Author, and if you will not credite one witnesse, you shall* 1.73 haue moe. Denis himselfe dothe testifie it in an Epistle that he writte to Seuerus a Bishop. Damasus sayth the same, so dothe Marianus Scotus, Platina, and o∣thers. Polidor Uirgill dothe something playnely open the matter in these wordes:* 1.74 Circiter annum Domini. 267. Dionisius tam presbyteris vrbis Romae, quàm aliarum gentium tem∣pla, coemiteria & parochias quas dicunt, diuisit: Praeterea Episcopis dioecaeses distribuit, manda∣uit{que}, vt vnusquis{que} suis finibus ac limitibus contentus esset: Parochias (vt hoc demonstremus) nostri appellant singula templa Dioecesis, & eorum territorium certis terminis distinctum. &c. About the. 267. yere of our Lorde, Dionisius deuyded Churches, Churcheyardes, and Parishes (as they call them) aswell to the Priestes of Rome, as of other nations: further∣more he distributed Diocesse vnto Bishops, and commaunded that euery one should con∣tent himselfe with his owne boūdes and limites: our men call Parishes (that we may make this playne) the seuerall Churches of a Diocesse, and their territorie limitted within cer∣tayne boūdes. &c. Wherefore take héede least you cast dust in your owne eyes, & blind your selfe: for this of Denis is not denied of any that I can reade.

Where hath the Lord deuided nationall Churches into parishes and congregations? Why doe you not note the place? or where hath S. Paule the thing, thoughe not the worde or name? or what stories saye, that 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 was taken to be the same that we call nowe a parishe? Héere is muche spoken, but nothing proued.

This Denis was Bishop of Rome about the yere of our Lorde. 263. whiche per∣aduenture* 1.75 you haue not considered. But to put all this matter out of doubte, and to open that (the ignoraunce whereof maketh you so hotte in this matter) there was di∣uerse congregations and Churches in the Apostles time, but yet was there not any limitation of place, or certayne compasse of grounde certaynely appoynted: for that was lefte to the discretion of man to enlarge, or to contracte, as it should be thought from time to time moste conuenient: and who can once imagine or suppose that Christ, or his Apostles did appoynt the limittes of Diocesse or Parishes? or who knoweth it not, that it is in the power of suche as haue authoritie, to enlarge or di∣minishe Dioces or Parishes, as they shall sée it expedient. I knowe nothing to the contrarie, but that the Parishe, whose bondes and limits be but one myle compasse, maye be made ten myle compasse, and contrarywise. It is well sayde of one, that distributio gregis nunc extenditur, nunc coarctatur pro hominis arbitrio: The distribution of a flocke is sometime enlarged, and sometyme made lesse, according to the iudgement of man. And this matter néedeth not to séeme so straunge vnto you, for if you had bin so diligent a reader of the booke of Actes and Monumentes, as you boast your selfe to be, then mighte you haue read there, that the Councell of Nice dyd appoynt to cer∣tayne Bishops the limittes and boundes of their Prouinces and Dioces. But what should I labour in a matter so manyfest?

If by Coemiteria or Churcheyardes those places be ment that be about the churches, where we vse to burie the dead (as it is moste lyke they be) then heare I no reason at all

Why you shoulde in suche maner speake of them, excepte you will plucke downe whatsoeuer hathe beforetyme béene appoynted, be it neuer so auncient, and the vse thereof conuenient and necessarie. There is no doubt but by Coemiteria are ment pla∣ces of buriall, whiche because they haue béene (as you confesse) at all tymes certayne, especially in the peace of the Churche, it is méete that they shoulde so still remayne. And for as muche as the places nowe vsed, if they were appoynted by Denis (as it is moste lyke) are fitly appoynted, and moste conueniently in moste places, you haue alleadged no cause as yet, why they shoulde be remoued, but the selfe same cause, that maye be in lyke manner vsed to remoue the Churche, and whatsoeuer else hathe beene deuised by any man, be it otherwyse neuer so necessarie, conuenient, or comely.

But I will not followe you in these digressions, where you onely spende paper with wordes voyde of proofe. If you quote Eusebius. 7. Lib. 13. to proue that the place of buriall was in the fieldes, there can be no suche thing gathered of his wordes: and if you quote him to proue that the worde signifieth a place of buriall, you goe about to proue that, which no man denieth.

Notes

• * 1.1

  A digression from the matter to the person.
• * 1.2

  How a Pa∣stor ought to be rendent.
• * 1.3

  Rom. 14.
• * 1.4

  Why T. C. slideth from the matter to the person.
• * 1.5

  The oth of the fellowes of Tri. Col. in Cam.
• * 1.6

  The Pastor may be absent vpon occasion
• * 1.7

  Timothie be∣ing a Pastor was absent frō Ephesus.
• * 1.8

  In y^e treatise of Archby∣shops. &c.
• * 1.9

  Tract. 8. Caluine.
• * 1.10

  Lawfull cau∣ses of the pa∣stors absence.
• * 1.11

  Ca.▪ in. 2. Ti. 4.
• * 1.12

  Timothie oft absent from Ephesus.
• * 1.13

  Tract. 8.
• * 1.14

  This is 〈◊◊〉〈◊◊〉 mens conscien∣ces as God.
• * 1.15

  The Pastor may preach 〈◊〉〈◊〉 mo places.
• * 1.16

  Luke. 2.
• * 1.17

  Tract. 4. cap. 1. diuis. 6.
• * 1.18

  The meta∣phores of watchmē and shephards.
• * 1.19

  Luke. 2.
• * 1.20

  20. Actes.
• * 1.21

  Matth. 25.
• * 1.22

  Baptisin mi∣nistred but once in the yeare.
• * 1.23

  A man may profyte them by preaching, whome he knoweth not▪
• * 1.24

  The vsuall obiection of y^e Anabaptists
• * 1.25

  The Pasto〈1 line〉〈1 line〉 may know the estate of the people without a con tinuall abode amongst them
• * 1.26

  Deute. 17.
• * 1.27

  2. Tim. 3.
• * 1.28

  In. 3. Coll.
• * 1.29

  Care〈1 line〉〈1 line〉 〈◊◊〉〈◊◊〉 be not defended.
• * 1.30

  Some 〈◊〉〈◊〉 delight to 〈1 line〉〈1 line〉∣face good 〈◊〉〈◊〉 that doe 〈◊〉〈◊〉 good the〈1 line〉〈1 line〉 ues.
• * 1.31

  1. Tim. 4.
• * 1.32

  Iohn. 10.
• * 1.33

  Act. 20.
• * 1.34

  1. Thes. 2.
• * 1.35

  A man ma∣〈1 line〉〈1 line〉olow the ex∣ample of h〈1 line〉〈1 line〉 that is not 〈1 line〉〈1 line〉l∣wayes present
• * 1.36

  1. Peter. 〈1 line〉〈1 line〉.
• (*) 1.37

  You speake contraries.
• * 1.38

  Aristotle not rightly allea ged.
• * 1.39

  A mā hauyng a priuate charge▪ ought to care for the whole.
• * 1.40

  Luke. 19.
• * 1.41

  Luke. 15.
• * 1.42

  〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉
• * 1.43

  Eph. 6.
• * 1.44

  Ioh. 10. Chrysost. in 3. Colos. Colos. 3.
• * 1.45

  The preacher is called thi∣ther where he may doe most good▪
• * 1.46

  Act. 20.
• * 1.47

  Chrysost. 〈◊〉〈◊〉 3. Col.
• * 1.48

  Tract. 4. ca••▪ diuis. 6. & tract. 5. ca. ••. diuisi. 3.
• * 1.49

  Here you ouer∣throw all your former building▪
• * 1.50

  ••1. Iohn.
• (*) 1.51

  Here you ad∣mit cura••, which is contra∣ry to your forme•• assertion.
• * 1.52

  Pag. 42. &c.
• y 1.53

  Act. 14. 23.
• z 1.54

  Esaie. 5. 8.
• & 1.55

  1. Ti. 1. 14.
• * 1.56

  Pa. 34. lin. 10.
• (*) 1.57

  you mighte haue spoken in the singular num ber, for any pl〈1 line〉〈1 line〉∣ralitie you 〈◊〉〈◊〉 vsed.
• (a) 1.58

  T. C. vseth 〈1 line〉〈1 line〉 most corrupte Councell for his defense.
• * 1.59

  Mat. 6.
• * 1.60

  1. Cor. 7.
• * 1.61

  T. C. allea∣geth the secōd Councell of Nice to dete〈1 line〉〈1 line〉 mine contro∣uersies.
• * 1.62

  The Canon of the seconde Councell of Nice exa∣mined.
• * 1.63

  Caus. 21. q. 1. Clericus.
• (*) 1.64

  An ouersight, for it is in the first Tome.
• * 1.65

  Damasus al∣leaged to a wrong pur∣pose.
• * 1.66

  Distinct. 68.
• * 1.67

  Pag. 50. lin. 〈1 line〉〈1 line〉▪
• * 1.68

  Of the diui∣sion of pari∣shes.
• * 1.69

  Assertions with∣out proofe▪
• * 1.70

  Luke. 7.
• * 1.71

  Euseb. 7.
• * 1.72

  lib. 13.
• * 1.73

  That Denis deuided pa∣rishes.
• * 1.74

  Pol. Virg. lib. 4. c. 9. de in∣uent.
• * 1.75

  How parishes are by man di∣stinguished.