A replie to Iesuit Fishers answere to certain questions propou[n]ded by his most gratious Matie: King Iames By Francis White D: of Div· deane of Carlile, chaplaine to his Matie. Hereunto is annexed, a conference of the right: R:B: of St Dauids wth the same Iesuit*

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A replie to Iesuit Fishers answere to certain questions propou[n]ded by his most gratious Matie: King Iames By Francis White D: of Div· deane of Carlile, chaplaine to his Matie. Hereunto is annexed, a conference of the right: R:B: of St Dauids wth the same Iesuit*
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White, Francis, 1564?-1638.
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London :: Printed by Adam Islip,
1624.
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Subject terms
Fisher, John, 1569-1641 -- Controversial literature -- Early works to 1800.
Church of England -- Apologetic works -- Early works to 1800.
Catholic Church -- Controversial literature -- Early works to 1800.
Cite this Item
"A replie to Iesuit Fishers answere to certain questions propou[n]ded by his most gratious Matie: King Iames By Francis White D: of Div· deane of Carlile, chaplaine to his Matie. Hereunto is annexed, a conference of the right: R:B: of St Dauids wth the same Iesuit*." In the digital collection Early English Books Online. https://name.umdl.umich.edu/A15082.0001.001. University of Michigan Library Digital Collections. Accessed May 24, 2024.

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ANSVVER.

Either you wilfully falsifie, or ignorantly mistake the Pro∣testants Doctrine, concerning vnwrttten Tradition.

First, we admit in generall, all vnwritten Traditions, agreeing with the holy Scripture e, which are deriued from the Apo∣stles, and deliuered vnto vs, by the manifest and perpetuall te∣stimonie of the Primitiue Church f, and by the vniforme con∣sent of succeeding Churches in all ages.

Page 150

Secondly, we beleeue in particular, the historicall Traditions [ A] of the Primatiue, and succeeding Churches, concerning the dignitie, authoritie, perfection, authors, number, and integritie of the bookes of Canonicall Scripture a, and also the Histori∣call Tradition of the said Church, concerning the perpetuall virginitie of the blessed Virgin Marie b, and concerning the baptisme of infants c, and all other genuine Traditions, which maintaine the Faith and Doctrine, contained expressely, or by consequent in the Scripture.

Thirdly, we embrace such exposition of holy Scripture d, as being consonant to the rule of Faith, and to the text of Scripture, is affirmed by antient Tradition, to haue descended from the holy Apostles.

Fourthly, we beleeue the rule of Faith contained in the Apostles Creed e, both vpon the authoritie of Christs written word, and also vpon the voice and testimonie of vnwritten [ C] Tradition.

If it shall then be demanded, Wherefore do the Romists and you so eagrely contend about the question of Traditions? and wherein lies your difference? we answer as followeth.

First, we yeeld the highest and most soueraigne authoritie to [ D] the sacred Scripture f, and make the voice and sentence there∣of a supreame rule, and iudge of supernaturall Veritie; and we make Tradition vnwritten, subordinate, and ministeriall to ho∣ly Scripture, admitting the same so farre forth only, as it is con∣formable to the Scripture, and reiecting the contrarie.

Secondly, we affirme, that the Canonicall Scriprure contai∣neth all supernaturall Veritie necessarie to saluation, and being receiued and vnderstood, is a sufficient and perfect rule of

Page 151

Faith a, and the sole doctrine thereof is sufficient to instruct [ A] the whole Church, and euery member thereof to saluation. And, that Tradition vnwritten maketh no addition, or increase of new Articles of Faith, but is only an helpe and instrument b to deliuer, applie, and interpret the doctrine expresly deliuered, or intended by the holy Ghost, in the Scripture.

Thirdly, we receiue no Tradition as diuine or apostolicall, but such as hath the plaine, manifest, and vniforme testimonie and approbation of the Primatiue Church c. But our Aduer∣saries either equall d, or preferre e vnwritten Tradition be∣fore the Scripture, and they make Tradition a diuers and larger part of the rule of Faith, containing many Articles which are neither expressely, nor inuoluedly reuealed in the Scripture f, and they make the present Roman Church an infallible wit∣nesse of such Tradition, affirming, that we are bound to beleeue [ C] euerie Article, which the said Church g deliuereth as a Tradi∣tion, with the same assurance of Faith, wherewith we beleeue any written testimonie of S. Paul, or the holy Euangelists. And many of them teach, That it is not necessarie to deriue Traditi∣on by a perpetuall descent, and current through all ages; but the voice of the present Church is sufficient to make any Ar∣ticle ctedible and authenticall to vs h.

Lastly, many particularopinions of antient Fathers (which they deliuered coniecturally or probably onely, and concer∣ning which they haue not affirmed, that they were diuine or apostolicall Traditions) are ranked by latter Pontificians in the number of diuine 〈◊〉〈◊〉, and made parts of the vndoubted word of God.

And thus the present Roman doctrine, concerning Traditi∣ons vnwritten, is a Seminarie of Errour, and by pretext hereof, Pontificians obtrude vpon the Church many prophane, fabu∣lous, [ E] and superstitious 〈◊〉〈◊〉, fansies, and nouelties re∣pugnant to holy Scripture, and the antient Catholicke Faith. Let therefore impartiall Readers consider, whether this Ro∣mish doctrine, debasing the sacred Scripture, and aduancing hu∣mane

Page 152

Traditions a tendeth not to the corrupting of Christian [ A] Faith, and consequently, whether the same be not rather a fun∣damentall Errour, than an Orthodoxall Veritie? And on the contrarie, whether the doctrine of the Protestants, maintai∣ning the supreame authoritie of the sacred Scripture (which is Gods vndoubted word) and withall yeelding to genuine Tra∣dition, the credit and honour which the antient Church gaue thereunto, is not fundamentall Veritie, and a soueraigne meanes to preserue right Faith.

Notes

  • e

    Chem. Exam. Concil. Trid. p. 1. d. Trad. pa. 68. Apo∣stoli multa tradide∣runt viua voce. A∣postolici ab Apo∣stolis ex Traditione viuae vocis multa acceperunt quae suis postea discipulis rursus tradiderunt. Sed Ireneus in∣quit [ E] omnia 〈◊〉〈◊〉 fuisse 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 consona Scripturis. Et nos eorum nihil reijcimus, sed omnia quae Scripturis sanctis consentanea sunt, suscipimus & veneramur.

  • f

    Caluin. c. Pighium. d. libero Arb. Non difficulter posset inter 〈◊〉〈◊〉 & Pighium conuenire, si modo Ecclesiae Traditionem ex certo & perpetuo 〈◊〉〈◊〉 & 〈◊◊〉〈◊◊〉, non ex testimonijs hinc inde male 〈◊〉〈◊〉 demonstraret. Gesner. l. sup. loc. Paul. 2. Tim. 3. 16. c. 7. Si 〈◊◊〉〈◊◊〉 Traditiones eadem via per testificationem antiquissimae & Apostolicae Ecclesiae 〈◊〉〈◊〉 nostra vsque tempora, deduxerint, 〈◊〉〈◊〉 eas. Reza ad. Repet. Saint. Resp. pa. 13.

  • a

    Chem. ibid. pa. 69. Et hanc Tradi∣tionem qua nobis in manum dantur sacrae Scripturae li∣bri reuerenter ac∣cipimus. Aug. d. Ci∣uit. Dei, li. 15. c. 23. & d. Doctrina Christ. h. 2. c. 8. &c. Faust. Manich. li. 11. c. 2. D. Fulke c. Rhem. 2. Thess. 2. num. 19. The bookes of the Scripture are giuen by Tradition, but the matter written in the bookes doth iustifie the Tradition to be true.

  • b

    Aug. d. Dogm. Ec∣cles. [ B] c. 69.

  • c

    Aug. d. Gen. ad Lit. li. 10. c. 23.

  • d

    Chem. Exam. p. 74. Quartum ge∣nus Traditionū, est de Expositione, ve∣ro sensu, seu natiua sententia Scriptu∣tae. Tertul. d. praescript. ca. 20. & 21. & 37. &c. Marcion. lib. 4. cap. 5.

  • e

    Chem. ibid. pa. 70. &c. Tertium ge∣nus Traditionum, &c. pa. 74. Descrip∣si haec Symbola vt ostenderem nos non reprobare quas certò constat veras & antiquas esse Apostolorum Traditiones. Aug. d. Fid. & Smbo. c. 1. & Serm. 115. de Temp. Ruff. Expos. Symb. Hier. epist. 61. ad Pammach. c. 9. Cassand. Def. lib. d. Offic. bon. 〈◊〉〈◊〉. pa. 820. Intelligentia Scripturae quae ex Traditione percipitur, non est ab ipsa Scriptura seperanda cum in ea contineatur, vel tanquam definitio in definito, vel tanquam conclusio in praemissis.

  • f

    Thom. Wald. Doctr. fid. li. 2. ar. 2. c. 27. n. 7. Videtis se∣quendum esse in Ecclesia Catholica gradatim authori∣tatem multiplicem Doctorum, scilicet, Cotholicorum omnium: 〈◊〉〈◊〉 sanctorum magis, Ecclesiarum Apostolicarum potiùs & ex eis ampliùs Ro∣manae Ecclesiae: & abundantius his omnibus authoritatem Concilij generalis: nec tamen alicni iàm dictae ita obediendum censea & tàm prona fide, ficut primae fidei Scripturae. Ibid. 〈◊〉〈◊〉. Omnis Ecclesiastica authoritas cum sit ad testificandum de Christo & 〈◊〉〈◊〉 eius, vilior est Christi 〈◊〉〈◊〉, & Scripturis sanctis necessariò post ponenda. Ibid. Longè distat authoritas 〈◊〉〈◊〉, & eminet 〈◊〉〈◊〉 cunctorum Doctorum etiàm to∣tius [ E] Ecclesiae Catholicae, quamuis super cius authoritate Catholica 〈◊〉〈◊〉 Ecclesia.

  • a

    Casland. Def. lib. d. Offic. pij viri. Nemo tam insanus est vt dicat cogniti∣onem salutis non ex diuinis literis, sed ex Taditione 〈◊〉〈◊〉 maiorum hauriendam. Idem. pa. 841. Non quià Canon solus non sibi ad vniuersa sufficiat &c. Jdem pa. 827. Non negamus ex sola Scriptura pe∣ti ceitam definitionem &c. Idem. pag. 832. Illud inter nos conuenit nihil esse huiusmodi non Scriptarum Tra∣ditionum quae non cum eis quae scripta sunt conueniunt atquè adeò in his quae scripta sunt non compre∣hen duntur.

  • b

    Meisner. Consult. c. Lesseum. p. 590. Neque tamèn Traditiones simplicitèr omnes reijci∣mus, sed si quae probatae sunt & à pat. ibus constantèr traditae illas recipimus, non vtfidei mensuram sed vt 〈◊〉〈◊〉 stem temporis & argumentum Historicum. [ B]

  • c

    Hosiand. c. Val. Analys. fid. pa. 126. Si ea Traditiones 〈◊〉〈◊〉 quae in Ecclesia 〈◊〉〈◊〉 fuerunt quaequè, 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉 admittimus.

  • d

    Concil. Trid. sess. 4. Sixt. Senens. Bibl. li. 2. pa. 123.

  • e

    Pigh. contr. Ratisb. lo. 3. Baron. 〈◊〉〈◊〉. tom. 1. anno 57. n. 11. Greg. Val. tom. 3. pa. 347.

  • f

    Bannes sup. Thom. 22. q. 1. ar. 10. Stapl. 〈◊〉〈◊〉. sup. Ioh. 16. Pigh. contr. Ratisb. lo. 3. d. Ecclesia. Sed magna pars, &c. Andrad. Def. Trid. fid. li. 2. Ex Traditionibus nos multa accepisse agnoscimus quae sacris literis non continentur. Greg. Val. Analys. fid. li. 5. ca. 2. & 3.

  • g

    Coster. Enchir. pa. 47. Petr. Soto. Infallibilis est regula, & certa quaecunquè credit tenet & seruat Romana Ecclesia, & in Scripturis [ D] non habentur, illa ab Apostolis 〈◊〉〈◊〉 tradita.

  • h

    Gretsar. Def. Bellarm. d. verb. Dei, li. 4. c. 9. 1713. & 1715.

  • a

    Petrus Soto. Instruct. Sacerdot. part. 1. lect. 6. pag. 17. Quae ad 〈◊〉〈◊〉 pertinent, magis ex Traditione & Spi∣rit' Sancti Illustra∣tione, quam ex Scriptura petenda 〈◊〉〈◊〉. Hosius. d. Ex∣press. verb. Dei, pa. 50. Nō oportet Le∣gis aut Scripturae esse peritum, sed à Deo doctum, vanus est labor, qui Scripturae impenditur. Scriptura enim 〈◊〉〈◊〉 est, & egenum quoddam elementum. Non conuenit Christiano, 〈◊〉〈◊〉 creaturae addictum esse, &c. Pigh. Hieratch. Ec∣cles. [ B] Et nisi hac admissa aut etiam Scripturis praemissa, ne 〈◊〉〈◊〉 quidem authoritatem satis sibi constate, vt quae vniuersa indè dependeat. Qua non adhibita velut plumbeam quandam regulam, &c.

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