A replie to Iesuit Fishers answere to certain questions propou[n]ded by his most gratious Matie: King Iames By Francis White D: of Div· deane of Carlile, chaplaine to his Matie. Hereunto is annexed, a conference of the right: R:B: of St Dauids wth the same Iesuit*

ANSWER.

Whosoeuer abideth in errour ought to reforme.

The Roman Church abideth in errour, Ergo,

The Roman Church ought to reforme. [ C]

The Assumption is manifest, by the repugnancie of Roman Doctrine, against the Faith of the holy Scriptures, and against the Doctrine of the Primatiue Church, which shall hereafter be prooued in euery point of Difference betweene Romists and vs. But as the Synagogue of the Iewes hated reformation, and persisteth in hardnesse of heart to this day, so likewise Baby∣lon will not be healed, Ierem. 51.9.

The Iesuit deliuereth three reasons, why the Romane [ D] Church cannot yeeld to reformation.

The first, is taken from the manifold diuisions of Protestants among themselues, &c. But this Argument (to say nothing of the leading part thereof) is inconsequent: for if Romists erre, then they ought to reforme, whosoeuer they are that admo∣nish them and conuince them of errour. And when the an∣tient Church abounded with Schismes and ruptures a, a meanes was vsed to restore vnitie, to wit, a common submission to free and lawfull Councells, congregated, not by Romane Popes, but [ E] by Christian and religious Emperours b: and these comman∣ded points of Controuersie to bee decided, according to the

rule of holy Scriptures c (as I shall heereafter make manifest [ A] in this Treatise) yea sometimes the doctrine of one sound member of the Church, hath beene a Soueraigne meanes to conuert errants, and consequently to reforme such as were mis∣led by errour. Neither is reformation vnreasonable or impos∣sible, although they which reprooue others, are themselues ex∣orbitant in some things; because the same must bee perfor∣med, not by accomodation to the humor of Reproouers a, but according to the diuine rule, wherein all things are straight and perfect. Lastly, when the Roman Church it selfe is in [ B] Schisme and Combustion (which hapned at the Councell of Constance and Basill, and in the dayes of Antipopes,) shall no re∣formation be required, because the Parties litigant, being of contrarie opinions, the same cannot be proportioned according to euery ones seuerall humour?

The second reason taken from Councells, Customes, &c. is de∣ficient in both the parts. For neither are the Romish doctrines, to wit, Communion in one kind, Popes pardons, Latin Seruice, Purgatorie, Apocryphall Scriptures, Vulgar Translation pre∣ferred before the Originall Text, Transubstantiation, &c. defi∣ned [ C] by any generall Councell, or deriued from the Apostles or Primitiue Church, by custome and vniuersall consent: And later Councells and Customes must giue place to holy Scrip∣ture. Yea according to S. Augustine b, no vnderstanding man did euer make the Councells of Bishops, equall to Sa∣cred Scripture: And some of our learned Aduersaries c confesse, That a generall Councell of Popes, Cardinalls, and Bishops, is not of equall Authority with the Colledge of the Apostles. Others d also of them affirme, That such Coun∣cels are fallible, and subiect to errour.

The third reason wherein it is affirmed, That Protestants for∣saking the common rule of Faith, present the world, with Scrip∣tures vnderstood by priuate Illumination; is grounded vpon a false suggestion: for we assume to our selues no other Illumination than only of ordinarie grace; and we maintaine no other expo∣sition [ E] of Scripture as diuine, but such as is deliuered by the ho∣ly Ghost in the Scripture. And the sence of holy Scripture de∣liuered by the Primitiue Church, is followed by Protestants with farre more respect, than by Romists.

But our Aduerfaries are the men, who dissembling the [ A] same in words, doe in truth maintaine priuate Illumination: For they affirme, That the Bishops of Rome haue infalli∣bilitie of Iudgement, by the immediate inspiration of the Holy Ghost, and not by the studie and meditation of holy Scripture a.

Notes

• a

  Euseb. vita. Constantin. lib. 2. cap. 6. Socrat. Hist. lib. 1. cap. 3. 〈◊〉〈◊〉. Hist. lib. 1. cap. 15. & lib. 6. cap. 25. Chrysoft. sup. 1. cap. Ep. ad Galath. Hanc ob causam deridiculo facti sumus, & Gentibus & Iudaeis, dum Ecclesia in mille partes scinditur.
• b

  Reade heereafter in 〈◊〉〈◊〉 Booke, pa. 151. Zabaril. d. Scys. pa. 542. Olim Im∣perator congregabat Concilium.
• c

  Read. pa. 8. & pag. 37.
• a

  Iren. 〈◊〉〈◊〉. 3. ca. 5. Quis autem medicus volens curare aegrotum, faciet secundum 〈◊〉〈◊〉 aegrotantis & non secundum quod aptum est medici∣nae.
• b

  Aug. c. Do∣nat. post. Collat. ca. 15. Quasi E∣piscoporum Con∣cilia Scripturis Ca∣nonicis fuerint a∣liquando compa∣rata.
• c

  Drieds. d. Dog. Eccles. li. 2. pa. 58. [ D] Generale Concilium, Papae, Cardinalium Episcoporum in Scripturis Propheticis intelligendis & exponen∣dis non est nunc tantae Authoritatis; quantae fuerat olim Apostolorum Collegium.
• d

  Read. pag. 154. & 155. Cusanus, Occham, Panormitan, Almain, forus, Cassander.
• a

  Greg. Val. in 3. p. Tho. Disp. 1. q. 1. punct. 7. §. 41. Siue Pontifex in definicndo, studium adhibeat, 〈◊〉〈◊〉 non adhibeat, modo Controuer∣siam definiat, certè 〈◊〉〈◊〉 definiet. Azor. Instit. Mor. to. 2. lib. 5. cap. 5. q. 3. Si absque Concilio vllo & diligentia rem 〈◊〉〈◊〉, ant 〈◊〉〈◊〉 definiat, Spiritum fanctum sibi assistentem peculiariter habet ne labatur & erret, &c. 〈◊〉〈◊〉; d. sig. Eccles. lib. 16. cap. 10. Scriptura non refertur inter eiusmodi prin∣cipia, quamuis illa sancta & sacra dicatur. Ibid. Siue fidem spectes, sine qua impossibile est placere [ B] Deo, siue Charitatem 〈◊〉〈◊〉 prima est virtus, Non ad libros, sed ad Ecclesiam membraque eius est con∣fugiendum. Ibid. Ipsa Ecclesia propter Arctissimam cum Deo conjunctionem, non veritati inuititur, sed veritas inuititur Ecclesiae. Stapleton, Relect. Contr. 5. q. z. ar. 1. ad. 3. Ecclesia vt corpus & singula membra significat, aedificatur super Apostolos & Prophetas, id est super Doctrinam & praedicationem eorum: Non autem Ecclesia, vt capita & magistros significat. Illorum enim Fundamentum quate∣nus talium, est Spiritus Christi illis promissus, non autem praedicatio quam faciunt, aut Doctrina quam tradunt, pag. 506.