A replie to Iesuit Fishers answere to certain questions propou[n]ded by his most gratious Matie: King Iames By Francis White D: of Div· deane of Carlile, chaplaine to his Matie. Hereunto is annexed, a conference of the right: R:B: of St Dauids wth the same Iesuit*

ANSWER.

It is not certaine at what time Chancells began, neither were all Lay Persons prohibited to enter: for the Emperour had his seate within the Chancell, vntill the dayes of Theo∣dosius [ B] the Elder, as Theoderit a and Sozomene b report.

And although Lay persons were not seated in the Quire or Chancell, yet the Seruice was pronounced by the Ministers in that place, with an audible voyce, so as the people in the bo∣die of the Church heard the same. Iustinian c the Emperour made this Decree following: Wee command that all Bishops and [ C] Priests, (within the Romane Monarchie) shall celebrate the sacred Oblation of the Lords Supper, &c. not in secret, but with a lowd and cleare voyce, that the mindes of the hearers may bee stirred vp with more deuotion to expresse the praises of the Lord God, for so tea∣cheth the Apostle, 1. Cor. 14. Honorius d in gemma Animae, lib. 1. cap. 103. It is reported, that in antient time, when the Canon of the Masse was openly recited, &c. Iohn Billet e, cited by Cassander, saith, In times past, the Masse was pronounced with a lowd voyce: whereupon Lay people knew the same, &c. And mumbling and whis∣pering [ D] in the Masse, is not much more antient than Pope Innocent the third.

The Liturgies also fathered vpon S. Basil, and S. Chrysostome, haue a knowne Mother (to wit, the late Roman Church:) but there is (besides many other iust exceptions) so great dissimili∣tude betweene the supposed Fathers and the Children, that

they rather argue the dishonest dealing of their Mother, than [ A] serue as lawfull witnesses of that which the Aduersarie inten∣deth to prooue by them a.

The Vaile in the Greeke Church, of which S. Chrysostome speakes, Hom. 61. ad Pop. Antioch. was not vsed to depriue the people of hearing, but it was a ceremonie, admonishing, and signifying, that prophane and vncleane persons were vnwor∣thie to behold or pertake the sacred mysteries b. And as this Father sheweth, Hom. 3. in Ephes. c, the drawing open of the [ B] curtaines signified the opening of Heauen, and the descending of Angels at the celebration of the holy Eucharist.

Metrophanes a Monke of Greece d, [ E] in a certaine tractate, te∣stifyeth the forme or vse of the Vaile or Curtaine in the East Church to be, That the Priest may within or vnder the same, prepare aforehand the things requisit for the administration of [ C] the Sacrament: and when this is done, then the Canopie is drawne, at the pronouncing of the holy Creed (which is vttered with a loud voice, euen as all other parts of the Liturgie are, that all people may heare.) Now this action signifieth (according to Dio∣nisius) that God reuealeth these mysteries, to those only which are Orthodoxall in Faith, and hee communicates his diuine grace to none but those which are sound in the diuine worship, and to such all things are manifested, whether men or women, poore or rich, &c. The Iesuit therfore is ignorant of the reason, wherefore the Greeke Church vseth a Canopie, and shutteth [ D] and openeth the same at the holy Communion; for the same was not done to take away audience of any part of the Seruice from lay people (for the whole Liturgie from the beginning to the ending was pronounced with a loud voice) but to ad∣monish and signifie the due preparation which all persons were to vse when they pertake the sacred mysteries.

Notes

• a

  Theod. Hist. Eccl. l. 5. c. 17.
• b

  Sosom. Hist. Eccles. lib. 7. cap. 24. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, &c. Concil. 6. Gene∣ral. Can. 69. apud Caranz. Nulli omnium qui sit in Laicorum numero liceat intra sacrum Altare ingredi. Ab 〈◊〉〈◊〉 tamen nequaquam prohibita potestate & authoritate Regia, quandoquidem voluerit, &c.
• c

  Justin. Imp. 〈◊〉〈◊〉 No. Constit. 123. Iubemus vt omnes Episcopi pariter & Presbyteri, non ta∣cito modo sed clara voce, quae a popu∣lo exaudiatur, 〈◊〉〈◊〉 oblationem, & praeces in Sancto Baptismate adhibi∣tas celebrent, quo maiore exinde de∣uotione in depro∣mendis Domini Dei laudibus, au∣dientium animi ef∣ferantur. Ita enim & D. Apostolus do∣cet dicens in 1. ad Cor. Epist.
• d

  Honor. in Gem. Animae. lib. 1. cap. 103. d. Canon. Fertur dum Canon pri∣mitus publice quotidie recitaretur, ab omnibus per vsum sciretur, & cum eum Pastoresin in agro super panem, & 〈◊〉〈◊〉 dicerent, repente carnem & sanguinem ante se inuenirent, atque inde diuinitus percussi interirent, vnde Synodali Decreto sub Anathemate praeceptum est, vt nullus Canonem dicat, nisi in libro, & in Sacris vestibus, & nisi super altare & super sacrificium.
• e

  Iohn Billet. d. diuin. Offic. Secreta dicitur, quia secreto pronun∣ciatur, cum olim tamen alta voce diceretur, vnde & ab 〈◊〉〈◊〉 bus Laicis sciebatur. Contigit igitur vt quadam die Pastores super lapidem quendam ponerent panem, qui ad horum verborum prolationem, in carnem conuer∣sus est, forsan transubstantiatus est panis in corpus Christi, in quos diuinitus facta est 〈◊〉〈◊〉 vindicta. Nam percussi sunt diuino iuditio caelitus misso, vnde statutum fuit, vt de caetero sub silentio diceretur, velideo ne vi∣leseat, [ E] sicut & sacra Scriptura ne vilescat.
• a

  Read Phil. Morn. d. Miss. & part. lib. 1. cap. 6. pag. 88. tit. Liturgiae huius Saeculi. Claud. Espenc. d. Miss. Priuat. pag. 220.
• b

  Chrys. Hom. 61. ad pop. Antioch. Cum audieris ore∣mus omnes com∣munitèr, cum vela videris retrahi, tūc supernè Coelum aperiri cogita, & Angelos descendere. Sicut itaquè prophanorum fas est adesse neminem, ità nec vllum quidem Sacratorum & Sordidorum, &c. Indigni sunt & oculi 〈◊〉〈◊〉 hisce spectaculis, indignae sunt & aures, si bestia inquit tangat montem lapidabitur.
• c

  Idem. sup. Ephes. Ho. 3. 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉.
• d

  〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉.