A replie vnto M. Hardinges ansvveare by perusinge whereof the discrete, and diligent reader may easily see, the weake, and vnstable groundes of the Romaine religion, whiche of late hath beene accompted Catholique. By Iohn Iewel Bishoppe of Sarisburie.

¶AN ANSVVEARE TO M. Hardinges Preface.

IT misliketh you muche, M. Hardinge, that in so ma∣ny, and sundrie cases by mee mooued, wherin standeth the great∣test force of your Religion, I shoulde saie, You, and others of that parte are vtterly voide, not onely of the Scriptures, but also of the Olde Councelles, and Ancient Fathers, and that in suche an Audience, I should so precisely, & so openly discoouer the wantes, and weakenesse of your side. And therefore, The greatter my heape riseth, the lesse, saie you, is mine aduantage.

Whereunto I may easily replie, The larger is mine Offer, the more wil your discrete Reader mislike the insufficiencie of your Answeare: and the more en∣larged is your libertie, the lesse cause haue you to complaine.

Wise men, ye saie, woulde more haue liked greatter Modestie. Uerily, the men, that you cal Wise, woulde haue thought it greattest Modestie, to haue dissembled, and saide nothinge. But what may the same Wise menne thinke of your Modestie, that hauinge so often made so large, and so liberal offers of so many Doctours, are not hable in the ende to shewe vs one?

Neither looke wee so fiercely, nor shake wee the swearde so terribly, as you reporte vs. This was euermore your, and your felowes special, and peculiar commendation: Who bisides your fierce, and cruel lookes, and bisides the shakinge, and terroure of your swearde, haue also hewen, and cutte, and slaine, and filled your handes with the bloude of your Brethren.

Wherefore, ye shoulde not take it in suche griefe, that, onely for distinctions sake, by so Ciuile, and courteous a name wee cal you our Aduersaries. For, fin∣dinge you armed with Swearde, and Fiere, and embrewed with our Bloude, wée might wel haue spared you some other name. That I saide, Ye haue no suche assurance of the Ancient Fathers, as ye haue borne vs in hande, and as your frendes vpon your credite haue beléeued, I saide it not, neither of Ambition, as you expounde it, nor of Malice: but forced thereto by your importunitie, and with great griefe of minde.

Therefore ye did mee the greatter wronge, to saie, I came vaunting, as Goliath, and throwinge foorth my glooue, like a chalenger, and proclaiminge defiance to al the worlde.

In these woordes, M. Hardinge, Wise menne may finde some wante of your Mo∣destie. For, who so auoucheth the manifest, and knowen Trueth, and saieth, that you bothe haue béene deceiued your selues, and also haue deceiued others, ought not therefore to be called Goliath. And, notwithstandinge you haue aduentured your selfe, to be the Noble Dauid, to conquere this Giante, yet for as muche as ye haue neither Dauids slinge in your hande,* 1.1 nor Dauids stoanes in your scripp••, and therefore not likely to woorke greate maisteries, ye may not looke, that the Ladies of Israel with their Lutes,* 1.2 and Timbrelles wil receiue you in triumphe, or singe before you, Dauid hath conquered his tenne thousandes. He rather is Go∣liath, that setteth his face againste the Heauens, and his foote in Emperours neckes: and openeth his mouthe a wide, to vtter blasphemies: That soundeth out these woordes into al the worlde,* 1.3 I cannot erre: I haue al lawes, bothe Spiritual, and Temporal in my breaste: I am aboue as General Councelles: I may Iudge al men: but al the worlde may not Iudge mee, bee I neuer so wicked: I am Kinge of Kinges, and Lorde of Lordes: I can doo, what so euer Christe him selfe can doo:* 1.4 I am al, and aboue al: Al power is geuen to mee, as wel in Heauen, as in Earthe.* 1.5 Ye knowe, whose woordes these bée,

by whom they are spoken, by whom they are defended, and to whom they are applied. This séemeth to be the very expresse, and liuely Image of Goliath: That Goliath, I saie, whom nowe you sée knockte in the foreheade, and fallinge downe, not with force of worldly power, but onely with that litle roughe despiced stoane of Goddes euerlastinge, and heauenly Woorde. Touchinge that moste woorthy, and learned Father, sometime your Maister, D. Peter Martyr, whom ye would séeme somewhat to commende, not for his Doctrine, from whiche you haue so suddainely fallen awaie, but onely for his modestie: it cannot be doubted, but he, beinge at Poissy in that woorthy assemblie, in the presence of the Kinge, and of other the Princes, and Nobles of that Realme, bothe did, and spake, that might stande with the trueth of the cause, and also might wel become his owne personne. But beinge demaunded his iudgement in these cases, he would haue answeared, euen as wee doo, and woulde muche haue marueiled, that any learned man would saie the contrary. Not longe sithence ye made the Pulpites ringe, that your Masse, and•• al other your whole Doctrine, was assured vnto you by Christe, and his Apostles, and that for the same ye had the vndoubted continu∣ance, and succession of fiftéene hundred yéeres, the consent of al the olde Councels, Doctours, and Fathers, and al Antiquitie, and the Uniuersal allowance of al the worlde. Thus ye doubted not then to saie, without feare of controlment of God, or man. Many thousandes thought ye dealte simply, and woulde not de∣ceiue them: and therefore were easily leadde to beleeue you.

In this case Christian dewtie, and Charitie required, that the trueth, and cer∣taintie of your tales shoulde be opened, that the simple mighte vnderstande, ye had deceiued them, and that of al that your so large talke, and countenance of Anti∣quitie you were, as you wel knowe, vtterly hable to auouche nothinge. Where as it so muche offendeth you, that I shoulde so precisely auouche the Negatiue, and require you to prooue your Affirmatiue, whereof ye woulde séeme so wel as∣sured, it may please you to consider, that S. Gregorie writinge against Iohn the Bishop of Constantinople, that had intitled him selfe the Uniuersal Bishop of the whole world, reasteth him selfe likewise vpon the Negatiue. His woordes be these: Nemo de••essorum meorum hoc superbo vocabulo vti consensit:* 1.6 Nemo Romanorum Po••tificum hoc Singularitatis nomen assumpsit. None of my Predecessours euer consen∣ted to vse this arrogante name: No Bishop of Rome euer tooke vpon him this name of Singularitie. S. Augustine, when he had reckened vp al the Bishoppes of Rome, before his time,* 1.7 added thereto by a Negatiue, In hoc ordine successionis nullus Do∣natista Episcopus inuenitur: In this order of Succession there is founde no Bishop, that was a Donatiste. Yet neither S. Augustine, nor S. Gregorie was euer condemned for Goliath. By the like Negatiue, you, M. Hardinge, your selfe saie, although vn∣truely, as ye doo many other thinges bisides, That neither M. Iuel, nor any one of his side is hable to shewe,* 1.8 that the publique Seruice of the Churche in any nation, was euer for the space of sixe hundred yeeres after Christe, in any other tongue, then in Greeke, or Latine. And yet wée may not therefore cal you, either Goliath, or Thersites, or by any other like vncourteous name. You saie, I take presumptuously vpon mee, to haue readde al thinges, and to be ignorant of nothinge: onely bicause I saie, you in these cases can allege no∣thinge. And why so? Can no man discrie your wantes, and disclose your Un∣truethes, without presumption? You say, ye haue the consent of al Doctours, of al ages, and of al times, of your side, shal wee therefore saie, that you vaunte your selfe of your knowledge? or, that you knowe al thinges, and are ignorante of no∣thinge? You saie, Ye haue al the Doctours. I saie, and true it is, Ye haue not one Doctoure. The difference of these saieinges standeth onely in this, that the one is true, the other vntrue: That your Affirmatiue cannot be prooued: My Nega∣tiue

cannot bee reprooued. But, touchinge vaunte of readinge, and knowledge, there is no difference.

Howe be it, for as muche as, this Negatiue so muche offendeth you of our side, let vs hardly turne it of your side: And let vs saie so, as it may bes••e like you, to haue vs saie: That it cannot appeare, by any sufficient clause, or sentence, either of the Scriptures, or of the Olde Doctours, or of the Ancient Councelles, or by any Example of the Primitiue Churche, either, that the Prieste then receiued the Holy Communion togeather with the people: or, that the Sacrament was then ministred vnto the people vnder bothe kindes: or, that the publique Praiers were euer saide in the Uulgare, or Knowen tongue: or, that the whole people thereto saide, Amen, within the space of sixe hundred yéeres after Christe. Let vs saie further, that Christe him selfe, and al his Apostles saide Priuate Masse, and recei∣ued the Holy Sacramente seuerally alone: That al the Ancient Fathers mini∣stred the halfe Communion onely vnder One Kinde: That al the Common Prai∣ers were euerywhere saide in a strange Learned Tongue, vtterly vnknowen vnto the People. This offer is frée, and liberal. And what can you desire more? But perhaps it shameth you to saie so muche. For, al be it some of you haue of∣ten saide it, yet the vntrueth thereof is manifest, and sheweth it selfe.

Onely ye wishe, I had vsed some greatter Modestie. And woulde you, that I shoulde haue saide, Ye haue one Ancient Doctoure directly, and plainely of your side, and so in that place, and in that presence, for Modesties sake, to haue auouched open Untruethe, as you, and others had donne before? O, M. Hardinge, in these cases a meane waie is no waie. Accursed is that Modestie, that drowneth the Truethe of God. Chrysostome saithe,* 1.9 Veritarem negat, qui cam non liber•• prae∣dicat. He is a renouncer of the Truethe, that dareth not freely to saye the Truethe.

Ye saie, I haue soughte vp certaine smal quaestions of light importance, wherein the Anci∣ent Doctours haue not traueiled, as not daringe to enter into maters of greatter weight. Howe be it, it seemeth ouer muche for you, to limite, and appointe eche man, what he shoulde preache at Paules Crosse. Neither is it muche mate∣rial, whether these maters be Greate, or Smal: but, whether you, by colour of the same, haue deceiued the people.

But woulde ye haue vs nowe at laste beléeue, that your Masse, your Tran∣substantiation, your Real Pres••nce, your Adoration, your Sacrificinge of the Sonne of God, and your Supremacie of Rome be so smal maters? Ye tolde vs not longe sithence, there were no other maters so greate, as these. And may we thinke, that your Religion is nowe greatter, nowe smaller: and increaseth, and vadeth: and waxeth, and waneth, as doothe the Moone? Uerily Pope Nicolas woulde haue ioyned your Transubstantiation to the Crede, and woulde haue made it the Thirteenthe Article of our Faithe. And Pope Boniface the eight saithe,* 1.10 that to be subiecte to the Churche of Rome, is of the necessitie of Saluation. And Pope Nicolas saithe, Who so euer deuieth the Authoritie, and preeminence of that See, is an Heretique.

Notwithstandinge, howe Greate, or Smal these maters be, it forceth not. In déede, you had learned them in very smal time: and, as nowe, ye auouche them with very smal proufes. And, howe smal, and lighte so ••uer you woulde nowe haue them to appeare, yet for the same, ye haue made no smal adoo. No∣thinge ought to be taken for smal, wherewith so greate multitudes of Goddes people maie be deceiued.

The maters, wherewith Christe charged the Phariseis, were not so Greate. Yet Christe saithe vnto them,* 1.11 Ye strayne a g••at, and swalowe a Camel. S. Paule saithe, A little leauen loureth a whole ••umpe of doughe. A heare is smal, yet wee

reade, it hath chokte a bigge man.* 1.12 Plato saithe, Robberie is no lesse in a Smal mater, then in a Greate. The Ciniphes were but smal: yet are they reckened emonge the greate plagues of God. They that firste beganne to maineteine that arro∣gante presumptuous title, of Uniuersal Bishop, whiche nowe the Bishop of Rome chalengeth wholy to him selfe, saide, it was but a Smal mater. But Gre∣gorie saithe,* 1.13 Alia sunt friuola, & innoxia: alia sunt friuola, & noxia: Some thinges are Smal, and doo no hurte: some thinges are Smal, and doo greate hurte. And comparinge the same with the pride of Antichriste, who shoulde cal him selfe, Deus, (that is to saie,* 1.14 God) He saithe thus, Si spectes quantitatem vocis, duae sunt Syllabae: Si pon∣dus iniquitaris, est vniuersa pernicies. Yf ye weigh the quantitie of the woorde, it stan∣deth in two syllables: If the weight of the wickednes, it is an vniuersal destruction.

Though these maters were Smal, yet the Untruethes, and Errours, that thereof haue risen, are not Smal. Remooue the same, and your greattest Reli∣gion wil fal to nothinge. To conclude, if these maters be Greate, they are the more woorthy to be considered: if they be Smal, there is the lesse hurte in leauinge of them, and the more wilfulnesse in defendinge of them: Uerily the whole worlde is weary of them.* 1.15 Christe saieth, Qui in modico iniquus est, & in maiori iniquus est. He that is wicked in the Smal, is also wicked in the Greate.

You saie, VVe flee, and forbeare the Iudgemente of the Learned, and shake out these thinges with greate admiration onely emongest the simple. As Alexander the Kinge of Ma∣cedonia made him selfe a God, and had muche talke of his Father Iuppiter e∣monge the Barbariens: but emongest the Greekes, that were wise, and hable to iudge, and knewe him wel yenough, he was contente to talke of other maters. This comparison, M. Hardinge, is odious, and sauoureth ouer muche of your cho∣ler. Wée hunte not for any Admiration, or opinion of Godheade emonge the peo∣ple. Wée preache not our selues, but Christe Iesus.

But thus the Pharise••s saide of Christe him selfe: These rascalles are accursed, they haue no learninge, they knowe not the Lawe. Emongest them wil he be. There be reigneth like a Prince: There he seeketh to be made a God. Here mighte I eftesones put you in remembrance of him, that hath so longe abused, and mocked the whole worlde, bothe Princes, and Subiectes: as wel learned, as vnlearned: accomptinge them al, as wilde, and barbarous: and hath suffered him selfe openly to be Proclai∣med, and published by the name of God.* 1.16 The woordes be knowen, Dominus De∣us noster Papa: Our Lorde God the Pope. And againe, Constat, Papam à pio Prin∣cipe Constantino Deum appellatum: Et Deum ab hominibus iudicari non posse, mani∣festum est.

Alexander stoode in some awe, and reuerence of the Wise: but this man despi∣seth bothe Wise, and Unwise: Learned, and Unlearned, and al the worlde.

It was somewhat out of season for you, in this place to intreate of the Ualidi∣tie of your Canon, & so earnestly to labour, to prooue it faultelesse, before any man had begonne to touche it, or to prooue it faultie. It is supposed, that some parts thereof was diuised by Leo: and afterwarde augmented by Gelasius: and after that by one,* 1.17 whome S. Gregorie calleth Scholastieus: and after againe by Gre∣gorius him selfe: and that at laste, aboute eighte hundred, and fiftie yéeres after Christe, it was brought to some perfection, and made vp by Pope Sergius. As nowe, it is more closely pronounced, and more reuerently vsed, then either the Epistle, or the Gospel.

But, whether there be any faulte therein, or none, I leaue that to you, M. Hardinge, to be better considered by your selfe. Your Doctour Durande saithe thus,* 1.18 Cùm Sacerdos orauerit pro Hostia Transubstantianda, eam{que} Transubstantiatam Patri obtulerit, orat pro ipsius acceptatione: When the Priest hath praied for the Transub∣stantiation

of the Hoste, and hath offered the same beinge Transubstantiate vnto God the Fa∣ther, afterwarde he praieth, that God wil fauourably accepte it.

S. Paule saithe,* 1.19 Christe is the Mediatour bitweene God, and Man. But here by your Canon contrarywise, the Prieste is made a Mediatour bitweene God,* 1.20 and Christe.

And yowe your selfe, M. Hardinge, at your Masse, and in the highest Secretes of your Canon, desire God the Father, to looke fauourably vpon Iesus Christe his owne Sonne, at your request. Your woordes be plaine, and euident: No inter∣pretation, or shifte is hable to salue them. Nowe yf it be meete, yowe shoulde intreate God the Father to be merciful vnto Christe his Sonne, and to beholde him fauourably for your sake, then maie yowe saie, there is no faulte in al your Canon.

Yowe seeme to complaine, that I leaue out praier for the Deade, and Inuoca∣tion of Sainctes: And that thinge yowe amplifie largely with many woordes. And yet I thinke, yowe woulde not haue vs beleeue, that these pointes of your Religion be greater, then your Sacrifice, or then your Masse.

Uerily, touchinge the first, I hearde once, when yowe your selfe blewe downe the Paper Walles,* 1.21 as ye then called them, and vtterly quenched al the Painted Fiers of Purgatorie. For the other, S. Chrysostome saith, Homines vtuntur Atriensibus. In Deo nihil est tale. Sine mediatore exorabilis est: Menne vse Porters, and Vsshers. But in God there is no sutche thinge. He is easy to be intreated, yea with∣out a Mediatour.* 1.22 Againe he saithe, Nihil tibi opus est Patronis apud Deum. Neque enim tam facile Deus audit, si alij pro nobis orent, quàm si ipsi oremus, etsi pleni simus omnibus malis:* 1.23 Thowe needest no Attourney to speake to God. For God dooth not so soone heare vs, when others praie for vs, as when wee praie for our selues: Yea although wee be ful of al sinne. S. Ambrose likewise saithe, Isti se non putant reos, qui honorem no∣minis Dei deferunt Creaturae, &, relicto Domino,* 1.24 conseruos adorant. Nam & ideo ad Reges per Tribunos, & Comites itur: quia homo vti{que} est Rex, & nescit, quibus debeat Rempublicam credere. Ad Deum autem, quem nihil later, omnium enim merita nouit, ad promerendum suffragatore non est opus, sed mente deuota. Vbicunque enim talis ••o∣quutus fuerit ei, respondebit illi: These menne thinke, they doo no il, geuinge the honoure of God vnto à Creature, and leauinge the Lorde, adoure their felowe seruantes. For therefore wee haue accesse to Kinges by Knightes, and Marshalles, for that the Kinge is a mortal man, and knoweth not, to whom he may commit his Kingedome. But God knoweth al mennes me∣rites, and there is nothinge priuie from him. Therefore to obteine his fauoure, wee neede no Spokesman, but a deuoute minde. Where so euer suche a one shal speake, God wil an∣sweare him.

Where as ye vntruely say, we laie on loade of sclaunders, to deface the Churche, yowe maie remember, that there were sometime that charged S. Steuen, S. Paul, and Christe him selfe in like sorte, for that they seemed, likewise to speake vnreue∣rently against the Churche. And against the Prophete Hieremie, they cried out, euen as yowe doo nowe,* 1.25 The Temple of God: the Temple of God.

But he defaceth not the Churche, that defaceth the defacers fo the Churche: and wipeth of the soile of your Errours, that her face maie shine, and appeare more glorious. When Christe moourned ouer the Citie, and Temple of Hierusa∣lem: or when he saide, Ye haue made my Fathers howse a denne of theeues: And, when Esai saide, O howe is this bewtieful Citie (that then was the Churche of God) become an harlot? Or,* 1.26 when the Prophete Hieremie saide,* 1.27 Who wil geue abundance of Water vnto myne eies, that I maie moourne daie, and night for the sinnes of my people, Wée maie not thinke, that Christe, Esai, & Hieremie were defacers of the Churche. He hindereth not healthe, that sheweth the disease. He despiseth not the Churche, that setteth Christe before the Churche. The Churche is our Mother: But Christe

saithe,* 1.28 Who so loueth his Father, or Mother more then mee, is not meete to be my Disci∣ple. He despiseth not his Mother, that lamenteth the Captiuitie of his Mother, and deliuereth her from the handes of théeues.

But wee haue set vp Aultar against Aultar: Or rather, as yowe saie, Wee haue ouer∣thowen Aultars, and al togeather: And so haue erected a Newe Churche, a Newe Gospel, and a Newe Religion of our owne. Uerily, M. Hardinge, wée haue ouerthrowen nothinge, but that Goddes good wil was, should be ouerthrowen. Christe saithe,* 1.29 Euery Plante, that my Heauenly Father hath not planted, shalbe rooted vp. An Aultar wée haue, suche as Christe, and his Apostles, and other Holy Fathers had, whiche of the Greekes was called 〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉〈 in non-Latin alphabet 〉, The holy Table: And of the La∣tines, Mensa Dominica, The Table of the Lorde: And was made, not of stoane, but of Timber: and stoode, not at the ende of the quéer, but in the middest of the People, as many waies it maie appeare: And other, or better Aultar, then Christe, and these holy Fathers had, wee desire to haue none: & specially any suche Aultar, as hath benne purposely sette, vp against the Aultar of Christe.

But yowe of your side,* 1.30 haue saide, Here is Christe, and there is Christe: And so haue erected vp, not onely Aultar against Aultar: and Churche against Churche: but also Christe against Christe.* 1.31 So Leo seemeth to saie of yowe, Ecclesiae nomine ar∣mamini: sed contra Ecclesiam dimicatis: Ye arme your selues with the name of the Churche: And yet ye fight against the Churche. So saithe Nazianzene, Ye striue for Christe, against Christe him selfe.

But yowe seeme▪ to set light of myne age, and to dishable my knowledge in Diuinitie: as thoughe it were muche: pertinente vnto these maters, either to calcu∣late myne age, or els to examine the order of my studie. I maie saie with Origen, Gratias ago Deo, quod ignorantiam meam non ignoro: I thanke God, that I am not igno∣rante of myne ignorance. But, what so euer want either is, or is surmised to be in mée, it ought not to preiudice the Trueth of God.

And yet I sée no greate cause, why any man should séeke so greately to disad∣uantage mée in respecte of myne age, or studie. For it is wel knowen, that I, al∣though vnwoorthy of that degrée,* 1.32 proceded Bachelare in Diuinitie in the Uni∣uersitie of Oxforde one whole yeere, and more before M. Hardinge. In deede, I graunte, I coulde not reade al the Councelles, and Olde Fathers of the Churche, bothe Greekes, and Latines; in seuen daies, as M. Hardinge coulde. And yet, so muche had I readde, that I marueiled, M. Hardinge woulde euer enterprise, so muche to abuse the names of the holy Fathers.

But knowledge oftentimes is vaine, and puffeth vp the minde. God make vs learned to the Kingedome of God, that wée maie humble al our knowledge to the obedience of Faithe.

It reioiceth mee mutche, that ye saie, ye loue mée, and in respecte of our olde frendship, and loue haue thus written to mée. Howe be it, our olde priuate fren∣ship néedid not so many publique witnesses. Ye saie, Ye wil folowe the later parte of Chiloes Counsel, Oderis, tanquam amaturus: Hate so, as afterwarde thowe maiste loue.

Bytweene whiche your two saieinges, of hatinge, and louinge, I knowe not howe, yowe include a plaine contradiction: Onlesse ye wil saie, Ye can hate, and loue in one respecte bothe togeather. But I take it in the best sense, wherein, I doubt not, but ye meante it.

Howe be it, touchinge your frendly aduise, I maie answeare yowe likewise, with an other péece of Chiloes Counsel: Obsequendum est amico•• vsque ad aras: A man maie folowe his frendes Counsel, so it be not, either against God, or against his Con∣science. * 1.33 The people of Alexandria saide vnto Timotheus, E••si non communica∣mus tecum, tamen amamus t••: Although wee Communicate not with yowe, yet wee loue

yowe notwithstandinge. Ye promisse to deale herein, without either gal, or bitternesse: For that, as yowe saie, Glikes, Nippes, and Scoffes, Bittes, Cuttes, and Gyrdes (these be your woordes) becomme not your stage. And doubtelesse, sutche kinde of dealinge, as it is moste commendable in it selfe, so it seemeth moste sitting for them, that traueile in Goddes causes.* 1.34 Christe saithe, Learne of mee, for I am meeke, and gentle.

But whoes woordes then be these, M. Hardinge? From what Sprite haue they procéeded? Upon what stage were they spoken? These woordes, I saie, wherewith ye seeme so mutche, & so often to solace your selfe, & to refreasshe your Sprites:* 1.35 Goliath, Thersites, Rasshe, Presumptuous, VVicked, Vnlearned, Ignorant, Peeuishe, Lu∣cians, Scoffers, Coggers, Foisters, Pear••e, Insolente, Vaunters, Braggers, Sectaries, Schismatiques, Heretiques, Sacramentaries, Newe maisters, Newe Fanglers, False reporters, Sclaunderers of the Churche, Terrible seducers, The Enimies of the Sacrifice, The Enimies of the Churche, The Mini∣sters of the Diuel, Sitters in the Chaire of Pestilence, Monsters, Heathens, Publicanes, Turkes, Infidelles, Antichristes, and Forerenners of Antichriste?

These woordes be yours, M. Hardinge, not onely, for that they be vttered by yowe, but also, for that they perteine directely, and properly vnto your selfe. With these, and other like pearles ye haue thorowly besette your whole Booke, that it might the more glitter in the eie of your Reader. Herewith your stage is fully freight. Some man woulde thinke it were Vetus Comoedia. So faitheful ye seeme to be in kéepinge your promise. Yf ye vtter sutche woordes of pure loue, and frendship, what then maie wée looke for, yf ye once beginne to hate? They say, the Scorpion embraceth louingely with his feete: but smiteth his poison with his taile. Thus ye suffer the tēpestes of your affections sometimes to blowe you oute, and to tosse yowe of from the shoare. In a man of professed grauitie reasons had benne more conueniente, then reproches. Sutche eloquence might better becomme some of your yonger Iannizers: who, as their frendes saie here, haue not yet lear∣ned, to speake otherwise.

As for these woordes, and these stages, they maie not wel chas•• vs awaie from the Gospel of Christe. Yt is not needeful for vs, to heare your good reportes: but it is most needeful for vs, to speake the Trueth.

The aduertisement, that yow allege out of Salomon (There is a waie, that vnto a man seemeth right: but the ende thereof leadeth to damnation) is common, & toucheth vs bothe, aswel yowe, as mee: or rather, somewhat more yowe, then mee. Ye were once deceiued before, by your owne confession. But they, that haue indifferently weighed the causes, and suddainesse of your change, haue thought, ye are as mutche, or rather mutche more deceiued nowe.

Marke, I beséeche yowe, M. Hardinge, what ye were lately, and what ye woulde nowe seeme to be: what waie ye trodde then: and what waie ye ••reade nowe. The difference is no lesse, then is bitweene Light, and Darknesse: Life, and Deathe: Heauen, & Hel▪ So greate a change would require some good time of deliberation.

But if ye be thorowly changed, as yow saie, and if ye be touched in deede, either with the•• zele of God, or with the loue of your brethren, be not then ashamed to telle vs, what thinges God hath donne for yowe. Let your Reader vnderstande, that yow your selfe sometime were that man, of whom Salomon speaketh: That yow sometime were in a waie, that seemed right, and yet the ende thereof leadde to damnation: That yow sometime bent your whole harte, and studie to deface the Churche of God: That yow preached so many yeeres togeather directly contrary to your conscience: That yow sometime witingly, and willingly, and of purpose, and malice, deceiued Goddes people: That yow sometime were the Minister of the Diuel▪ a Turke, an Heathen, an Infidel, a Forerenner of Antichriste: and, that

from this rueful state ye were suddainely changed, not by readinge, or conference of the Scriptures, or Anciente Fathers, but onely for that ye sawe, the Prince was changed.

Thus must ye deale, M. Hardinge, yf ye deale truely. So wil your frendes thinke, ye dissemble not nowe, as yow did before: but are mooued onely of true zele, & pure conscience. Certainely either, as wee saie, ye are nowe deceiued: or, at the leaste, as your selfe must needes graunte, not longe sithence, ye were deceiued. And S. Augustine saithe, Hoc est erroris proprium, vt, quod cui{que} displicet, id aliis quoque oportere existimet displicere:* 1.36 This is the very nature of Errour, that, what so euer misliketh any man, he thinketh al others shoulde likewise mislike the same.

Sutche is the miserie of Adams children: their harte is euermore inclined vnto il, and errour. Hereof false prophetes oftentimes take occasion to saie, Good is Il, and Il is Good: Light is Darknesse, and Darknesse is Light. And oftentimes the people is wilfully leadde awaie, and cannot abide to heare sounde Doctrine: but turneth their eares to heare Fables.

Therefore, Salomons counsel is wise, and good. And for that cause wee truste not our owne eies, to choose our waie: but wee calle vnto God with the Prophete Dauid,* 1.37 O Lorde, shewe vs the waie, that wee maie walke in: Wee seeke vnto him, that saithe,* 1.38 I am the Waie, the Trueth, and the Life: I am the Light of the World: who so foloweth mee,* 1.39 walketh not in darknesse, but hath the Light of Life. And wee thanke God, that with his Daiespringe from aboue hath visited vs, and directed our feete into the waie of peace: into the same waie, that Christe hath shewed vs, and the holy Apostles, and anciente Catholique Fathers haue trodden before vs.

Touchinge your exhortation to humilitie, and the denieal of my learninge, whiche, I trust, of your parte proceedeth from a meeke, and humble sprite, I maie safely denie that thinge, that I neuer auouched. It cannot shame mee to saie, that S. Hierome saide, Dicam illud Socraticum, Hoc tantùm scio, quòd nihil scio:* 1.40 I wil saie, as Socrates sometime saide, This thinge onely I knowe, that I knowe nothinge. In these cases, as I séeke no praise, so I feare no reproche. What so euer wante is in mee, there be others, that can supplie it. How be it, I neuer vnderstoode, but Ueritie, and Humilitie might wel stande togeather.

Where yow saie, what so euer skil, or knowledge I haue, or had, I haue euer∣more bente it onely to the reproche, and sclaunder of the Churche, it is no greate maisterie, M. Hardinge, to speake il. But I trust, God him selfe, that iudgeth iustly, iudgeth otherwise. Yf there be in mee, I say not, any talente, but onely any mite of a talente, my praier vnto God is, and euer was, it maie be bestowed wholy to the honoure, and comforte of his Churche.

And yet maie not yow, M. Hardinge, neither sette sutche stoare by your selfe, nor so mutche abase, and discredite others, as though bisides yow, & your felowes, there were noman méete to be counted learned. When the Iewes, in contempte of al others, boasted them selues to be the onely stocke, and Bloud of Abraham, S. Paule by an humble kinde of presumption doubted not in al respectes to compare with them in this wise:* 1.41 Hebrewes they be: and so am I. Israelites they be: and so am I. The seede of Abraham they be: and so am I. Againe he saith, Thus doo I, and thus wil I doo, that in the thinges, whereof they glorie, they maie be founde to be, as wee are.

I wil force this comparison no further. Sutche contention is but vaine. O M. Hardinge, this saieinge is common vnto vs bothe: By the Grace of God wee are, that wee are. O that his grace be not in vs in vaine.* 1.42

For my parte, bothe at your requeste, and also without your requeste, I vt∣terly denie my learninge. And touchinge my Bishoprike, yf that in any parte hap∣pen to gréeue you, I denie it too: I denie myne estimation: I denie my name: I

denie mée selfe. Onely the Faithe of Christe, and the Truethe of God I cannot denie. Or with this Faithe, or for this Faithe, I truste, I shal ende. I cannot withstande the Sprite of God. I cannot saie, the consente of al the Auncient Ca∣tholique Fathers was an heape of errours, and a linke of Heresies. Although you, M. Hardinge, coulde denie al togeather at an instante, and vpon the suddaine, yet beare with others, that cannot so easily doo the same.

Touchinge D. Fisher, I scoffed neither at him, nor at any others. Onely I laide out the imperfection of certaine their Argumentes: whiche if they were weake, & many waies faultie, the faulte was not mine: I made them not. D. Fi∣shers Argumente was this:* 1.43 We are sure, there is Purgatorie: Ergo, the Popes pardonnes be good, and available. I shal be forced in perusinge your Booke, to disclose many like infirmities, and folies in your Argumentes, M. Hardinge. Yet notwithstan∣dinge I wil not scoffe. But happy are you, that may cal vs Gospellers, Newe Maisters, Patriarkes, and, I knowe not what, and to write, what you liste, without scoffinge. In the ende of your foretalke, whiche is before the shewinge of your Booke, ye thinke al the worlde singeth Sanctus, Sanctus, and receiueth you with Ozanna. And therefore ye wil euery bodie to come, and subscribe. How be it, it séemeth, this request is very suddaine & out of season. You should first haue shewed vs, bothe whereunto wée shoulde subscribe, and also your Authorities, and Rea∣sons, wherewith ye would force vs to subscribe. But y^e olde learned Father Ter∣tullian saith thus of the Ualentinian Heretiques:* 1.44 Habent artificium, quo priùs persuadent, quàm doceant. Veritas autē docendo suadet, non suadendo docet. These Heretiques haue a kinde of cunninge, and a policie, whereby they persuade vs firste, and teache vs afterwarde. But the Trueth persuadeth vs by teachinge: and not teacheth vs by per∣suadinge.

Kinge Agesilaus, the better to embolden his Souldiers to the fight, with a cer∣taine iuice wrote this woorde, Victorie, in the palme of his hande: and afterwarde beinge at his Seruice, as the manner then of the Heathens was, he laide his hande so written closely, & secretely vpon the harte of the Sacrifice, & so printed it with the saide woorde, Victorie: and immediatly shewed the same vnto his Captaines, and Souldiers, as if it had beene written by the Goddes. The simple Souldiers, not vnderstanding this policie, and thinkinge, the whole mater had in deede béene wrought by miracle, grewe full of courage, not doubtinge, but their Goddes, that had written, Victorie, woulde also geue them Victorie.

By like policie, and to like purpose, it séemeth, you, M. Hardinge, would beguile your Reader: and, that you lacke in strength, woulde winne by policie: and, that you wante in Reasons, woulde gaine in woordes: that the simple may thinke, you haue the Victorie, bicause you haue written, Victorie, with your penne.

But you are not yet equal with the credite of Pythagoras. It is not sufficient for your scholars to say, Ipse dixit: M. Hardinge hath saide it. Euery man wil not thinke it is so, bicause you can write it, or Printe it, or say, it is so. As for mée selfe, I wil saie with S. Hierome, Cupio discere, & Discipulum me profiteor, dummod•• doceant. I woulde faine learne, and make a vowe to be their Scholar, so they would teache mee. Firste ye shoulde haue geuen vs leaue, to haue perused your whole Booke. And when we had wel weighed your vntrue Allegations, your vaine Constructi∣ons, your Newe petite Doctours, your Corruptions, your Forgeries, your Dreames, your Fables, and the huge multitude of your vntruethes, then hardly ye shoulde haue called vs, to subscribe.

How be it, M. Hardinge, this is no force sufficient to subdewe the world. It was not thought, ye had benne so weakely appointed. It is not yenough for yow, thus odiously to vpbraide vs in your anger, and to calle vs Newe Maisters,

and Heretiques. That lesson might haue serued you longe agoe, before ye were espied. It behooueth yow now, to haue some stronger argumentes, specially figh∣tinge against God.

For my parte, notwithstandinge I were thorowly persuaded longe before, yet am I nowe some deale the more satisfied by these your traueiles. For, touching your wante of Scriptures, Councelles, Doctours, and Examples of the Primitiue Churche, I am wel, and fully confirmed by the sclendernes of your proufes.

And I doubte not, but some of these, that now be aboute you, beinge, I trust, not frowardly carried awaie with wilful malice, but hauinge the feare of God, and a reuerente zele to doo the best, although perhaps not knowledge sufficiente, to iudge, what is best, after they shal vnderstande some parte of your dealinge herein, wil by Goddes Grace beginne, somewhat to forethinke them selues of their iour∣ney, * 1.45 & to caste some doubtes of your credite. S. Augustine saith, Iuris forensis est, vt qui in precibus mentitus sit, illi ne profit, quod impetrauit: The Lawe is this, that, who so hath made a false suggestion, shal lose, what so euer he haue gotten by the same.

O M. Hardinge, Credite without trueth, is no credite. Your woorke is ouer weake: It hath no fundation: It cannot stande. Chrysostome telleth you, Sutche is the Nature of Errour:* 1.46 It vadeth of it selfe, and wil comme to grounde without resistance. Remember the place, ye sometime stoode in: Remember, from whence ye are fallen: Remember the causes of your fal. It is no shame to rise againe.* 1.47 God is able to restoare yow. The wise man saith, There is confusion, that bringeth grace, and glorie. God hath endewed yow largely with greate giftes.

Turne the same to the obedience of the Faith of Christe. As there is wisedome in séekinge the Victorie, so there is wisedome in geuinge place. Folowe the same Counsel, ye geue others. Denie your owne learninge: denie your owne estima∣tion: denie your selfe.* 1.48 Geue the glorie vnto God.

FINIS.

Notes

• * 1.1

  Extra. De Con∣stitu. Licet.
• * 1.2

  De Electio. & Elect. potestate. Significasti. 9. quae. 3. Nemo.
• * 1.3

  De Maioritate, & Obedientia: Vnam Sanctam.
• * 1.4

  In glosa.
• * 1.5

  In Concil. Late∣ran. Sub Iulio.
• * 1.6

  Lib. 4. epist. 32.
• * 1.7

  August. epis. 165.
• * 1.8

  In the 3. Arti∣cle, and in the 15. Diuision.
• * 1.9

  11. quaest. 3. Nolite.
• * 1.10

  Extra. de Maio∣rita & Obedi. Vnam Sanctam. Dist. 22. Omnes.
• * 1.11

  Matthae. 23. 1. Corin. ••.
• * 1.12

  The Ca∣non.
• * 1.13

  Gregor. lib. 6. epist. 30.
• * 1.14

  Ibidem.
• * 1.15

  Luke. 16.
• * 1.16

  Extra. 10. 22. Cum inter. In Glosa. Dist. 96. Satis euidenter.
• * 1.17

  Gregor. lib. 7. epist. 63.
• * 1.18

  Durand. libro 4. parte 2.
• * 1.19

  1. Timoth. 2.
• * 1.20

  The Prieste a Mediatour by∣tweene God, and Christe.
• * 1.21

  In a Sermon preached in S. Maries Churche in Oxforde.
• * 1.22

  Chrysostom. De Poeniten. hom. 4.
• * 1.23

  Chrysostom. De profectu Euan∣gelij.
• * 1.24

  Ambros. in. 1. cap. ad Roman.
• * 1.25

  Hieremi. 7.
• * 1.26

  Esai. 1.
• * 1.27

  Hieremi. 9.
• * 1.28

  Matth. 10.
• * 1.29

  Matthae. 15.
• * 1.30

  Matth. 26.
• * 1.31

  Leo in Epist. ad Palaestinos. Naziaenzenus In Apologetico.
• * 1.32

  Anno Domini 1551. anno Eduardi. 6. quinto.
• * 1.33

  Liberatus. cap. 16.
• * 1.34

  Matthae. 11.
• * 1.35

  Termes vsed commonly by M. Hardinge through his whole Booke.
• * 1.36

  Augustin. De Gene. contra Manichae.
• * 1.37

  Psalm. 142.
• * 1.38

  Iohan. 14.
• * 1.39

  Iohan. 8.
• * 1.40

  Hierony. in prae∣fa. in Abdiam.
• * 1.41

  2. Corin. 11.
• * 1.42

  1. Corin. 15.
• * 1.43

  Polydor. de In∣uent. rer. li. 8. c. 1.
• * 1.44

  Tertull. aduer∣sus Valētinian. lib. 1.
• * 1.45

  Augustin. in Iohan. tract. 7.
• * 1.46

  Chrysostom. de Laudibus Pauli hom▪ 5.
• * 1.47

  Ecclesi 4.
• * 1.48

  Iohan. 9.