Of the torments of Hell: the foundation and pillars thereof discovered, searched, shaken, and removed. ...

Ten Opinions of the Learned, of the Places of Hell.

1. Mr. Edw. Leith, Hugo, and others say, Hell is a Bot|tomless Pit; but there is no Place without a Bottom which is the Earth.

2. It is generally agreed, That Hell is in the lower Parts of the Earth, but where these lower Parts should be, Mr. Perkins on the Creed, saith, No Man is able to define; the lower Parts of the Earth is great Abasement, saith Dr. Fulk on Phil. 2.7. The lowest Degree of Christ's Humi|liation, Eph. 4.10. one part of the Earth is not put in Opposition to another Part thereof, but to Heaven, Psal. 103.13. David saith, Thou had fashioned me in the lowest Parts of the Earth, Psal. 139.15. Was David born in Hell?

3. Bishop Bilson, Mr. Wheatly, and others, say, Hell is below, but how many Miles it is to Hell they do not say, nor cannot tell.

4. Bellarmin, Lyria, and others, say, Hell is in the Earth near the Centre hereof; if so, ye may know how far it is to Hell, the Earth being round, the Circumference there|of being Twenty one thousand and six hundred Miles: The whole consisting of 360 Degrees, at 60 Miles a De|gree, the Diametet of the Terrestrial Globe is Six thousand seven hundred and eighty two Miles, and one Eleventh; so there to the Centre or middle Point, is Three thousand three hundred and ninety Miles and half at Length deep into the Earth to Hell; but in the Day of Judgment, when the Earth shall be consumed with Fire, as 1 Pet. 3.7. where shall Hell be? Then it cannot be in the Center of the Earth when there is no Earth.

5. Mr. Leigh and others, say, Hell is a Lake; the Lake is a Sea, as appears Luke 5.1,2. where the Swine were

choaked, Luke 8.33. whose common Death is not half a Mile; Men seek Hell in the Bottom of the Sea, because they know not where to find it. Hell cannot be the Lake, because Hell was cast into the Lake, Rev. 20.14.

6. Others say, Hell is in the Air, the Devil is the Prince that ruleth in the Air, Eph. 2.6. the Air then is the Devil's Hell, saith Willet Synops. pag. 1018. if so, then all we that are alive are in Hell; we do find it not a Place of so great Torment, for almost all Men like it well, for there they desire to dwell.

7. Others say, Hell is Above, near the Third Heavens, within the View of the glorious Saints, and alledge for it, Isa. 66.42. Rev. 14.10. if so, it is very far to Hell: Astronomers say, that there are three Heavens above the Firmament, where the Fixed Stars are, is a Hundred and sixteen Millions of Miles above the Earth, which is so high, that if a Stone or Weight should fall from thence, and continue falling an hundred and fifty Miles an Hour, it would be Eighty-eight Years, two Weeks, four Days, five Hours, and twenty Minutes a falling down to the Earth.

8. Some say, the Absence of God's Face is Hell, but that is not called Hell, but Wrath, Isa. 54.8. This was Cain's Punishment, from thy face shall I be hid: my punishment is greater than I can bear, Gen. 4.13,15. The hiding of God's Face causeth Sadness, and the breaking of the Bones of Comfort, Psal. 5.81. Behold his eye-lids try the children of men, Psal. 11.4. if shut they are troubled, if open they are comforted.

9. Some say, Hell is in this Life, and is a guilty accusing Conscience: Dr. Willet saith, A guilty troubled Conscience is a Hell and Prison of the Soul; what may rather be called Hell than Anguish of Soul: The Judges Tribunal is in the Soul, God sitteth there as Judge, the Conscience is the Accuser, Fear is the Tormentor, Guilt in the Soul wounds the Spirit, A wounded spirit who can bear? Prov. 18.14. they the spirits in prison, 1 Pet. 3.1,9. this is the wrath of God that abideth upon him that believeth not in the Son, John 3.16. Heaven is God's Face and Presence, and our great|est Joy in this Life, Exod. 33.15,16. and so will be the next, Psal. 17.5. Thou wilt fill me with the joy of thy face, in thy presence is fulness of joy, Acts 2.18. Pleasures or Plea|santness, that is, pleasant Joys at thy right Hand, in the full Enjoyment of thee, are sweet Delights eternal.

Some say Hell is a local Place, Augustine saith, it is not a Place; Doctor Willet saith the Place of Hell maketh not the Torments; it is a Question, saith he, whether the Place make Hell, or the Absence of the Presence of God, Synops. Page 1056.

10. Another saith, it is in the other Side of the blue Cloud that appeareth to us in the Air; others say, where the Place of Hell is, they cannot tell; whether it be in the Earth or in the Water, or in the Air, it is not re|vealed, saith Greenwood; they that have taken Pains to find it out are as far from it as ever; some of the Ministers of France affirm, that Father Cotton, the Jesuit did enquire of the Devil for a plain Place of Scripture to prove Pur|gatory, so they are at as great Loss to prove Hell by a plain Place of Scripture truly translated, their Hell of Torments never to end. Also the learned agree not upon which Scripture to ground their Hell Torments upon; for that Place one of them alledge to prove it, another of themselves deny it, that it is so to be understood. Mr. Ainsw. on Psal. 10.16. saith, that Place through Custom is taken for the Place of the Damned, but is not so to be understood, the Word being Sheol: Marolat on Apoc. Pag. 282. saith, the Fire of Gehenna is the Place of the Dam|ned, others of them deny it; M. Leigh saith Dives proves it, Dr. Fulk and others deny it.

See ye not the great Doubting and Uncertainty they are at among themselves? They grope in the Dark with|out Light, Job. 22.5. by their reeling, staggering, and stumbling, that they are so drunk they can find no Ground to stand upon; they understand not whereof they affirm, yet each of them hugs his own Apprehension. It is very strange, that in a thing so signal, of which they say they see it in the Word of God, that they can no Way agree concerning it. O ye learned in the seven liberal Sciences, tell us how to reconcile these things in Point of Truth; or tell us in as much as ye speak Contraries, as yea and nay, which of you we are to believe. Have we not all cause to say herein, Where is the Scribe? where is the dis|puter of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world, 1 Cor. 1.20. he frustrateth the tokens of liars, and makes diviners mad, and turneth wise men backward, and maketh their knowledge Foolishness, Isaiah 44.25.

Mr. Edward Leigh, Esq and Master of Magdalen-Hall in Oxford, presents his Reasons to prove Hell-Torments or

Punishment after this Life for some to endure, never to End; let them be considered, Prov. 18.17. Mr. Leigh saith, the Conscience of Man hath a Fear of some Punishment after this Life, proves it.

Answ. If they have, that doth not prove it; because the Conscience of Men are as they are instructed, according to the Proverb, Such Docter, such Scholar; hence it is, that the Conscience of a Papist tells him it is not lawful to eat Flesh in Lent, not of a Friday. And whoso killeth you will think he doth God good service, Joh. 16.2. that is his Con|science, the Consciences of some Men are almost, if not altogether, for some Evil; therefore that proves it not.

Mr. Leigh, the Heathen, held there was a Hell, a Being and Place for wicked Men after this Life.

Answ. Why did ye not say and prove, that they hold that they shall be in Torment never to an end.

The Heathens do not believe, that there is to be such a Punishment after this Life, for they deny the Resurrection of the Body, therefore they burn the Body and save the Ashes in an Urn for a Memorial; they believe as Pythago|ras the Philosopher taught, that the Soui goeth from one Body into another Man or Beast; that some of the Philo|sohers grew so tender, that they would not kill any Beast nor Fowl, for they said, it may be, it is my Brother or my Sister. These Heathen Greek Poets were long before the coming of Christ; in their treble Division of the World they fain three Gods. Jupiter the God of Heaven, Nep|tune the God of the Sea, and Pluto the God of the Earth, in which they say he keeps his Court and Palace, (no word of Torment, that would make it a poor Court and Palace) so Homer and Noninus, Greek Poets; Homer wrote of the De|struction of Troy, which was near a thousand Years before the Birth of Christ; Homer is one of the most ancient Re|cords extant; it seems in his time there was no mention of a Hell of Torments never to end, the said Poets call Pluto Summanus, as being Chief of the Maunes or Spirits below: To pacify these ill Spirits, a feast was kept in Febuary with Wax Candles burning to Pluto, called Candlemas-Day, so Mr. Jes. in his Almanack, The Cretians are always liers, Titus 1.12. the greatst liars in the World that will fancy, fain, and say any thing; is it a thing possible that Wax Candles above the Earth should give Light thousand of Miles into the Earth, to pacifie those ill Spirits there? it seems they are not in any great Torment if a little Light

will pacify them. The Poets say, Hell is twice as deep as Heaven is high; the Astronomers say, Jupiter the se|cond Planet is 72 Millions of Miles above the Earth; if Hell be twice as deep, it is a hundred and fifty four Mil|lions of Miles to Hell, which is fabulous; so there Cerberus three Heads, and Charus Boat to row Men to Pluto; so the Fancy of Purgatory did spring first from the Heathen Poets, long before the coming of Christ, as appears by Plato and Virgil, who have described at large the whole Common-wealth, and all the Orders and Degrees of Pur|gatory: These with their Elysian Fields, and many other of their Barbarisms by long Use became venerable.

Your Opinion is fitter for Heathens than for Christians: If the Heathens do hold as you do, are we to believe in Religion as the Heathen? I pass not what they nor any else say, unless they can read it me in the Word of God; we cry, to the Law and to the Testimony; if they speak not according to this Word, it is because there is no light in them, Isa. 8.20. Mr. Leigh saith clear Reason proves it, God is just; many abominable Sinners enjoy more Prosperity in this Life, than those that live far more innocently, must be punished hereafter according to the Multitude and Hai|nousness of their Sins, Psal. 73.17.

Answ. I see you are more bold to affirm, than able to prove; doth Reason deny the Punishment to be just, ex|cept it never End? The Scriptures you alledge, say they have an end, and you say, they shall never have an end, that is, your clear Reason, to say some are worse than o|thers, therefore they are to suffer a Punishment never to end, so you exclude Mary Magdalen and the poor Prodigal, but it is but your bare Affirmation without Proof; your Reason is that God should shew Mercy to little Sinners, but none to the great Sinners, they must not be saved; but this your clear Reason is clear against the Will and Wisdom of God, who is pleased to save of the worst of Sinners, as appears, St. Luke 7.47. 1 Tim. 1.19. Asts 9.13. If some enjoy more Prosperity than others, must they therefore suffer a Punishment never to end? Outward Pros|perity is a great Blessing, and you make it a great Curse; if that you say were true, there is no Cause in the Day of Prosperity to rejoyce, Eccl. 7.24. nor to say, O Lord I be|seech thee send me now Prosperity, Psalm 115.25. in saying greater Sinners, you judge according to outward Appearan|ces both for Sin and Punishment, and may be mistaken in

both what they are in the inner Man; for Sin and Punish|ment you know not, the Heart of Unbelief and Rebellion of Spirit in others, nor how God punisheth them in their Spirits; Sin is punished in this Life.

Mr. Leigh saith, 'tis just they should suffer for ever, who if they had lived, would have sinned for ever, Cast them out of my sight, Jer. 5.1.

Answ. If it be just we should suffer for ever, it is just our Surety should suffer for ever.

Do you consider, that the Creature was made subject to vanity not willingly, but by reason of him that hath subjected the same in hope, Rom. 8.20.

Cast them out of my sight, is no Proof that they shall suffer for ever, but rather that they shall be utterly destroyed, for if they have any Being, wherever they be they cannot be out of Sight of God.

Your Justice is not God's his is a Death; yours is not a Death, but another thing.

Mr. Leigh, saith, God's intentions from everlasting, was to glorify his Justice as well as his Mercy, Rom. 9.21.23. fitted to Destruction.

Answ. Know you any of the Intentions of God that is not revealed in his Word, Deut. 29.29. or doth the Word say that God not glorify his Justice, unless he inflict so great a Punishment without end; you give neither Scripture nor Reason to prove that you say is just; the Justice of God was revealed and made known, in causing the Earth to swallow up Corah and his Company; they were Vessels of Wrath prepared, fitted to Destruction, (your Opinion denies the Word of God that saith they are fitted to Destruction) you say they are never to be destroyed, die nor end. Mr. Leigh saith, the Covenant under which ungenerate Men stand, and by which they are bound over to this Wrath is ever|lasting.

Answ. There is but two Covenants, Gal. 4.24. the old and new, Heb. 8.13. and 12.24. the old is no more ever|lasting than the Priesthood of it: The Breach of the Cove|nant of Works is Death, therefore not eternal Life in Mi|sery. Mr. Leigh saith, in that Torment they curse and accuse one another.

Answ. When you write again, I pray tell us how you know that in Hell they do so; for the Word of God saith not so, nor have you been there to hear it, nor they that told you so. To affirm things in Religion, not re|vealed

in the World of God, is to presume above that which is written, and contrary to 2 Cor. 4.8. Rom 15.4. Socrates an Heathen, was more wise and modest in not af|firming things he knew not, being asked what was done in Hell, said, he never went thither, nor communed with any that came from thence: Yet you and others affirm, with great Boldness and Confidence, things you know not; some say in Hell the Eye is afflicted with Darkness, where|as Darkness is no Affliction to the Eye; also they say their Ears are afflicted with horrible and hideous Outcries, their Noses with Poysons and stinking Smells, (of what I pray?) their Tongues with gaully Bitterness, the whole Body with intollerable Fire; the Damned shall prize a Drop of Water worth ten thousand Worlds; cursing shall be their Tunes, Blasphemies their Ditties, Lamentation their Songs, and Screeking their Strains; they shall lye screeking and scream|ing continually. Ye see how Men set their Brains to work to invent Lies; for all they say is without Warrant from the Word of God. One saith their Torments in Hell is so great, that they cannot forbear roaring; and you say they curse and accuse one another; so that one of their vain Imagi|nations contradict another, and all of them the Word of God; they will not deny that those in Hell are in the grea|test Trouble, and they in less Trouble cannot speak, I am so troubled I cannot speak, Ps. 17.4. therefore they cannot curse and accuse one another, as you affirm.

Mr. Leigh saith, Divines unanimously concur, &c.

Ans. If they do, it is not binding to us, for we are satis|fied they are not infallible, There must be Errors, 1 Cor. 11.9. they have the greatest Share: The Priests, Popish and Mahometan Priests, Baals Priests, and all other Sorts of Priests concur, common Consent sooner believed than na|ked Truth, it is high time to Cease from Men, for wherein is he to be accounted of? Isa. 2.22. Truth, and not Number of Men, is to be followed, Every one must give an Account of himself to God, Rom. 14.3.11.12. Luther said, he esteemed not the Worth of a Rush a Thousand Agustines and Cyprians against himself; all Churches err. Parnormitan said, more Credit is to be given to one speaking Truth, than to all Men in all Ages speaking the contrary.

They are like to concur and agree if they take the Counsel they give, as not to question Principles: It seems we must take all upon Trust, and Hearsay, without Tryal, they all say it, therefore it is true; but the Bereans wo••ld,

and did search the Scriptures, to see if Things were so as the Apostles preached, see 1 Joh. 4.1.

Let it be certainly made to appear, that God hath said in any thing contrary to any thing that I have said, I desire with all my Heart, to submit to it; without that I can|not yield the Soveraignty of my Judgment, and Con|science, to the concurring Consent of blind Guides, ignorant and erroneous Men, though in Sheeps Cloath|ing; and covered all over with the Title of Godly, learned and holy Saints or Presbyters, or Ministers of Christ; the Papists call their Church Holy Church, and their Priest Holy Priest, and their Order, Holy Order, and all Holy, if you will believe them.

Some say, the Jews report, that in Tophet, the Valley of the Son of Hinnon, there was a great Ditch which could never be filled, which they called the Mouth of Hell; and that the Chaldeans, when they slew the Israelites, threw them in there: If this Report be true which hath been brought to prove Hell, then it will follow, that the Mouth of Hell is near Jerusalem; and that God doth give to the Wicked, Power to cast his People into Hell.

How much Weight there is in your Reasons to prove a Punishment after this Life never to end, let who will Judge; I, for my Part, profess I do not see how they serve to your Purpose; your Nakedness appears, and that your Opinion hath neither Scripture nor Reason to support it and therefore it must needs fall, 2 Tim. 3.9. You have done all you can, and can come to no surer Bot|tom to rest upon, than Supposals and Imaginations, wrest|ing Scriptures, and Consent of others; your Glory is that all are of your Mind, though without good Ground or Rea|son, as is shewed. Also in that you alledge Reasons to prove Hell Torments; it giveth me Occasion to believe, in your own Judgment the Scriptures you alledge to prove it, prove it not; for if you believe the Scriptures prove it, to what Purpose serve your Reasons? Or do you think, that those that doubt of the Sufficiency of our Proof of it by Scripture, will be satisfied with your Reasons as a full Proof of it; if there be any such, they may be to them of some use.

The learned contradict themselves; Mr. Bolton saith, Thou must live in endless Woe, in Brimsbone and Fire, which thou mightest so often and easily escape, which over|throws the Doctrine of Election; also they say, the Sense

of Loss in Hell is greater than the Sense of Pain. So they make the sensible want of the Presence of God the greatest Torment in Hell, and that is in this life, I am cast out of thy Sight, Psal. 31.2. it followeth by their Doctrine, that the greatest Torment of Hell is in this Life.

Mr. Leigh saith in his Body of Divinity, the Sense of God's Wrath, Rage of Conscience, Guilt, Fear, Dispair, the Soul cannot melt with greater Torment; if so, then this is not a worse Torment in Hell than is in this Life.

Water is so scarce in Hell, that Greenhood saith, the Damned prize a Drop of Water above ten thousand Worlds; and yet they affirm those in Hell shall continually weep, &c. therefore their own Sayings agree not.

The first Author of the Opinion of the Torments of Hell never to end, was Marcion the Heretick, that held, that Christ was not a Man but in Semblance; and that there was two Beginnings, two Gods, one good, one bad; that there was Torments for some in Hell, was first invented by him; he determined the Reward of the Creature, either in Torment or Refreshment, to be laid up for them in Hell; he was the first Author thereof, by Tertulian's Confession, as saith Dr. Fulk in his Defence, Page 83, 84. see and behold the Original of your Opinion of the Torments of Hell, An evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil, Luke 6.45.